Dear anandji
Thanks for sharing your knowledge and the preparatory practice. Indeed when we sit in stillness and empty ourselves, the prana shakti is more evident than under normal conditions. Prana and consciousness or atman are non-different…so one can get to atman via the prana.
I have some questions regarding the meditation approach of your tradition, i hope you will answer after i pose them in a followup post.
Best,
Dwai
[QUOTE=Anand Kulkarni;56589]Hello Dear Friend:
Siddha Mahayoga is not about [B]using[/B] our breath. It is about first being one with the flow of Mother Air i.e Prana, automatically entering and leaving the body.[/quote]
Okay. This is going to be about as difficult to understand as it was to understand why in Algebra II the point was no longer on the graph because it flipped over into the Des Cartes Map. But no worries, my dear yoga friend has been trying to explain this to me for two years now. But I have another guess then: Is prana about when Sati gave her life force back to her father because he disapproved of her marriage?
[QUOTE=Surya Deva;56614]I must warn against any person who teaches you an automatic method. Anybody says do this and then the universe, the cosmic energy, god will do the rest are basically telling you to be spiritually lazy. Like anything in life, if you want something, you got to work for it.[/QUOTE]
Dear friend:
The path of Yoga always involves a series merging of the lower principle into the higher one.
Supposing you want to go from city A to city B. The “doing” part is (a) deciding to go; (b) buying the tickets; © going to the station or airport and © getting into the vehicle and sitting on the designated seat.
Thereafter, the “doing” part ends. The vehicle takes you to the destination. In Siddha Mahayoga, [I]prana-shakti[/I] is the vehicle. The “doing” part ends when mind merges with [I]prana-shakti[/I].
Please note, I am not teaching anything here. I am sharing a simple technique which one may try out and see if such a merger actually takes place.
Regards, Anand
[QUOTE=Surya Deva;56615]Then you are using the wrong findings. Energy is not the same as prana, let alone maha prana. I am tired of this new-age cliche everything is energy. No, energy is electromagnetic radiation and is either a wave or a particle and obeys physical laws. We have discovered something a lot more fundamental than energy: known as the quantum field. And the quantum fiels is something that is not physically definable. This is why we have to model it as a mathematical function known as a wavefunction. It is spread everywhere in the universe and exists in a single state. This is what the Yogic prana refers to.
The prana’s operate in the akasha, which is the Yogic term for what we know today to be the quantum field. So say that, say that matter cannot exist without the support of the quantum field. To say matter cannot exist without energy is basically showing ignorance that energy is also a form of matter.[/QUOTE]
All the aspects of knowledge described in your response are empirical in nature. The bandwidth of the five senses available to us is severely limited. Extrapolating this limited knowledge into a domain which belongs to higher consciousness will always lead to never ending discussions.
regards, anand
In Siddha Mahayoga, prana-shakti is the vehicle. The “doing” part ends when mind merges with prana-shakti.
And do you really thinking by doing one magic bullet technique this goal of getting the mind to merge into prana shakti will happen? If that was true, don’t you think everybody reading your article, learning the technique would have got enlightened by now? This is why I warned the reader against people like yourself who teach automatic Yoga. No, my friend, there is no magic bullet technique that someone can do and reach enlightenment. You have to work hard for it, put in a lot of effort as Patanjali himself says. Don’t try to pull the wool over our eyes. We know if you want anything in life you got to work hard for it - the same goes for enlightenment. Buddha spent 10 years of his life doing sadhana. The Risis are said to spent hundreds to thousands of years doing sadhana.
I think your article was more of an advertisement for the cult you are a member of: Mahasiddha Yoga. I read quite a lot about what happens in Siddha Yoga and what has happened in Siddha Yoga. Yep, they do indeed teach automatic yoga.
All the aspects of knowledge described in your response are empirical in nature.
I had to laugh there. You just cited Einstein, which is empirical. It is based on the classical physical view of the world. I told you, instead about the quantum field, which on the contrary cannot be empirically measured. Energy can be measured, we measure it all the time. Prana on the other hand cannot be measured. If prana could be measured we would have know about it ages ago.
Interesting thoughts. A lot of things make sense, tho’ not necessarily delve into some significant details about the nature of specific kinds of mind.
Whilst I sympathize with a lot of things you present, they remain as hypotheses. You use ‘one,’ which is a very objective attribution when it comes to spiritual practice. I acknowledge that each person has its own way of attaining spiritual awareness. And not all people have the same potential for that. Some people suffer from massive vritti activity, which hinders them to notice even a slight little bit of spirituality in any possible lifetime. Whilst, some people have the raw potential, and when they sit and close their eyes, they really immediately enter into pranic state. And for some, it may take longer than that.
Thus I ought to agree with Surya and also Austrian composer Arnold Schoenberg: there is no talent; there is hard work.
And logically, I tend to believe that people who has the raw talent in them benefit from their past life accumulations. But even still, in order to prompt the raw talent, hard work and diligence is necessary. Whatsoever you undertake, hard work, persistance and patience are always the gateway to true achievement - for me this means that a lasting achievement + existential satisfaction.
[QUOTE=Surya Deva;56679]And do you really thinking by doing one magic bullet technique this goal of getting the mind to merge into prana shakti will happen? If that was true, don’t you think everybody reading your article, learning the technique would have got enlightened by now? This is why I warned the reader against people like yourself who teach automatic Yoga. No, my friend, there is no magic bullet technique that someone can do and reach enlightenment. You have to work hard for it, put in a lot of effort as Patanjali himself says. Don’t try to pull the wool over our eyes. We know if you want anything in life you got to work hard for it - the same goes for enlightenment. Buddha spent 10 years of his life doing sadhana. The Risis are said to spent hundreds to thousands of years doing sadhana.
I think your article was more of an advertisement for the cult you are a member of: Mahasiddha Yoga. I read quite a lot about what happens in Siddha Yoga and what has happened in Siddha Yoga. Yep, they do indeed teach automatic yoga.
I had to laugh there. You just cited Einstein, which is empirical. It is based on the classical physical view of the world. I told you, instead about the quantum field, which on the contrary cannot be empirically measured. Energy can be measured, we measure it all the time. Prana on the other hand cannot be measured. If prana could be measured we would have know about it ages ago.[/QUOTE]
Dear Friend:
I am not a member of any cult, although I do have a Guru who has emphasised that eventually, prana is the real guru. This would happen only if mind / ego is offered to prana. The inner yogic processes start only after this.
There is no magic bullet here. The experiences from following the simple mahayoga technique vary from person to person, depending upon the spiritual state of the aspirant. It starts a process of thinning out of [I]Samskaras[/I], eventually leading to attainment of the highest goal of human life.
I do not think it is proper or mature for anyone to laugh at someone in a forum like this, even if that person is “wrong” or is not familiar with quantum physics. As for me I am not familiar with a thousand other things. All I said was extrapolating may lead to endless discussions. It is important to try out and if experience is positive, continue with studious open-minded inquiry.
I have not said that Prana can be measured. What mahayoga proposes is shifting the consciousness temporarily into Prana.
Empirical science relies on establishing facts after repeated experiences. We believed 2+2= 4 only after repeatedly observing the same. So there is no harm if someone is willing to try out the simple practice. In fact “warning” people to not try this out would be agnostic.
Regards, anand
[QUOTE=Surya Deva;56679]And do you really thinking by doing one magic bullet technique this goal of getting the mind to merge into prana shakti will happen? If that was true, don’t you think everybody reading your article, learning the technique would have got enlightened by now? This is why I warned the reader against people like yourself who teach automatic Yoga. No, my friend, there is no magic bullet technique that someone can do and reach enlightenment. You have to work hard for it, put in a lot of effort as Patanjali himself says. Don’t try to pull the wool over our eyes. We know if you want anything in life you got to work hard for it - the same goes for enlightenment. Buddha spent 10 years of his life doing sadhana. The Risis are said to spent hundreds to thousands of years doing sadhana.
I think your article was more of an advertisement for the cult you are a member of: Mahasiddha Yoga. I read quite a lot about what happens in Siddha Yoga and what has happened in Siddha Yoga. Yep, they do indeed teach automatic yoga.
I had to laugh there. You just cited Einstein, which is empirical. It is based on the classical physical view of the world. I told you, instead about the quantum field, which on the contrary cannot be empirically measured. Energy can be measured, we measure it all the time. Prana on the other hand cannot be measured. If prana could be measured we would have know about it ages ago.[/QUOTE]
Hello there I’m Mohan.i just want to tell u a very simple idea ,just hold ur nos e(breath) for some time observe for a while and u ll reach the stage where u cannot leave without breath(air) at that time u observe the change in u for a fraction of second u don want mind and body u just want to take the breath for u to b alive.tat means the air(breathing) s necessary and the basis for ur body and mind .when u hold ur breath the scientific thoughts tat u r talking about has no value just u require breath at tat time to b alive.so v respect breath as (mother energy) by whose presence body and mind become active .from the above discussions u find tat the mind s always attached to body conciuosness. in accordance to yoga science both the body and mind is subtly connected by prana which s the gross manifested as breath .so stop walking in the matrix of intellectual discussions for which mind s the basis and for mind and body prana (breath) s the basis .So mahayoga s a scientific procedure to connect the mind which s at the body conciuosness level to the universal prana level.i think u r just enjoying the scientific thoughts tat u r accumulated inside ur mind and bothered about wat many others are saying about mahayoga just go beyond mind and intellect [2]i accept tat ur idea tat no one reach moksha witout effort.in mahayoga also no one ll get moksha just surrendering to supreme mother power at once u have to work hard to surrender also just try wheter it s easy for u to surrender firstly ur ego ll appear don think tat surrendering s easy.u can do any type of yoga from ur will without difficulty. just while surrendering u com to know u should give up both ur body and mind for the ultimate…
[QUOTE=Anand Kulkarni;54302][B]Siddha Mahayoga: A Simple Yoga Path of Offering Mind to Prana[/B]
In the end, Knowledge, Peace and Freedom are the residue of what Man really yearns for. Even Happiness as a goal gives way to Peace, since truthfully speaking, the former is contained in the latter.
Albert Einstein, one of the greatest scientists of modern times gifted us with an eye-opening finding that matter and energy are inter-convertible. It goes to prove that the Universe is in fact a complex devolution of a singular form of Energy, who would be Mother to all her devolved states.
Yogis have asserted this truth since ancient times and has called this Mother Energy [I][B]Maha Prana Shakti[/B][/I]. Her myriad and complex states of vibration are but Her children. It is these children, or in other words, Her states of vibration, who are variously reflected in the Individualized Consciousness that each one of us represents.
Mother Energy, coupled with Universal Consciousness is that undifferentiated state called [I][B]Anant Narayana[/B][/I], the supporter of Infinite. It is this Anant, or Infinite who asserts:
?I am Moment, I am Time, I am Day and also Night.?
?I am Fortnight, Month, Year and also all the Ages.?
?I am Creator, Caretaker and also Destroyer of All.?
?Millions of Suns, Moons and the Stars, all those are Me.?
?Hell and heaven are Me Alone.?
?On this earth, I am the Seven Oceans, the Mountains, the Rivers.?
?Each and every Tree is Me, as also all Heavenly Constellations.?
?I am Direction, I am Soil; each and every Atom is Me.?
Each one of us then, is a child of the same Mother Prana. Intuitively realizing this fact is the beginning of one?s journey towards attaining real knowledge, which is experiencing the reality of the Universe.
[I][B]Kundalini Shakti[/B][/I] is the name of this Mother Prana or life force within us, depicted as a two-headed serpent. One head represents our ordinary life resigned to living it out as ordained by our past karma. The other head ?sleeps? at the opening of our channel of spiritual enlightenment. Hence ordinarily, all of us are spiritually asleep, but have the potential to transform our existence from inharmonious to harmonious; from imperfect to perfect and thus in other words, from ordinary to divine if this sleeping head awakens.
There are various ways of awakening one?s dormant Kundalini. Swami Satyanand Saraswati of The Bihar School of Yoga mentions many ways, such as by Mantra, or by Tapasya i.e. the practice of austerities, or through the use of specific herbs, or by following Raja Yoga, or by Pranayama, or by Kriya Yoga, or by Tantric Initiation, or by self-surrender. Needless to say, all these methods have to be practiced under an adept Guru.
He also mentions a way known as [I][B]Shaktipaat[/B][/I], in which the awakening is performed by the Guru, by virtue of his being at a spiritually higher potential. Shaktipaat or Kundalini awakening is effected by the Guru having authorization to do so in such a lineage or tradition.
He authenticates thus: ?This Shaktipaat can be conducted in the physical presence, or from a distance. It can be transmitted by touch, by a handkerchief, a mala, a flower, a fruit or anything edible, depending upon the system the Guru has mastered. It can even be transmitted by letter, telegram, or telephone.?
Spiritual Awakening or Kundalini Awakening essentially is possible only when the mind becomes subservient to the primal energy referred to above. All the above mentioned methods involve doing something. This doer-ship means functioning through the mind and ego, the very elements which need to become subservient to another higher aspect within us. Needless to say, few can overcome this paradoxical situation.
Experiencing Prana is the first step one must take to believe and take to this. The Introductory Practice of [I][B]Siddha Mahayoga*[/B][/I], the ancient yoga way, demonstrates that such an experience is easily possible. The prime fact to appreciate is that one?s automatic breathing in reality is verily the movement of Mother Prana.
Hence, if for a few minutes every day, one lets go, or offers, or surrenders one?s body and mind to Mother Prana, then soon, the mind gets accustomed to merging with Prana for some time, leading to inner peace.
The wisest have declared that all attempts to control the mind in order to ?achieve? peace are fruitless. Ego always gets in the way. The only way is to lead the mind into the lap of its mother, where it rests assured.
Anyone can be easily experience this by trying for a few days the simple practice devised by Mahayoga Spiritual Master H.H. Narayan kaka Dhekane Maharaj, which is outlined below:
[ul]
[li]1. Sit in any comfortable position, without supporting the back and relax the body as much as possible.
[/li][li]2. If we close the eyes calmly and with deep devotion to Prana Shakti, we all can experience that Prana Shakti rises up and up through the backbone. Where will She rise? Right up to the top of the head. However, it is fruitless to just read. [B]Please! Close the eyes and experience for yourself.[/B]
[/li][li]3. Now that Prana Shakti has risen up, the next part of Mahayoga is to offer the mind to the AUTOMATIC movement of Prana i.e. AUTOMATIC breathing. First, let AUTOMATIC BREATHING TAKE PLACE. This is very important. DO NOT IMPOSE ANY TYPE OF BREATHING. Then, simply follow the INCOMING AND OUTGOING AIR. This is the way of offering the mind to the automatic breathing i.e. to Prana Shakti and is the most important part of Siddha Mahayoga. [B]Again, please actually try this and experience it personally. Let [I]Prana Shakti do the breathing[/I] [I]or cause any other movements for three to twenty one minutes.[/I][/B]
[/li][/ul]
At the ordinary level of awareness, i.e. because our consciousness has entered and stayed in the domain of body and mind, we operate only with the limited apparatus of the physical sense organs. Due to imperfect actions, born of inadequate knowledge that the sense organs can afford us, the soul gets endlessly enmeshed in Give and Take or Action and Reaction networks with the rest of the Prana-Consciousness Matrix, since Universal Pranic Energy balance must forever be maintained.
When mind rests in the lap of Mother Prana, all ego-driven activities give way to ego-free movements of Prana. These actions or yoga-kriyas are in fact, yogic culminations of deep rooted desires, slowly leading to total disentanglement from all give and take, which paves the way for Absolute Knowledge by experiencing one?s true self.
Most importantly, yogis have always held this disentanglement from all give and take, as the highest attainable freedom, also known as Moksha, which represents freedom from the necessity of incarnating physically.
Thus unfettered, one may freely roam the Universe.
Presented by: Anand Kulkarni, Pune, India. Siddha Mahayoga aspirant, initiated in the Loknath Tirth Tradition
hi sir I’m Mohan im also initiated to mahayoga by kaka maharaj thank u for ur valuable information…
[QUOTE=mahayogi;58247]Hello there I’m Mohan.i just want to tell u a very simple idea ,just hold ur nos e(breath) for some time observe for a while and u ll reach the stage where u cannot leave without breath(air) at that time u observe the change in u for a fraction of second u don want mind and body u just want to take the breath for u to b alive.tat means the air(breathing) s necessary and the basis for ur body and mind .when u hold ur breath the scientific thoughts tat u r talking about has no value just u require breath at tat time to b alive.so v respect breath as (mother energy) by whose presence body and mind become active .from the above discussions u find tat the mind s always attached to body conciuosness. in accordance to yoga science both the body and mind is subtly connected by prana which s the gross manifested as breath .so stop walking in the matrix of intellectual discussions for which mind s the basis and for mind and body prana (breath) s the basis .So mahayoga s a scientific procedure to connect the mind which s at the body conciuosness level to the universal prana level.i think u r just enjoying the scientific thoughts tat u r accumulated inside ur mind and bothered about wat many others are saying about mahayoga just go beyond mind and intellect [2]i accept tat ur idea tat no one reach moksha witout effort.in mahayoga also no one ll get moksha just surrendering to supreme mother power at once u have to work hard to surrender also just try wheter it s easy for u to surrender firstly ur ego ll appear don think tat surrendering s easy.u can do any type of yoga from ur will without difficulty. just while surrendering u com to know u should give up both ur body and mind for the ultimate…:p[/QUOTE]
Hello Mohan:
You have rightly pointed out that in no yoga path, the ultimate attainment is immediate. However, in other yoga paths, the awakening of inner consciousness known as kundalini shakti as per hatha yoga nomenclature is a long and arduous way, with a grave possibility of not crossing the ego barrier.
In Mahayoga, the beginning point itself is the awakened inner consciousness due to the mind being “offered” to prana, the universal living constituent. The word offered is used by me as many people are averse to the word “surrender”. However, once one understands that one’s lower self is surrendering to one’s own higher self, one feels at ease!
As yoga aspirants, we must also understand the other person’s standpoint.
Regards,
Anand Kulkarni
[QUOTE=Surya Deva;56614]I must warn against any person who teaches you an automatic method. Anybody says do this and then the universe, the cosmic energy, god will do the rest are basically telling you to be spiritually lazy. Like anything in life, if you want something, you got to work for it.[/QUOTE]
Even Patanjali’s Yoga philosophy, which is mostly based on Sankhya philosophy (in which there is no place for God), has an aphorism “Ishwara-pranidhanadwa”.
[QUOTE=Surya Deva;56615]Then you are using the wrong findings. Energy is not the same as prana, let alone maha prana. I am tired of this new-age cliche everything is energy. No, energy is electromagnetic radiation and is either a wave or a particle and obeys physical laws. We have discovered something a lot more fundamental than energy: known as the quantum field. And the quantum fiels is something that is not physically definable. This is why we have to model it as a mathematical function known as a wavefunction. It is spread everywhere in the universe and exists in a single state. This is what the Yogic prana refers to.
The prana’s operate in the akasha, which is the Yogic term for what we know today to be the quantum field. So say that, say that matter cannot exist without the support of the quantum field. To say matter cannot exist without energy is basically showing ignorance that energy is also a form of matter.[/QUOTE]
Energy is not electromagnetic radiation. Energy is the ability of a system to do work on another. The energy that’s transferred from one system to another can manifest itself as electromagnetic radiation.
[QUOTE=Nietzsche;59172]Energy is not electromagnetic radiation. Energy is the ability of a system to do work on another. The energy that’s transferred from one system to another can manifest itself as electromagnetic radiation.[/QUOTE]
Let’s say then Prana literally means the life-principle, whereas the word “prakriti” would encompass the term energy in a way that we are accustomed to ??
regards, anand
I am sure that exploring the journey from peace to experiencing reality to freedom through Mahayoga sounds truly enlightening. On a different note, I've often wondered why is Spirit Airlines so cheap? It's fascinating to see how different fields of interest can intersect in conversations, highlighting the diversity of topics within discussions. This thread is a reminder of how our curiosity can lead us on various paths of discovery.