He could have refused to answer. That would not be a lie.
If he refused to answer he would have been killed himself. In special situations like this, a lie would be the best action.
Ultimately is not the action or even the situation, it is the motivation. If I say to my friend, “You stupid idiot” in a benevolent, playful and kind tone it is not an abuse. If I say the same to a non-friend, in non benevolent tone, then the same words become an abuse.
As long as your motivations are pure, you can recite Eminem or 2pac, and you will not create any defilement.
I don’t see any immorality in lying to someone who has no business knowing the truth, or who would use the truth to do evil.
[QUOTE=thomas;44782]He could have refused to answer. That would not be a lie.[/QUOTE]
I forgot to mention that in the story, he took a vow to our gods to never lie. In this circumstance, he was fearing their wrath (when they would not have been angry anyway). Back in those times, you had no idea how binding these vows were.
[QUOTE=thomas;44785]I don’t see any immorality in lying to someone who has no business knowing the truth, or who would use the truth to do evil.[/QUOTE]
Thats the point I’ve been trying to make. But you just contradicted yourself as you obviously believe in the underlying meaning in this quote. Step outside the box of illogical Christian objectivity.
[QUOTE=Nietzsche;44814]Thats the point I’ve been trying to make. But you just contradicted yourself as you obviously believe in the underlying meaning in this quote. Step outside the box of illogical Christian objectivity.[/QUOTE]
If you would like to get along, it would be nice if you would not be so insulting.
I didn’t contradict myself. Please read carefully.
The first time I said he would not have to lie by remaining silent. I did not say it would have been immoral for him to lie, did I?
Yes, perhaps I have been a bit too harsh with you. I and Surya Deva have provided more input as to why he could not have remained silent. And I don’t know why I can’t edit my posts but I meant to type “that quote,” referring to “there is no right or wrong.” What I meant was you were arguing the validity of the quote when you seem to believe the quote’s underlying meaning in this situation.
The man and the god both would have acrued “negative” black karma.
The man for making a stupid vow like that in the first place without thinking it through - just a moment. Then stupidly, like a simpleton, keeping the vow out of stubborness, or fear of a god, when good sense was required.
The god for accepting such a stupid vow, and or implying that he’d be salty if the simpleton broke his stupid vow.
As I understand it - actions bear fruit. Good or white actions bring happiness. Black or negative actions give unpleasantness.
“Good” or “bad” can be an opinion as with the ritual suicide example.
All I know is actions bear fruit.
I also know that suffering can result from positive motivations! Hows that for a job?
All I know is actions bear fruit.
[QUOTE=The Scales;45361]The man and the god both would have acrued “negative” black karma.
The man for making a stupid vow like that in the first place without thinking it through - just a moment. Then stupidly, like a simpleton, keeping the vow out of stubborness, or fear of a god, when good sense was required.
The god for accepting such a stupid vow, and or implying that he’d be salty if the simpleton broke his stupid vow.
As I understand it - actions bear fruit. Good or white actions bring happiness. Black or negative actions give unpleasantness.
“Good” or “bad” can be an opinion as with the ritual suicide example.
All I know is actions bear fruit.
I also know that suffering can result from positive motivations! Hows that for a job?
All I know is actions bear fruit.[/QUOTE]
Agreed.