Non attachment

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#21

[quote=Fin;8420]Hubert,

fear is something i am working on a lot these days…

fear is the identifying the self with the body. Once I meditate on this, fear seems to dissipate, not completely gone, just less…
Love,
Fin[/quote]

I am not afraid of physical pain and suffering, one cannot escape them totally. But I am afraid of the pain and suffering caused by my own weakness, I am afraid of failure in living the right way, to not hurt anyone, including myself, as I am sure that every time I lack the strenght, or will to do what is right, I hurt not just myself but the world too.
I am very much afraid of my dark side, (the heritage of the past) what makes me do things I know are wrong, but I like them too much, than after it I am very sorry that I have failed so miserably.
I fail so many times every day … through words, and deeds, and by lack of awarness. Yes, forgivness … this makes it possible to get up again, but the pain of the wound is there. It is the ego what is afraid, I guess.

#22

Dear Hubert

Dont be afraid! Since we are learning out of every mistake we arer doing, there is something good in them. It is enough to live with the deep urge to be non violent one day and to go on moving towards it. Tapas is meant to try giving up things we like to much. And if we fail we can try again and again, till we understood whatever there was to learn for us. If you start loving and acepting even your dark sides might discover even they are of some good.
Since we will never understand the divine leelas it seems we have to accept every thing that happens and continue to follow the path of yoga in oder one or an other day to be free.
Yes it is the Ego which is afraid because it wants to continue to be the boss in pour live instead of surrendering to the divine.
All the best
Lars

#23

[quote=Hubert;8462]
I am very much afraid of my dark side, (the heritage of the past) what makes me do things I know are wrong, but I like them too much, than after it I am very sorry that I have failed so miserably.
I fail so many times every day … through words, and deeds, and by lack of awarness. Yes, forgivness … this makes it possible to get up again, but the pain of the wound is there. It is the ego what is afraid, I guess.[/quote]

Dear Hubert,

What is fearlessness? The only person endowed with the property of fearlessness is an individual which has cast aside the garment we call the body, that person as a free spirit can only experience bliss, since all pain & suffering comes from attachment first wth the body then via the body to other experiences.
In deep mediation free of the vasicilations (vrittis) of the mind only bliss is experienced. In my humble experience this experience is always too brief as mind/samsakars (ego) pulls you back into the body.

It appears that we must experience our earthly journey via the physical body. The ego does a good job of keeping us in the physical body but fear is intractably linked with the ego.
The body a gross representation also houses the ego.
So when the ego is threatened then fear develops. We are programmed to run away from fear. Those who run away from fear are forced to experience it as chronic ailments often very painful. I suffered from many very painful Chronic ailments (I was a master at suppressing fear). Those who allow fear its full expression dispels it.

You see, Hubert, we are drawn to pleasure which often leads to pain. I don?t think either pleasure or pain are a problem. The problem is that both create a mental imbalance which pulls us away from our pure consciousness, the bliss we sporadically experience in deep meditation.

Suppress nothing allow all thoughts, ask always how can I make this experience satvic. If thoughts or actions cause mental imbalance (fear) then that activity is not satvic. Allow guidance from your higher self to move to a more satvic state.

In time as you move from the Pita stage of your life to the Vata a lot of the urges will vanish anyway?

Sorry for the ramble, hope it helps.
Love
Fin

#24

[quote=Hubert;8462]I am not afraid of physical pain and suffering, one cannot escape them totally. But I am afraid of the pain and suffering caused by my own weakness, I am afraid of failure in living the right way, to not hurt anyone, including myself, as I am sure that every time I lack the strenght, or will to do what is right, I hurt not just myself but the world too.
I am very much afraid of my dark side, (the heritage of the past) what makes me do things I know are wrong, but I like them too much, than after it I am very sorry that I have failed so miserably.
I fail so many times every day … through words, and deeds, and by lack of awarness. Yes, forgivness … this makes it possible to get up again, but the pain of the wound is there. It is the ego what is afraid, I guess.[/quote]

Dear Hubert,

I don’t know you apart from your posts in this thread, (and I’m no psychologist) but you seem very “attached” to this concept of fear and pain.

But why focus on these negative aspects? Focusing on the positive seems more healthy - what little things can I do in this moment / day to make myself and others happier, the world nicer, friendlier, more considerate etc.

But either way, the positive or the negative, if you over-think it, it will consume you - attachment perhaps. Rather, making the positive choice for the small decisions as they are presented seems more natural and spontaneous - less attached.

Namaste

Jez

#25

Such great feedback! I always learn something here and for that I am grateful.

After reading the last two responses to Hubert, I definitely agree with JezHealth about overthinking and overanalyzing. Sometimes we can get into life patterns and “dances” with ourselves and others that, over time, begin to resemble self-destructive habits. Perhaps these patterns arose from emotional or physical abuse, a survival instinct or they are part of a person’s genetic makeup. The best way to overcome this kind of destructive inner dialogue is by CHOOSING to make positive changes in ourselves and moving forward one step at a time. For example, when a negative thought begins to take over, make a conscious choice to shut it down by choosing a more positive thought to replace it. You can literally “flip the switch” yourself. This may sound oversimplified but I assure you it works. Experiencing grief and sadness is a normal part of human existence. However, overindulging fear and negativity creates more of the same. Begin by replacing bad thoughts with good - over and over again - and this will actually create a chemical change in your brain. And after awhile it becomes a way of life.

You may (or may not) find this article helpful: How to Cure ‘Destructive Emotions’ – Beliefnet.com

It is also important to pay close attention to your diet. Also, do you take multivitamins and/or supplements? Many people are magnesium deficient. Stress (and too much calcium) depletes our magnesium as we age. Just some things to consider…

#26

This begins to remind me the lamentation of Job and the wisdom of his friends. :slight_smile:

Thank you for your encouraging oughts … trying to present my situation in detail made me realize what I need. Prioritizing tasks, do the lesser harm, get on business, break enchaining habits, withdraw a little from professional activity.

Thanks again.

#27

Namaste, forum friends!

See? I’m practicing niceness.

I can’t really respond to the “non-attachment” part of this thread, because I don’t understand what that means yet. But, smstout19’s post above mentioned changing our “inner dialogue” which also came up in the dark/light thread. I would guess this is something most here have already learned how to do, but I’m learning it right now. Changing the inside negativity to a more positive outlook is not easy when it’s so deeply ingrained, is your “normal” mode of interacting with the world, and has been “you” for your entire life. That’s a lot of rearranging and redirecting and restraining of thoughts. I try to get the words love, kindness, peace, and happiness to appear in there more and more. Sometimes I feel irritated because this continual attention to every thought feels like a chore. It seems like I have a sentry guard standing duty in my mind and his job (yes, he’s a guy) is to stop negative thoughts from growing or exiting. But happily, it doesn’t feel like suppression, or repression, or censorship. More like a gentle restraint. I can feel something unhardening or loosening up. Some perspective is shifting. So, despite the periodic irritation, I recognize that for me, this is a good thing.

I just finished the Dhalia Llama’s, “The Art of Happiness” where he said that Westerners don’t really get the concept of loving themselves like Easterners do. Well, here I am, living a typical, regular-person, nonspiritual, American life and completely surrounded by others like me. I?m starting to finally see why I held onto this negativity (neuroses) for as long as I did, and how I thought it served me. Which of course, is that it didn?t serve me at all. It does though, make me feel a little sad to think that it took so long to come to that conclusion. But anyway, this “loving-kindness thing” will take time and patience and practice before it feels natural. It’s got to open up old crusty hardened cynical grumpy, me. (And yes, I know that last sentence was full of “negativity” but the sentry guard is taking a break and I made myself laugh so…so there!). I’m also holding onto my “overintellectualizing” right now because I still need it. Not ready for egolessness quite yet (or whatever’s next). In the meantime, I’m just happy this forum is here to come and “sort out loud” while I’m learning, one step at a time.

#28

Hey, moth. I take you’re a gal, than ? :slight_smile:

To jezheath:

Pain and suffering is not a predilection of thoughts for me, but a state of being. It is unavoidable, unless I hurt others. I am not complaining though. I feel I am blessed. Without this, I’d be sleeping. I’d be content. I would not care about anything. But that kind of happiness is not lasting.

#29

I love this forum too Moth. Something that occurred to me after reading your post above is that, perhaps one reason it may be difficult for you to alter your negative inner dialogue is because you have people around you who contribute to it? It’s just a thought. And I am speaking from my own personal experiences. In other words, when I surround myself with positive people, my energy is VERY different.

#30

This might be moving too far off the original topic, but I wanted to add to this to the valuable point that Suzanne makes. I believe it is this way for most, if not all, people. It is important to keep good company with all things: books, music, movies, food, friendships, etc. It is amazing what a difference observing the quality of things/people in our lives will make toward the smallest, vacillating thoughts (vrittis) of our minds. And this is where all thoughts either get more energy from us to develop or fade away. The other benefit of keeping good company is that this skill becomes polished and you become astute to what benefits your life’s practice and what will impede your practice. Your intuition, your connection to wisdom, is like, “Hey! You are finally listening to me so I’ll share even more with you.” These benefits increase and branch into all parts of our quiet minds.

#31

[QUOTE=smstout19;8525]I love this forum too Moth. Something that occurred to me after reading your post above is that, perhaps one reason it may be difficult for you to alter your negative inner dialogue is because you have people around you who contribute to it? It?s just a thought. And I am speaking from my own personal experiences. In other words, when I surround myself with positive people, my energy is VERY different.

[/QUOTE]

I agree that being around positive people can make a difference, but personally for me it has been a very limited difference. If we relly too much, of course we all need some assistance, but if we really too much on being around positive people in order for us to be positive then we may have a hard time coming to our full strength. I see it like this

a huge storm is coming with 125 mph winds, rain, and lightning
there is a forest of trees and the forest provides some protectioin from the wind for the trees since the trees facing the wind may lean back on the trees behind them when the wind blows hard, the trees in the middle of the forest will feel less of a wind because the trees in the front of the forest slowed down the wind, the trees in the back of the forest feel the least wind wind

there is a tree standing alone in the middle of the field, now if it is not strong enough it may get blown over, but if this tree can withstand the storm, when the sun comes out it will be fully basked in the light because no trees are there to block the rays

be not afraid to stand alone, but lean on a tree when you need a hand, but then again we are never truly alone. 3 sides to every coin :wink:
just thoughts
seeker

#32

Hey, Neil, I like your little parable very much. :slight_smile:

#33

Loved your storm/forest analogy Tubeseeker. I often think of the way trees withstand the change of seasons as such a great life lesson.

On another note, I am very happy to have found this forum. And I am particularly grateful for all of the shared wisdom that can be found right here. I enjoy a challenge and get especially giddy when someone ?pulls the rug? just enough to kick my cranium into high gear.

#34

thank you for your kind words, I will try not to attach myself to them :wink:
peace within
seeker