Bhramcharya

Brahmacharya as has been pointed out means more like following our highest ideal, rather than celibacy.
The separation of sexes is indeed a huge subject, and one basically related to human existence, so I’ll pass.

Yoga does not force anyone to give up something one is not ready to give up. It is like forbidding a child to play, because adults do not play silly games. No. Play !

If you enjoy sexuality, that’s allright. It is your “play” as a human being. But the fact that you have this right to play this game - what is not at all a game but hard stuff, cutting to the bone sometimes (same is true for children, because only shortsighted adults say “they are only playing”, for children playing is the most serious business), does not mean it is the game of everyone. So do your business, but do not question that states and levels of consciousness are there where the whole sexuality thing appears as mere child’s play. There are, and tolerance requires us to accept that we do not know everything. Let everyone have their games, this is the principle of ahimsa/non violence in action.

The right thing to do, rather than to judge and contempt the idea of virginity, celibacy, chastity, to accept that these are ideals what are only in the grasp of few, and most of us are still playing our human games. And these games for us are very important, a serious business. Just that they are not so serious and important for everyone. We need to be careful to not generalize our self imposed limits, and use them as constrictive powers for those who might exceed them.

Again I thought about this, and I think I might have find a way to bridge the gap between a patristic, dogmatic teaching of chastity and it’s actual practice.

Think of this: I chose to observe brahmacharya as celibacy/chastity. But regardless if it is good or bad to do this in itself, I also need to ask myself: why do I chose to do this ? Because there might be many answers. Perhaps I believe that sexuality is a sin, and I am afraid I will not go to heaven if I indulge myself in it. But what does this say about me ? That I am, first, a coward, second that I am selfish. I want to go to heaven and I try to achieve it by such practices, to my own benefit. So, it is clear, that the motive for chastity does make a big difference, because if the motives are selfishness and cowardrice, how can I honestly expect to still go to heaven ?

So what other possible reason could I find for this renunciation ?

Hear what I have come up with.

I am in love. I am in love with the Eternal Feminine. Now, I really love Her, but because I am a blind human being, I only experience Her in Her many instances, aka, women. I for long have arrived to the conclusion that a Real Man is in love with All and Any Woman. Now, I cannot help loving them. Not for sexual pleasures, no, but indeed as you love someone when you fall in love. Indeed, my ability to Love is my greatest weakness and greatest power in the same time. If in my fear of pain, I give up on this Love, I become extinct, my very existence becomes empty and grey. I do not give up. But I cannot commit to a single woman, either. How could I do that ? It is like eating always the same food. Or having a single species of flowers in my garden. So what can I do, in trying to be faithful to my true Love, but not hurt anyone ? Well, there are many possibilities. Like still chosing one woman, as a partner in the physical life. You do not cheat on your True Love, this way, especially if you are able to see her as Her, an instance of he Eternal Feminine. Does this mean you cannot love Her other instances ? No. But as a human being, under the human condition, you do what you can do. You refrain from seeking Her in other instances. You keep those platonic. But there are so many traps here … like the lure of the unknown, and the freshness of novelty. An unknown woman will always express the Eternal Feminine better. Why ? Because once you get to know a woman, you will realize that she is a human being. Human beings have faults, have karmas, weights to bear, things to adress. To live with a human being is hard. To long for an ideal, the Eternal Feminine, is easy. At this point, I question: do I sacrifice my happiness/longing for an ideal on the altar of humanity ? Is my honesty stronger than my selfish desire for happiness ? Who is the saint ? That who gives up earthly relationships for the Eternal Feminine, an aspect of God, becoming a brahmachari not through renunciation, but through inability to give up this Absolute Love, or that who gives up him/herself for the sake of the fellow man/woman ? Only God could judge that, I guess.

Casanova can be seen as a brahmacahri in progress, and monks might not be free from erotic impulses in their pursuit. Eros is neither good nor bad. It is in the motives, the honesty, the compromise or longing for truth, peace or passion, silence or burning. Tamas is good in it’s place, rajas is good in it’s place, sattwa is good in it’s place. Who are we to judge ?

[QUOTE=InnerAthlete;20152]

Gary Kraftsow of the Desikachar lineage (viniyoga) said:

‘when you are having sex, have it. When you are not, don’t.’[/QUOTE]

This is a nice one - have not heard it before! :smiley:

[QUOTE=dergham;23403]hi
" he who has completely eradicated lust and is established in mental Brahmacharya is Brahman or God himself "[/QUOTE] This is correct. [B]Mental balance is important. [/B]

It’s a parody and comes from a Taoist book " The Way of Life " by Lao Tzu. The original says something like ’ When walking, just walk. When sitting , just sit. Above all, don’t wobble.’ Personally, I feel that sex does not equal love but Love can equal sex +. i.e. to say that Jesus could have sexual intercourse and be free from lust, a satisfaction of personal desires. Some keys were meant for some locks and some doors were meant to be opened. Namaste

[QUOTE=TonyTamer;27426]It’s a parody and comes from a Taoist book " The Way of Life " by Lao Tzu. The original says something like ’ When walking, just walk. When sitting , just sit.[/QUOTE] This means to be in the Present.

Entirely correct. Truly being in the Present converges everything- including sex/love. Namaste

The simple beauty of the epigram brings many words down to essences, Like Love and do what thou will, or Love is all there is or just Love. Love thy Neighbor as thy self, Love God. It is enough for some to operate from the heart Chakra . Namaste

[QUOTE=dergham;23403]hi
they say" he who has completely eradicated lust and is established in mental Brahmacharya is Brahman or God himself "
at that level will he be still able to do sexual intercourse or not ?
please answer me if u really know or tell me where I can find the answer
thanks[/QUOTE]

I believe the answer may be found in sutra 1.16

[B]The highest form of dispassion is freedom from desire for material nature resulting from knowledge of the self.[/B]

[I]guṇa-vaitṛṣṇyam [/I]- freedom from desire for material nature. According to the Samkhya philosophy, all of material nature is ultimately composed of the three gunas, sattva, rajas, and tamas in various combinations. Here the word guna is used in the sense of referring to material nature in general.

[I]puruṣa-khyāter[/I] - resulting from knowledge of the self. Samkhya teaches that when the self has direct experience of its own true nature, it has achieved the ultimate purpose of life. Desire for material existence fades away and the soul is liberated from the cycle of birth and death in the material world.

Referring to the previous sutra, [I]puruṣa-khyāter[/I] can be interpreted as the method of achieving Vaśīkāra dispassion. Or it can be interpreted as an alternative to the method used in sutra I.15, which involves effort aimed at controlling and eliminating the passions. [I]Puruṣa-khyāter[/I] can be seen as a method of extinguishing passions through knowledge of higher things. The stages may be seen as:

[ul]
[li]The tamasic nature is overcome by rajas.
[/li][li]The rajasic nature is overcome by sattva.
[/li][li]The sattvic nature is overcome by knowledge of the self.
[/li][/ul]

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If you practice the 13 poses too much, can it make you so bored it drives you up the wall. Aka - wall yoga?

[QUOTE=Aries;27674]If you practice the 13 poses too much, can it make you so bored it drives you up the wall. Aka - wall yoga?[/QUOTE]

Ah yes, the 13 poses. We generally try to stick to the topic of discussion in each thread here, but the answer is fourfold:
[ol]
[li]It is not possible to practice the thirteen poses too much.[/li][li]There generally is a cause and effect relation between boredom and the climbing of walls, but since the thirteen poses require utmost concentration, it is unlikely that one could complete them in a state of boredom. [/li][li]Since a state of boredom is not conducive to brahmacharya, one should practice the thirteen until the climbing of walls becomes like sport.[/li][li]The practice of wall yoga can be harmful if not performed properly and should only be attempted under the guidance of an experienced guru.[/li][/ol]

Asuri,

Wow, that’s not what I expected. So, after wall yoga, is the evolution tree yoga then doga? How do we know that brahmacharya did not start with a guy falling out of a tree practicing with his dog? Not all men choose that path, some just wait for something better. Am I still off topic?

The free ebook linked below, entitled Practice of Brahmacharya by Sri Swami Sivananda, offers the
wise perspective of an accomplished yogi's long sadhana experience with brahmacharya practices.

Hari Om!

Adityananda

The following links may be of interest regarding the practice of brahmacharya as well:

http://www.atmajyoti.org/sw_brahmacharya_page.asp

http://yoga108.org/pages/show/96-brahmacharya-control-of-the-senses-or-chastity-one-of-the-ethical-precepts-of-yoga

Hari Om!

Adityananda

Since this topic apparently holds some interest for many readers, here are some links to additional articles on the subject:

http://www.yogawithamey.com/brahmacharya.html

http://www.swami-krishnananda.org/univ/univ_10.html

http://www.shininglist.com/hygiene-health/article4220.htm

The following video also presents a very thorough and beautiful summation:

Hari OM!

Adityananda

[B]ॐ अर्यमायै नमः |[/B]
[B]Om Aryamaayai Namah |[/B]

Repeat this mantra whenever sexual thoughts come to mind. Practice japa yoga using this mantra for 21 times before going to sleep to avoid wet dreams.

Hari OM!

Adityananda

[B]ॐ अर्यमायै नमः |[/B]
[B]Om Aryamaayai Namah |[/B]

Memorize and repeat this mantra whenever sexual thoughts come to mind. Practice japa yoga using this mantra for 21 times before going to sleep to avoid wet dreams.

Hari OM!

Adityananda

Sexual desire is completely natural.

  • If you don’t see it as a problem, then it simply isn’t.

Try it.

[QUOTE=dergham;23403]hi
they say" he who has completely eradicated lust and is established in mental Brahmacharya is Brahman or God himself "
at that level will he be still able to do sexual intercourse or not ?
please answer me if u really know or tell me where I can find the answer
thanks[/QUOTE]

Yes.

Walking with, or like, God.

That sounds about right.:cool:

Sex or not,if you can restrain/modify the lust-thought that originates in the mind, then you’re practicising brahmcharya.Enforced celibacy (or lack of faithfulness to your partner )might suggest this particular yama is a real struggle.

So for me it seems more true to think of it more as a mental state than anything.Purity of mind. Only God knows therefore, can judge if you are actually walking with him.External behaviour can only say so much.Obviously a clear way to achevie this ,for a man at least, is to preserve his seed or vital essence. Many spiritual traditions from Taoist to Yoga to Tantra etc all tend to say this.And in terms of conservation of energy it becomes more and more important the deeper you go in your practices.Huge reserves of energy are tapped into through observing this restraint.It does’nt matter if you don’t but the effects on just simply your health and general vitality for instance will speak for themselves. In the Taoist model the shen is turned into chi which is turned through an alchemical process through the digestive cauldron of the belly- like ice turning to water - from the belly it turns into steam and rises reaching the brain where spiritual energy is created( forget the name they call it)- this is one cycle- but the poiint being that the vital essence is recycled for non-reproductive purposes, though still bioligical.It is not wasted in sensory pleasure for instance. The indian yogis also speak of a cycle like this- sperm is relesased internally backwards into the bladder when some how it enters into the digestive system ,through absorbtion and plumbing- here it is turned into something called soma- from there through further yogic practices which aim to raise the energies upwards it reaches the brain where it is turned into ‘nectar’ which it is said then dribbles down the back of the throat. It could be the bindu chakra located at the back of the head that creates this substance. How nectar, ojas or even tejas realte i’m not entirely sure or if they are same names -perhaps someone can fill me in on their knowledge.

The trick here is to find out for [I]yourself[/I] whether this is all true or not( or mere hocus-pocus) This is next to impossible without a sadhana of sorts, i.e yoga practice.There is no running away from that.Without this, it’s likely just speculation & rumination… The spiritual knowledge found in the ancient texts or imparted by previous generations can be verified for oneself with a yoga practice.I would say a complete yoga practice if you want to get the most but that is just my opinion.Complete usually means it is more balanced in my book, addresses all the limbs etc for maximum efficient progress.

Namaste core:

With all due respect for your fine contribution to this thread, the statement quoted above is incorrect.

In Taoist alchemy (nei-tan), sexual vitality (ching) is transmuted and refined to become intrinsic energy (chi), which is further transformed and refined into pure spiritual energy (shen).

Since the transmutation of sexual vitality (ching) is the starting point in the alchemical process, and is generally associated with sperm, the regulation of sexual activity and the conservation of semen is considered imperative to achieving successful results. Such regulation in the Taoist system didn't demand total abstinence from full sexual intercourse or other sexual activities, but rather a reduction in the frequency of ejaculation, and preferably an abstinence from same.

Thus, timetables were developed through experiential research and observation to serve as guidelines regarding the appropriate frequency of ejaculations for men at various ages from puberty to senior citizen in order to avoid excessive and harmful depletion of intrinsic chi energy. in this way, a man could realistically retain strong sexual capabilities and overall physical vitality into a very advance old age.

And so, there may be snow on the roof outside, but there's still a hot fire in the furnace inside, so to speak. :cool:

Hari OM!

Adityananda

Please be careful when you praise a strict interpretation of brahmacharya.

Willem:

Required religious celibacy and voluntary yogic brahmacharya are not necessarily synonymous with one another! :-?

Hari OM!

Adityananda