Can one achieve enlightenment without really praticing asanas?

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#1

And could one be considered a yogi who doesnt practice asanas much or at all? when does one even get labelled a yogi…? I suppose anyone practicing even parts of yoga or who has a yearning for enlightenment and/or a general interest in philosophy/spirituality could be considered a yogi. Or maybe as I’ve read everyone is a yogi and on there own unique path.

I know the physical postures/asanas are only one of the 8 limbs of yoga. So it seems yoga is more of a spiritual/philosophical pursuit or way of being or path than your average person would realize (especially for those in western society). But say someone has an injury or is handicapped that keeps them from practicing asanas some or completely (or even just prevents them from staying in a lotus meditation position for very long without getting physical pain/discomfort)… Are they doomed to human suffering the rest of their life and not able to achieve “oneness with the universe” or “enlightenment” or “eternal bliss” or “deep realization of self” or “union with god”? (So many ways to put it)

Perhaps enlightenment is just having peace of mind/inner peace/concious presence and not some demystifying all knowing realization of the nature of reality…? Or maybe it is?

I have read practicing asanas helps you meditate in lotus/sitting position more deeply and what not (as well as raises your concious awareness in general)… And i kind of experienced this myself as well. So if you don’t practice various postures you won’t be able to get into a deep meditative state such as in lotus position and therefore won’t achieve enlightenment?

Perhaps asanas are an aid and not necessarily a requirement to achieve enlightenment…? There are many paths I guess. Did the Buddha (and Buddhists in general) practice asanas at all? Didnt he achieve enlightenment mainly by just practicing sitting/lotus meditation for countless hours/days?

This is something that has been on my mind for a while and would like some views on it.

#2

The answers to your question seem reasonable, it’s fine to seek help outside as long as one validates within.

#3

I guess I kind of answered myself in the post. But I’d still like to hear other ppls views on this.

#4

Yes, of course.

#5

Chris,

Do I think a pure state of being is possible without asana? Yes. Happens all the time. Is it possible to remain in that state at will? Unfortunately, for me it is not. In my opinion (and it is only that) fewer asanas means more lifetimes. I get that.

I personally am not concerned with “enlightenment.” I look at it in terms of “optimal harmonic resonance:” what can I do to resonate OM more fully in this lifetime? Is it my habits, my thoughts, my words, my body? It’s all of these.

For me it’s asana and pranayama, and raja yoga in general. I don’t worry about anything else, and least of all, lotus position. That is only another degree of achievement on a very long road of many. Certainly not an end, and more likely only the beginning.

I wish I could help you with this one.

siva

#6

Siva,
I really love your answer. Optimal harmonic resonance…lovely.

Chris,
The yoga sutras, the roadmap for “becoming a yogi”, as you know, don’t have much at all to day about asana. Asana is the “seat” of meditation. So whether or not you can sit in full lotus or put a leg behind the head is inconsequential. What matters insofar as asana is concerned, is whether your meditation seat is steady, comfortable, and free of tension. It’s a great question and really worthy to remind ourselves when we step onto our mat, what is it we’re doing when we’re doing what we’re doing.

#7

Yoga is life. We lose touch with life when life becomes experiences. From this illusion back to knowing oneself is the undoing, the process of yoga. One who lets it happen is a yogi.

Experiences differ, so do the routes and methods of undoing. Asana oils the body-machine, pranayama cleans the engine, yamas protect it from environmental corrosion, niyamas prevent the inner decay. Then the body is ready for the overhaul. The insulated body brings to light the hidden astral body and the same process is extended to bring the causal body under conscious control.

While this happens, experiencing transforms from out-bound to inbound attention, from objects to images, from images to symbols, from symbols to coded patterns and that brings life back on our radar.
But the greatest hurdle in the yoga process is our own self. Our self-view is never aligned with our world-view, but remains divisive, exaggerated and unreal. When the two views merge, the life as consciousness and manifested life as objects/ forms is instantly known.

Yoga mimics life. Consider asana, pranayama and all 8 limbs as separate and you have a problem. Consider them as many aspects of the same journey and you would see the truth. In a very subtle way, enlightenment will no more be an event (like graduation) nor will it be ‘achievable’ (like success). Enlightened is what we really are, until realized.

#8

Blessings Chris27,

As to your question regarding asana and being a yogi, I am with Siva in that it is not necessary. In fact, while Patanjali canonized classical yoga for us, a person can be a Bhakti yogi, Jnana yogi, Karma yogi, or yogi from any one of the other paths out there without once needing to practice, much less think about asanas.

As to when one can be labeled a yogi ? when they have truly yoked the moment ? when they have touched upon Samadhi ? when they have dropped the subject/object dichotomy for a flickering second ? I think that is a good qualifier. Some would even have it that just practicing yoga is all it takes. Of course, our next question would be, ?what the heck in yoga in the first place??

As to being injured, hurt, or otherwise unable to work with asanas ? we can be laying on our back, walking, cleaning the dishes, wiping our butts, or doing anything else and have the opportunity to connect, to abide, to be, and enjoy the ride. So once again, asana is not necessary.

For fairness sake, asanas are really important. Not only do they help strengthen our bodies and immune systems, align our joints, bones, and vertebrae, enables us to sit comfortably for a time, they also helps us clear away energy blocks, work through our issues, overcome weaknesses, fears, anxieties, help heal tears, soften energetic scars, get the energy moving, and a host of other awesome benefits.

If you can do asanas ? do them. If you cannot ? don?t worry about it. The truth of the matter is, if you are laying on your back you are doing an asana, if you are sitting in a wheelchair you are in an asana, if you are standing ? well, you guessed it. Being present, feeling the energy, breathing, connecting ? these are what matters. Stretching into a pretzel does not make a yogi ? being fully present and open to the essence of what is ? that is key!

Blessings Be?

#9

Yeah with one hour a day practice.

#10

Thanks for the replies so far everyone

#11

[QUOTE=Suhas Tambe;82202]

Consider asana, pranayama and all 8 limbs as separate and you have a problem. [/QUOTE]

Suhas, buddy,

Your understanding and what you wrote in your post here is perfection right up to this point, however NOT to keep asana, pranayama and all 8 limbs of yoga as separate from one another presents yet a greater problem. Otherwise, why would they have been separated in the first place? “Seeing their truth” relies more heavily on their differentiation than to consider them “many aspects of the same journey?” Do you trust the rishis did this for a reason?

What are your thoughts?

Respectfully,
siva

#12

Maybe he was trying to say that they all work together as a whole to optimally help you expand/raise your consciousness… And to not get too hung up on one part anymore than the other parts.

Perhaps the eight limbs are tools/ways of being to help guide you to enlightenment/self discovery but not the be all end all.

#13

[QUOTE=Chris27;82234]Maybe he was trying to say that they all work together as a whole to optimally help you expand/raise your consciousness… And to not get too hung up on one part anymore than the other parts.[/QUOTE]

Chris,

…“expand/raise your consciousness?”

No such thing: I have no consciousness, you have none, we have none, rather I/you/we ARE consciousness, and this demonstrates exactly why differentiation is necessary. And yes, not to get hung up on one part is correct, however this can also only be done by seeing one part as it is, separate from the other. Differentiation is actually the key and is why it was so beautifully done for us by the rishis?

Ask yourself? Why 8 limbs, why jnana, bhakti, karma, raja? To not see these as separate, is to “get hung up.”

Most interesting,

siva

#14

Good thought, Siva.

I always ‘see’ things separate in their grosser form and yet united in the subtler at the same time. I didn’t begin with Asanas and my guru took me into the world of ‘living yoga’ rather then ‘doing yoga’. Though this isn’t any shade better than beginning with asanas.

That is the sweet paradox of yoga. However, I am aware that sometimes such description makes one underestimate asanas or makes one a chatter-box of spiritual jargon. Both are unnecessary.

I still request you to meditate on what I said. Chris 27 said it well. The eight limbs are separate when one practices, but we shouldn’t lose sight of their confluence that brings us closer to our spiritual goal.

Lastly, as one attains ability to do sanyama on chakras the eight limbs appear bonded in one and become redundant as separate exercises.

(and, yes we ARE conscious. I think what gets raised is awareness. This is how one’s “self” changes and we move from identifying with physical body to identifying with the spiritual Self)

#15

I guess I should have worded it differently siva. I did mean concious AWARENESS expansion. Did not think someone on here would take every word so literally and get the jist of what I was trying to say.

#16

Suhas,

Thank you. I thought you might like that. Yes, a very “sweet paradox” it is: separately gross, subtly unified.

Chris,

Yes, “consciousness” is different from “awareness,” as is contemplation from knowledge, as is thought from memory. These things remain clear only when separate from one another.

peace,
siva

#17

I might also add, in my opinion, non-differentiation leads to religion?

Any thoughts?

siva

#18

You do not need to practice asanas to reach enlightenment. There are many ascetic practices and exercises that can result in spiritual advancement and enlightenment. The only thing you need is lots of discipline and lots of passion and a regular practice. Choose your system wizely.