Kundalini Meditation?

Mindfulness Meditation
#4

[QUOTE=AmirMourad;56462]“Is meditation only the stillness/clearance of the mind during meditation?”

Meditation has very little to do with such a thing as emptying the mind of content, and those who have seen it in this light have misunderstood the whole spirit of meditation. Because where there is a meditative consciousness, then whether there is activity of the mind or no activity of the mind, it makes no difference. A meditative consciousness requires one to remain a witness in the present without becoming identified as to whatever arises in ones experience from moment to moment. The moment one starts clinging, whether it is a thought, an emotion, a sight, a sound, just about anything at all - then one loses all clarity of vision. One has become prejudiced, one has lost that quality of remaining a witnessing awareness. A witnessing awareness requires one to remain aware without attraction or aversion, neither liking or disliking whatever arises on the scene of ones experience. That can be done anywhere, in any posture, you need not be sitting for meditation. Whether sitting, standing, lying down, walking, speaking or not speaking, the stream of awareness continues. If one is to truly integrate meditation into daily living, then what is needed is not just to sit and practice for an hour or two. After sitting meditation, ones meditation continues. One Zen master, master Hakuin, has said a statement which is of enormous importance. He has said that meditation in activity far surpasses meditation in stillness. Because while you are sitting still, everything is convenient, there are less sources of disturbance. When involved in activity in the world - you can become disturbed by any number of things, the possibility of becoming entangled is tremendous. There are those who, in sitting meditation, can enter into deep states of samadhi, but once they are involved in the world they loose that quality of remaining in a meditative awareness, they quickly fall back into their ordinary patterns, ones peace is very fragile. At any moment it can come crashing down.

Sitting meditation is important, it settles a certain foundation so that once you are out of your sitting meditation - the stream of witnessing continues regardless of ones activity.[/QUOTE]

Murmur through the crowd . . . then . . . mild golf clap

#5

@makar

I would place Kundalini practice in the category of dhyana, which means that before attempting it, you should master asana, pranayama, pratyahara, and dharana, and don’t forget yama and niyama. If you don’t know what these things are, you should become familiar with the eight limbs of yoga, as taught in Patanjali’s Yoga Sutras.

How do you still your mind?

The short answer is, asana, pranayama, yama, and niyama. If you want more details, I suggest you read this article, by Swami Rama

#6

[QUOTE=makar;56395]? For some reason when I meditate,it seems breathing doesn’t happen automatically for me? I have to consciously inhale and exhale.[/QUOTE]When you go deeper breathing automatically decreases.
[B]1.34 The mind is also calmed by regulating the breath, particularly attending to exhalation and the natural stilling of breath that comes from such practice.
(prachchhardana vidharanabhyam va pranayama)
[/B]

#7

[QUOTE=Asuri;56591]@makar
I would place Kundalini practice in the category of dhyana, which means that before attempting it,…[/QUOTE]Kundalini awakening is spontaneous happening.
[B]" You just become, like a flower becomes the fruit. It’s all built in within you. Allow it to work out." [/B]

#8

Seeker,

It seems that there is not even a single word that can be said which is not of the vast graveyard of dead knowledge you have collected into your mind. Hiding one’s ignorance behind quotations, these borrowed voices have been hypnotzing one for far too long.

#9

Words can be deceiving. Get connected and you will get Atma Gnyan.

#10

In the initial stage, we tend to take everything said and written about meditation rather naively, without fully appreciating the dimension of practice. It has several implications that never appear on one’s radar.

It is rigorous. It takes a lot of time. It takes absorption and change.

Today, we have developed a “pill” culture of instant relief. Our attention is attuned to “channel surfing”. Our thinking is anesthesized by media, where we see a death ‘without pain’ and achievement ‘without efforts’.

To meditate is ‘to remain in the awareness of’. Its pre-requisite is to concentrate, that is ‘to bring one’s attention to one thing and hold it there’. Before going for the subtle things like breathing and tall order things like kundalini, one can start learning concentration and meditation on the ‘objects’. Generally, sitting in a quiet place, having things like a candle as an object will be a good start. The developing abilities can also be tested on other objects, at home, at work.

Before turning within, one should take care of all the obstacles that hinder in the inner space dominated by the mind. Yama, Niyama, asana and pranayama are designed to do that. After achieving fair success in this in the form of pratyahara, one shoul try concentration on mental images, a state called ‘dharana’. Be ready for a battle and end-less failures. Mind is not a docile animal. If you have given it a free reign for so many years, don’ expect to tame it in a few days. When you can hold dharana fairly steady, meditation can begin. Meditation is for those who are here for a long haul.

#11

You can’t do meditation. You need to be in meditation.
You are outside OR inside the house.
[B]Kundalini awakes the Atma within us, then Laya process take place. [/B]

#12

Seeker,

Just a single word, and countless corpses are flushed out. Entertaining oneself with left-over scraps, one’s true voice is not to be seen anywhere.

#13

[QUOTE=makar;56395]? For some reason when I meditate,it seems breathing doesn’t happen automatically for me? I have to consciously inhale and exhale.What should I do to free my mind from breathing and that I remain unconscious of my breathing like it is during other activities throughout the day??

Is it that the meditation done for Kundalini is different from normal meditation? Or the meditation is same for whatever purpose it is done?

Is meditation only the stillness/clearance of the mind during meditation? Or it has something more to it? I don’t mean the benefits of meditation but with what goes on during meditation.

How do you still your mind? You might be following a certain approach/technique for this? When I clear my mind of any thoughts,I still think that ok I have cleared my mind now.How do I deal with this? There should be nothing going on in my mind during meditation,right? How do you do this?[/QUOTE]

[B][I]“Dhyanam Nirvishayam Manaha”[/I][/B] is the sanskrit definition of meditation. It means, when the mind is free from the objects of the senses, meditation occurs.

Regards
Anand

#14

Anand,

“Dhyanam Nirvishayam Manaha” is the sanskrit definition of meditation. It means, when the mind is free from the objects of the senses, meditation occurs."

It may be the case for one who is seeking an escape from the mind and the senses. Otherwise, for one who has integrated a meditative consciousness - whether hearing, smelling, seeing, tasting, touching, sitting down silently or involved in a storm of action - the stream of meditation continues. Meditation does not mean an escape from the senses, it simply means to be capable of remaining a witness from moment to moment without identifying with whatsoever may arise in your experience. Even if a million and one thoughts pass by the scene of the mind - one can remain an observer, seeing without judgment. That can be done anywhere, one need not go into a deep samadhi for it - although the same approach will take you into a deep samadhi. That is why one Zen master Hakuin has said, that meditation in activity far surpasses meditation in stillness. Because while you are involved in activity - you can become disturbed by any number of things. The possibility of entanglement is enormous. If you can remain centered and grounded even while involved in the world, then you can remain in the world but not of the world, in the mind but not of the mind.

#15

[QUOTE=AmirMourad;60233]Anand,

“Dhyanam Nirvishayam Manaha” is the sanskrit definition of meditation. It means, when the mind is free from the objects of the senses, meditation occurs."

It may be the case for one who is seeking an escape from the mind and the senses. Otherwise, for one who has integrated a meditative consciousness - whether hearing, smelling, seeing, tasting, touching, sitting down silently or involved in a storm of action - the stream of meditation continues. Meditation does not mean an escape from the senses, it simply means to be capable of remaining a witness from moment to moment without identifying with whatsoever may arise in your experience. Even if a million and one thoughts pass by the scene of the mind - one can remain an observer, seeing without judgment. That can be done anywhere, one need not go into a deep samadhi for it - although the same approach will take you into a deep samadhi. That is why one Zen master Hakuin has said, that meditation in activity far surpasses meditation in stillness. Because while you are involved in activity - you can become disturbed by any number of things. The possibility of entanglement is enormous. If you can remain centered and grounded even while involved in the world, then you can remain in the world but not of the world, in the mind but not of the mind.[/QUOTE]

Dear Friend:

For “meditation in activity” to take place one must attain “vairagya” or dispassion.

However, for someone to attain this state, the “samskaras”, must thin out and vanish, since they are the source of all “vasanas” i.e. the sense gratifying tendencies.

For this to happen, either the mind or the prana or the veerya has to be stilled, because only then the prana will flow through the middle path known as “sushumna”. So the word “escape” would be a misnomer here.

Even after kundalini awakening, ordinary persons like me would have to spend years or even several births for “kundalini” to reach the “sahasrar” or the thousand petalled cahkra at the crown of the head. As you must be knowing, this is verily the divine union of “shakti” and “shiva”.

After this divine union (or enlightenment), both “shiva” and “shakti” descend together and such a person is known as “Avataar”.

Only such an “Avataar”, even though he or she may appear no different from the rest, can be in “meditation while in activity”. Many of us may mistake extreme concentration and involvement in a particular activity as meditation. This is not so. The commonest example in this regard would be “carnal bliss”.

I don’t know about you, but I have a long way to go.

Regards, anand

#16

[QUOTE=AmirMourad;56748]Seeker,

It seems that there is not even a single word that can be said which is not of the vast graveyard of dead knowledge you have collected into your mind. Hiding one’s ignorance behind quotations, these borrowed voices have been hypnotzing one for far too long.[/QUOTE]

Wow,

listen folks , a new Buddha is born with fresh knowledge and is not the voice of the long dead. who thinks patanjali’s teachings were hypnotic.

he who hides behind the big words like awareness, centering…himself. who, in self confused state tries to confuse others. who himself borrows from long dead zen masters,

long live the modern zen master, …master amir.

#17

[QUOTE=makar;56395]• For some reason when I meditate,it seems breathing doesn’t happen automatically for me? I have to consciously inhale and exhale.What should I do to free my mind from breathing and that I remain unconscious of my breathing like it is during other activities throughout the day??

Is it that the meditation done for Kundalini is different from normal meditation? Or the meditation is same for whatever purpose it is done?

Is meditation only the stillness/clearance of the mind during meditation? Or it has something more to it? I don’t mean the benefits of meditation but with what goes on during meditation.

How do you still your mind? You might be following a certain approach/technique for this? When I clear my mind of any thoughts,I still think that ok I have cleared my mind now.How do I deal with this? There should be nothing going on in my mind during meditation,right? How do you do this?[/QUOTE]

Dear Friend:

My Guru says “Rather than “doing” meditation; Let meditation happen”.

Breathing is always automatic. In fact, breathing is the movement of Life Force known as [I]Prana,[/I] the Universal Divine Mother. During meditation, [B]let[/B] yourself be in HER care at least for some time.

The best way is to first relax the body completely and offer the breathing process, i.e. the Divine Mother, [B]full liberty.[/B] Do not [B]“do”[/B] anything yourself.

Simply Feel the Mother Air (Prana) going in and out of the body.

This way, by merging all thoughts in only and only the Divine Air Mother, real meditation happens spontaneously.

best, anand

#18

prasad,

“listen folks , a new Buddha is born with fresh knowledge and is not the voice of the long dead. who thinks patanjali’s teachings were hypnotic”

As unconscious as you are, you still think it to be a matter of knowledge. It has absolutely nothing to do with knowledge - but with being. Either you have realized in your perception a state of being which is capable of liberating the mind from the root causes of one’s sufferings, or you have remained asleep. And the difference between the two is not much - one has open eyes, the other has closed eyes. As far as their beings are concerned, there is absolutely no difference between the two - but as far as their perception is concerned - they are dimensions apart.

“he who hides behind the big words”

What I am saying is simple and straightforward. If you are interested in the yogic sciences in any way which is not just borrowed knowledge, then move beyond your knowledge, start practicing, and take the practice to it’s very innermost core.

“who, in self confused state tries to confuse others. who himself borrows from long dead zen masters”

You are already confused enough as it is, you do not need my help.

#19

To meditate is ‘to remain in the awareness of’. Its pre-requisite is to concentrate, that is ‘to bring one’s attention to one thing and hold it there’ …i like… i want to talk more about this.

I started meditating by focusing on my breath. Thats all i did. i let the monkeys in my mind chatter as i simply breathed. 4 beats in four beats out. eventually the chatter kind of fades to the back. actually before i could focus on my breath, i had to work at being comfortable sitting up straight.

i started meditating at 16, and practicing the 8 limbs. i did this for 4 years untill i found kundalini yoga, were i was able to experiens bliss, simadi. and i dont reach it every time, but when i do, the next step is to be able to mantian that state of being, even when im not meditating.

i like to think of meditation as practice for the real meditation of being a consiuos beinging conected with the infinit.

babies calling

#20

greentrees,

“To meditate is ‘to remain in the awareness of’. Its pre-requisite is to concentrate, that is ‘to bring one’s attention to one thing and hold it there’ …i like… i want to talk more about this.”

Focusing the mind on a single point is one approach, there are other means to enter into meditation which do not involve restricting the mind onto a single object but remaining aware as to whatever may arise in your experience from moment to moment, without focusing the mind on anything in particular. Like a river stream constantly changing, you allow the mind to flow freely according to it’s tendencies - but remaining a witness without clinging as to whatever is happening in your experience.

#21

amir,
‘according to it’s tendencies’

The key word is tendencies of the mind, the varrties,
patanjali starts with the methods to get rid of these before one is fit enough to enter meditation. you can not get rid of them by just watching, being witness. you have do something.

#22

patanjali starts with the methods to get rid of these before one is fit enough to enter meditation. you can not get rid of them by just watching, being witness. you have do something.

You are referring to all of the countless methods of preparation for meditation yes ? The various asanas, pranayam, mudras, kriyas, bandhas, and so on. That is not the only way to deal with the problem, though it is helpful. One does not need all of this preparation in order to practice meditation, one can sit for meditation directly. That is what most of the Buddhists have been doing. And in Raja Yoga, that is originally how it has been. Throughout the whole Yoga Sutras, you will find that Patanjali has not mentioned anywhere even a single word about the different asanas, pranayam, mudras, kriyas, bandhas, and so on - he simply describes techniques which are to do with the mind. As far as the more physical techniques are concerned - at the most he simply says that the asana, the seat in which one is sitting for meditation, should be stable, balanced, and firm. He does not go into it more than that. Most of the Buddhists also do not do any preperatory work for meditation. But if one deals with the mind directly and tries to work on meditation - the difference is that one will have to encounter the same obstacles through the mind. With Hatha Yoga as preparation for meditation, one is trying to indirectly bring about a change at the level of the mind through the body, with Raja Yoga one is trying to bring about a change at the level of the mind directly through the mind, that is the only difference. Neither approach is absolute, they are simply different approaches.

#23

amir,

If one has to reach 2nd floor, a wise man will take stairs.
He will never try to pole vault.
If he were you, who knows he might reach.