Despite all that I have tried I can not free my breath

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#31

[QUOTE=Mato;21283]To those who critisize my attitude I need to defend myself and say that the amount of psychological pressure I had to put up in my teens (with the fucking panick attacks haunting me everytime I drove the car in the highway to go watch alone some crappy movie in the multiplex) and early 20s (I’m 25 now) was beyond comprehension. Nevermind if there was an actual reason for feeling the way I did, I just did. I practically lived like a hermit and a spartan too between the ages 21-24 because the pills wouldn’t work and all I could think of was that I must try and improve things and that suicide is not the answer. For those who have not been there in this nightmarish existense were you DO jog everyday and fake-smile watching the sunlight pour in your face (because that’s what a depressed person should do) and eat your macrobiotics and take your pills and do your deep breathing and your yoga and your meditation and yet still your body and mind do not respond AT ALL to all this and you have to watch your peers being happy and out there living their lifes with their friends, while you have to starve yourself and do cold showers in the middle of the winter to “man up” (because people “out there” face “real problems”(stop being a pussy Dimitri watch wrong with you? you have it all!)), with no tv, or radio, or cellphone, or magazines, just me and this fucking empty house my father rented for me next to the sea and still yet all my mind fed me was death and embarassment and guilt because I’m I’m a pussy, or a psycho or I’m not not trying enough or maybe I ate too much olive oil (one teaspoon. god I don’t have the heart to enlist all the starvation inducing things I tried in the process of “purifying my body”), so then if you haven’t been there where despite you dearest efforts for years and years you hate yourself for being embarassed (and your heart goes crazy) when you talk even to the person at the counter in the super market and you feel like god has forsaken you and the universe is just this dark and cold and empty wasteland (which it so essentialy is) then please at list don’t be bullish.

I have read about and tried more than you can imagine and sure enough maybe that has made me cynical but I am tired of all failures and dissapointments. And so this is why I came here, after finally having narrowed down what my problem seems to be, asking for a targeted solution, something closer to what jlg mentions (btw the posture thing is true my neck is very very stiff and my shoulders are rounded because in the process of trying all those things I also spent a hell of a lot of time in front of the pc (not that much anymore thought)[/QUOTE]

Sadly, I do know what you mean. I to had a terrible childhood. Tried to commit suicide when I was 15. Survived although I didn’t want to at the time. Put on a fake face so I wouldn’t be committed so I could blend in and people won’t know what is really going on inside. I had no support system at home abusive father and absent mother.

Went through the motions of life. Abused drugs and alcohol. Carried so much pain in my body.

I’m thirty eight now and only in the last few years I have started feeling whole, not saying I don’t have bad moments. I’m human. It just took that long, the birth of my daughter, reading Eckart Tolle, Dr. Wayne Dyer, practicing yoga. That is what started helping me change my life. Change my way of being and thinking. I realized I have to own it, it’s my life, my journey.

The only place I’m going with this is - your post sounds like you are aware. You are not to far gone since you asked for help. I hope you find your way. I hope you find the peace that you are looking for.

#32

[QUOTE=jlg;21637]I say when you sit in a chair your probably slipping down (lying) in the chair instead of arching your back and sticking your butt out? am I right?[/QUOTE]

Yes you are right, I’ve always had people (teachers, aunts, peers) telling me to sit up propely and not slouch. I just do not know what to do with this now. It is not easy to reverse such a problem. To make things worse, I have to spent the next 9 months servicing the Greek army which is compulsory. I avoided this for as long as I could but now I am out of time and have to show up in Sparta at August 10. Who knows it might not be a complete and total waste of time and I might learn a thing or two over there, but doing extravagant, flamboyand yoga postures is out of question.

LaLuz

I think our problems are overlapping in certain areas and thus I can sympathise but it seems to me you actually had it worse than me. I mean you had actual problems during your childhood, a sort of family drama going on that would have gotten to pretty much anyone, emotionally healthy or not. Me, I in fact had a great childhood, but it is all downwards from there. I did not have real external problems, it is just the way my body works. Which is why I have never fallen for drugs or alcohol - having a good childhood has given me some basic groundwork to draw hope from. I know what it is like to feel really, really good, I used to be like that all the time as child and I just don’t know what else to do with my life if I don’t have that feeling. Nothing else seems to be worth the effort and everything I used to enjoy has ceased being enjoyable.

#33

[QUOTE=Mato;21634] In fact my shoulders are rounded permanently…
[/QUOTE]

Why do you believe that this condition is permanent? Unless there is something wrong with your bones, my guess is that the condition could be corrected by strengthening the muscles in the back. Lat pulldowns behind the neck or pullups behind the neck, and nutrition geared toward muscle growth should do the trick. I would join a gym and talk to a personal trainer.

#34

[quote=Mato;21087] I have tried everything. Macrobiotics, meditation, medication, jogging, breathing, postures, I have tried everything I could think of to inumerable variations.
[/quote]

You could try engaging with the full spectrum of yoga practices.

Try this website http://www.aypsite.org/

They teach a full-scope system of yoga called AYP that covers highly effective and safe practices leading eventually to a complete flowering of consciousness and , for want of a better term,enlightenement.No stone is left unturned,the aim being to fully illuminate all layers of self…

This done through finding your own inner guru achevied primarily through two practices- Deep Meditation and Spinal breathinig pranayama (optimisations without any frilly superfluous nonsense added on & taken respectively from trasscendental meditation and the kriya yoga tradition- so you see you have heavyweight practices that work- i.e get results,this is science- that of self trans-morph-ation),their dynamic duo.

I offer you meat , i.e actual yoga practices, rather than just words.

Intending a stable Global awakeinng, the alleviation of the suffering of ALL of us(yuour suffering is my suffering), and Global enlightening (the fruits of a recession )

No excuses now!

Act today(read the first lesson on that site- lesson 13- found under the Main Lessons section; it explains the simple procedure utilized in the powerful practice they have opver there called Deep meditation)What are you waiting for?

Best of luck!

#35

CORE 789 -

I just glanced at the website. Looks like a good one I will go through when I have more time. Thanks for posting it!

#36

You are very welcome ,LaLuz.

I sincerely hope that link/post helps anyone else out there.I have posted that link before with the aspiration it will be as helpful to anyone else as i haas been for me.I do it because i know there are others out there suffering who deserve AYP as much anyone else.AYP is open source so you don’t need to be part of any inner sanctum to know and learn the practices.Some of these practices were hitherto secretive and protected from the public domain in years gone by becuas it was feared the modern populace could’nt handle the truth and the power.( like that saying, i think it’s the bible’ don’t throw pearls before swine’…well the fact is we are all in this together and made off the same stuff,come from the same source etc, and the sooner we ,humanity,all wake up to this,with freely and openly-shared effective spitutal practices, the quicker we will all beome collectively abit more enilghtened…take for example the kriya yoga tradition that i’d imagine may involve alittle inititation by someone deeemed to teach XYZ practice…the times they-are-a changing)

Read the lessons.They are very inspiring,written by an anoymous master…They fuel you with what in AYP they call 'bhakti '-what we need to engage in our daily sadhana,spiritual practice.

Effective spiritual practices are provided as is an effective spiritual community to provide support as and when you need it.

I can relate to the troubled feeling folk relate to in this thread, yours and mato. They may have adifferent genesis but it can be frustrating and at times a little tricky enough trying to navigate into a place of better health and more light and peace.

i’m in the same age ballpark as yourself,35 and have had certain degree of struggle and hardship in my life myself even after coming off of heroin and taking up yoga ( i make no bones about it including suicidl notions etc) so it’s good to hear that my posts are useful and getting out there. Cool!!

peace & love

#37

Asuri

I think you might be right. I will give it another shot at trying to strengthen my back. It seems to be the best thing I can do atm. I hope it works but I am skeptical. I have been lusting for that inner change for so long. The idea of being free to explore myself via meditation without all that burden in my chest is actually a very exciting prospect for me, like a trip of some sort. I feel like I am ready for this, my mind is ready for this and that makes me glad for all the hardship I had to endure. I would have never searched into this whole spiritual side of life to such an emphatic depth otherwise. I would still be stuck with the Christian Orthodox teachings I learned as a child, ie as long as I wear a cross around my neck and show up for Easter in church I’m going to “paradise”.

core789

Can you honestly say that after all this search you have found light at the other end of the tunnel? Do you nowadays feel unequivocally, no sortcomings that light in your spirit? The concept of nirvana and enlightenment is one of tremendous interest to me. I also like to bring a bit of the kabbalah ideas into my picture. But it is impossible for me to search any deeper into this as long as my spirit remains locked down into this problematic body where I can never feel relaxed and breath with contentment.

Thank you for the link, like LaLuz says, it [I]does[/I] seem interesting and I will be searching into it.

#38

Hi Mato,

No i can’t say i am enlightened yet.
But i would’nt rule out the posssiblity either.
Now i have effective tools :slight_smile:

About your muscles- it is , IMV, usually tight muscles rather than weak muscles causing most muscoluskeltal complaints.In some ways i see this then as a bit of a myth(that muscles usualy need strengthened).Muscle strength can be adress through excercise and weight-lifting,and asana. Muscle tonus can be altered throuogh we-wiring , or making a series of subtle changes in the nervous system, like evrything ,over time- pranayama & meditation- stilling relaxed practices are useful in this regard,and can be combined with gentle asana, once shifts start occuring.

The origin of tight muscles is found in brain-level programming- i.e the nervous system or the sensory-motor cortex, to be precise. Took me a few years to arrive at this conclusion.

Now Most things in life of value come about usually not without self-effort (and attached timescales) - rising to your profession, building a family, saving for a hooliday, quittiing smack/opiates/methadone ( took me ten years). It is only when you sort out your priorities and aspirations , YOU,that you can start getting anywhere.

I never said i was enlightenend
Though i’ve got a rough idea what that is like, and experienced glimpses about 3 years ago… hence my interest…

But it is impossible for me to search any deeper into this as long as my spirit remains locked down into this problematic body where I can never feel relaxed and breath with contentment.
The body/mind /spirit matirx is all connected.

Try ‘deep meditation’- it reveal this truth indeed quite well. as i say i’m getting good results from it and i am very happy with my progress and the tools&support base(i.e webssite) i’m using.Now God does’nt like a quitter does he? Life is a gift so we make the most of it. I’ve only just rolled my sleeves out.Some folk have studied yoga for decades & closely with spiritual masters. I am grateful for every oppoortunity i get and for all those who continue to inspire and deepen my appreciation of yoga, it’s vastness and it’s unlimited potential. Did sivananda or yogananda or osho got disheartened?- probably but it also probably never lasted forever…

Again it boils down to having effective tools for the job.As i say AYP is an effective toolbox if you give it a chance.The rest is your own bhakti,desire,hunger for liberation through daily practice.

If you like scientifc explanations or answers ,not pseudo religious ones, to some of your own practice issues and the neural-spiritual processes involved in self-transformation ,then read those lesssons and they may resonate with you and inspire.Real wisdom is acquired through experience. That is why just ideas like kaballah wisdom won’t be enough. In AYP it’s called self-inquiry- that is their branch of jnana yoga( the one ramakrishna practised) But on it’s own it is liable to be mere fanciful metaphysical indulgence for some and confusing or a conceptual head-ache formany others.That is why AYP emphasises an integrated whole practice that adresses the interconnectedness of all the limbs and all the branches, disciplines and whatever mystical outlook you wwish to subscribe to.Then we have vastly more effective sadhana- practice. Yoga is about the science of cause and effect, although Hindus call it karma( which is the same more or less, a good descrription-‘you sow what you reap’, you define yourself by your actions,that is why stillness is good,and stillness in action and action in stillness,dynamic stillness,- acheviable through Deep Meditaiton-one intitates a vibration through a silent mantra w-this ha the effect of lodging impurites and loosening and releasing< karmic>obstructions found deep within the nervous system)

I am not enlightened. But i have some prior experience.I’ve just had to kind of start again,though i don’t see it this way,as there is no destination and it is all growth potential anyway.

I like the light , i know it’s good and i want it,especially a whole lot more of it.

#39

I don’t want to Hijack Mato’s thread but I want to say to Core that I am always amazed at Yoga’s ability to make me feel balanced, whole, quites my mind and helps me think better among many other things. I have been practicing for a year and although I didn’t feel the results with the first class , it took a little time. I feel it has helped me tremendously and when I tell my friends they just look at me with a blank stare. I love that this forum exists.

#40

[QUOTE=Mato;21730]Asuri

I think you might be right. I will give it another shot at trying to strengthen my back. It seems to be the best thing I can do atm. I hope it works but I am skeptical. I have been lusting for that inner change for so long. The idea of being free to explore myself via meditation without all that burden in my chest is actually a very exciting prospect for me, like a trip of some sort. I feel like I am ready for this, my mind is ready for this and that makes me glad for all the hardship I had to endure. I would have never searched into this whole spiritual side of life to such an emphatic depth otherwise. I would still be stuck with the Christian Orthodox teachings I learned as a child, ie as long as I wear a cross around my neck and show up for Easter in church I’m going to “paradise”.

[/QUOTE]

Skepticism is good, because there’s a lot of b.s. out there. I’m not inclined to discuss your internal struggles. But the teaching of Buddhism comes to mind, that a human life is a precious opportunity and not to be wasted. Life is a marathon, not a sprint. I’m afraid you have many more years of hardship to look forward to. I say this not to discourage you but to encourage you to toughen up. Because unless you want to spend it in an ashram, your life is going to be tough. Everybody’s life is tough. There is no need to impose hardship on yourself, because there’s plenty imposed from the outside. To a large extent our character is determined by how we deal with adversity in life. Overcoming it is good, shrinking from it is bad.

Nourish your body, don’t starve it. No amount of meditation is going to improve your posture, unless your meditation consists of a determined effort over a long period of time to build the muscle strength that good posture requires.

#41

Feeling flat and empty.

Does anybody have any advice or ideas to share? I don’t even feel that bad or depressed anymore, just empty. I can sense there’s an underlying current of energy going through my body but somehow it misses my chest. I should add that the very few, spontaneous times I do feel more vibrantly, aromas seem more intoxocating and everything seems to spark long lost memories from my childhood. But I don’t know why or how these moments happen to me.

In the past yoga sessions have been effective on and off. Sometimes I do feel more sensitive but others it feels as if there is a solid, painful, impenetretable piece of glass in my chest and throat that encapsules everything. Any ideas?

#42

Many people have kindly added their ‘2 cents’ to your post, and it seems for good reason - many of us can identify with what you are going through. Being of mediterranean descent myself, I can certainly understand the sort of emotional conflicts you describe. Maybe it’s the food, but we can be very passionate about life. You mentioned you were passionate as a teenager, but somehow lost that. From what I read in your posts, the passion is still there but internalized. The conflict continues buried inside your mind creating the ‘fight or flight’ symtoms of shallow breath and anxiety. To top it off, you have made the decision to resolve the conflict without the help of others.

One of my favourite pop-culture authors on human behaviour is Edward De Bono who wrote a book in the 1990’s called ‘The Happiness Purpose’. In it he explains that we are all composed of exo and endo systems, and it’s the balancing of these 2 that determines our ‘happiness factor’. From your posts it seems that you are stuck in an endo-system that overpowers your exo-system. In other words, you don’t have enough outside of yourself to create balance and relieve conflict. Several of repondents alluded to finding voluteer work etc.

Yoga is but one of the tools you can use to keep you focused in your mind and body as you look at resolving your conflict.

Good luck, and I hope you find some inner peace.

#43

[QUOTE=Mato;24453]Feeling flat and empty.

Does anybody have any advice or ideas to share? I don’t even feel that bad or depressed anymore, just empty. I can sense there’s an underlying current of energy going through my body but somehow it misses my chest. I should add that the very few, spontaneous times I do feel more vibrantly, aromas seem more intoxocating and everything seems to spark long lost memories from my childhood. But I don’t know why or how these moments happen to me.

In the past yoga sessions have been effective on and off. Sometimes I do feel more sensitive but others it feels as if there is a solid, painful, impenetretable piece of glass in my chest and throat that encapsules everything. Any ideas?[/QUOTE]
from my experience.
all of my previous experiences have passed.
many experiences that I thought would never end, did, even emptiness.
spend time with friends and families
if emptiness arises, it is ok, if we attach to it,ok, however that seems to keep it around longer. during one experience energy seemed to avoid that location for you, ok
my best to you
brother Neil

#44

So, Mato, here’s a possibility that hasn’t been offered yet. It’s a bit close to home; feel free to not post back about it, even if it works.
Something inside you needs to cry, and what you are experiencing (tightness, painful glass in chest and throat) is what you are doing to keep from crying.
Find somewhere safe and calm, and discover if this is what is going on.
Remember, feelings like this – it’s not their job to be rational. There doesn’t need to be a reason, there especially does not need to be a reason you accept. You just need to survive them and let them pass when they are done.
A thorough sob-fest might free your breath, and put you in a place where you can figure out how to keep from needing one again in the near future.

Good luck, friend.

#45

Mato, when you say you have tried everything have you been to a physician? Specifically have you spoken to him/her about feeling empty?

Do you feel empty all the time? Is there a time or is there something you do when you don’t feel empty?

Is there something that brings you joy? or peace?

#46

maybe “you” cannot free the breath, maybe God can

#47

If you want that your breathe should not break while doing yoga,you should try to concentrate on the things which you are doing.Every morning try to make some spiritual sounds like OM or like Honey bee for 1 minute without breaking it.Try it 5 time daily whenever you are free.It will help you further.

#48

I am the same way Dmitri, if it makes you feel any better!

#49

Hello everyone, first post here. I am Dimitri from Greece, 25, graphic designer.

Like the thread title hints, I have this problem. I am quite anxiety and depression prone and for about 5 years now I have dedicated a massive amount of energy and time trying to improve the situation while avoiding self-destruction as best as I could. I have tried everything. Macrobiotics, meditation, medication, jogging, breathing, postures, I have tried everything I could think of to inumerable variations.

#50

so, you cannot free the breath, ever? labels are funny sometimes. lets say someone smokes cigarettes, then they call themselves a smoker, and maybe attach to that label. However, most people spend much more time not smoking. So the majority of the time they are non smokers. so is it more accurate to say, I smoke sometimes? is it more accurate to say, sometimes I do not free the breath, sometimes I do.
my best to you
with love
brother Neil