[QUOTE=ray_killeen;70569]Your efforts to sort out the Maya of loneliness may best be resolved in Jy?na yoga.[/QUOTE]
What direction would you suggest he take with Jyana yoga?
[QUOTE=Senin;70718]What direction would you suggest he take with Jyana yoga?[/QUOTE]
The introspection of Jnana Yoga allows one to tap into the knowledge/wisdom of one?s own natural intellect, through deeper contemplation/reflection one may begin to recognize false identities which may dramatically change perspectives bringing about transformations of clarity from idealism to reality. Becoming familiar and practicing the 8 limbs along with the other three paths of yoga seems to allow one to become assimilated for absorption of Jnana i.e. all four paths (Karma, Bhakti, Raja and Jnana) integrate with each other.
Jnana yoga, through discussions, lends itself well to practicing here on this Forum; a book that comes to mind is Swami Vivekananda?s ?Jnana Yoga? as well as writing from Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi, Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj and the philosophy of Advaita Vedanta (non duality).
A slight correction here:
The Yoga paths were practiced by few adepts initially but evolved as the prevalent practice as the whole humanity grew in its awareness. Raja literally means the “king/ crown”. So, the hierarchy is generally on these lines:
Karma Yoga is subjugation of the physical/ materialistic instincts through self-less engagement in actions;
Bhakti Yoga is subjugation of the subtle emotional swings through an unconditional devotion;
Jnana Yoga is subjugation of the ego-centric intellect through spiritual wisdom
Raja Yoga is subjugation of mind through its purification and non-attachment to transcend the physical, subtle and the causal world.
There is no less or more value of each, except that each suits an individual’s station in life.
Karma, Bhakti, and Jnana where first mentioned in the Bhagavad Gītā over 5,000 years ago about 2,500 years later the Yoga Sutra’s came into print and its association with Raja, all other branches and side shuts of yoga have stemmed from these, if human predispositions are different than the value of each may very well be different.
Ray, I am sorry to burst your bubble but the Gita is not 5000 years old. I think you are confusing the fact that the historical Krishna is said to have lived 5000 years ago, with the Gita, which is a text composed by some unknown author and later added to the Mahabharata treatise. Most scholars date the Gita around 200BCE, as it contains cultural and philosophical references to older schools like Buddhist and Samkhya.
That said, the dating of Indian history is highly controversial, because of the dubious historical anchors which are used. In any case it is clear the Gita was not a part of the original Mahabharata treatise, but was added later.
[QUOTE=Surya Deva;70731]Ray, I am sorry to burst your bubble but the Gita is not 5000 years old. I think you are confusing the fact that the historical Krishna is said to have lived 5000 years ago, with the Gita, which is a text composed by some unknown author and later added to the Mahabharata treatise. Most scholars date the Gita around 200BCE, as it contains cultural and philosophical references to older schools like Buddhist and Samkhya.
That said, the dating of Indian history is highly controversial, because of the dubious historical anchors which are used. In any case it is clear the Gita was not a part of the original Mahabharata treatise, but was added later.[/QUOTE]
As a mere fact of curiosity I?d be interested in a consensus from legitimate historians the approximate date of the first copy of the Gita, does it still exist and where it is?
I personally do not accept Karma, Bhakti, Jnana and Raja as equal. Rather I see them as on a spiritual maturity gradation scale:
Bhakti: Lowest
Karma: Intermediate
Jnana: Higher
Raja: Highest
However, it really depends what is meant when you talk about Bhakti and Karma. Even in Raja Bhakti is needed as a strong fervent devotion to the goal of liberation and karma is needed to act mindfully in life. However, normally when the terms Bhakti yoga and Karma Yoga we are referring to independent systems of salvation. In Bhakti salvation is sought through temple and idol worship, hymns, pilgrimages. In Karma salvation is sought through dutifully fulfilling all of ones obligations in life(to parents, to society, to nature, to the ancestors, to the guru) and historically involves performing rituals(yagyas) This is supported by the Purva-Mimassa school of philosophy.
In Vedantic thought(the Jnana path) the efficacy of the Karma path is strongly criticized and Sankara ends up defeating the chief Mimassa proponent of his day. He shows that doing just good karma, only produces good merit and thus a favourable life in the next. When that is exhausted, ones karmic balance is again back to zero and were back at square one. Thus liberation cannot be attained by any number of good deeds. On the other hand, through the path of Jnana we are able to completely leave the world of duality and become liberated. When knowledge comes, we no longer are in bondage to any karma, good or bad.
Bhakti Yoga is very much a modern development and does not consolidate into a full fledged path until the Bhakti movement in the late middle ages. Here one basically worships human imagination, concepts of god created by men. God as an elephant. God as a three-eyed men. God as a woman. This does not lead to liberation, but rather delusion. The few Bhaktas it has lead to liberation for, gained liberation only as a biproduct because they were constantly chanting their chosen god’s name, which scientifically produces the same result as Raja Yoga: Chit-vritti nirodha. If one becomes immersed completely in one thought, the result is other thought activity begins to slow down, causing one to introvert inwards. To do this, however, Bhakti is definitely not essential or required. Moreover, it is distracting.
Just to qualify on karma: While doing goods deeds itself can not lead to liberation from samsara, but only guarantee a more favorable future life, the act of doing good deeds can lead to moral purification and this can bring one closer to the goal of Raja Yoga: chitt-vritti nirodha. Again it is only a biproduct of the practice.
Ultimately, all yogas are just ancillary to Raja Yoga. If you are doing Raja Yoga you have no need to do any of the other kind of yogas, unless if you want to use them as tools for purification of ones mind and body. Bhakti Yoga, if done correctly, can purify your heart; Karma yoga, if done correctly, can purifies ones body and relationship to the world and others. However, these practices can be done without the baggage they come with. There is no need to choose human concepts of god, and there is no need to do any rituals. Bhakti simply to the Nirguna Brahman(ontological god) by remembering that pure ONE that pervades all of existence, that is verily your self is enough. Karma by acting mindfully and selflessly in the world is enough.
[QUOTE=ray_killeen;70732]As a mere fact of curiosity I’d be interested in a consensus from legitimate historians the approximate date of the first copy of the Gita, does it still exist and where it is?[/QUOTE]
Here are some sources:
The Bhagavad gita was traditionally inscribed on leaves and none of these have survived. However the sacred culture of guru-disciple ensured a succession of hand-written versions of the text down through the centuries, and guaranteed that the pronunciation of the Sanskrit verses were preserved. The oldest existing handwritten copy of the Bhagavad gita is from 1488 and is kept in a museum in London.
Source: http://deshika.wordpress.com/bhagavad-gita/
On the date of composition of Gita:
Deutsch, Eliot. Dalvi, Rohit. 2004. The Essential Vedanta. Bloomington: World Wisdom. pg. 61. “The Gita can be placed roughly about the beginning of the Christian era, within a margin of two centuries, and the authors must have seen the appeal of the soteriologies both of the “heterodox” traditions of Buddhism and Jainism and of the more “orthodox” ones of Samkhya and Yoga.”
Source: Wiki: Bhagvad Gita
As with almost every religious Indian text, it is difficult to pinpoint when exactly the Gita was written. Without a doubt, it was written over a period of centuries by many writers. From the contents of the Gita, it is abundantly clear that both the principal teachings of the Upanishads and of early Buddhism were familiar to the writers of the Gita. So, it has been approximated that the Gita was written during the period 500-200 BCE. Even though India is one of the few nations which has a continuous documented history, very few Indian religious texts exists for which the exact date of publication is established without controversy.
Huh, those damn Londoners stole it, like you said it?s not clear and there will continue to be as many interpretations as there are humans, yet it is interesting to discuss and arrive at one?s own synchronization that may lead towards benefits:
1.) Karma (karma)
2.) Bhakti (buck-tee)
3.) Jnana (gyana)
4.) Raja (raaj)
Jnana Yoga: is the path of knowledge, wisdom, introspection and contemplation. It involves deep exploration of the nature our being by systematically exploring and setting aside false identities through self inquiry.
Bhakti Yoga: is the path of devotion, emotion, love, compassion, and service to the Absolute/others. All actions are done in the context of remembering the unity of the Absolute.
Karma Yoga: is the path of action, service to others, mindfulness and remembering the levels of our being while fulfilling our karmic actions in the world.
Raja Yoga: is a comprehensive method that emphasizes meditation while encompassing the whole of Yoga. It directly deals with the encountering and transcending thoughts of the mind.
Note: we?re off topic, another thread should be started to continue historical yogic timelines and interpretations, realizing of course it would simply be a practice in human curiosity since yoga is simply a means to stir the stew?when the stew is absolute the means will have dissolved else it has become an obstacle.
The Question:
Can Yoga help cope loneliness?
My Answer:
Yoga gives you the physical and mental courage to slowly get into the habit of liking loneliness, because the goal of yoga is Kaivalya, irrespective of whatever yoga you practice.
Ray, you are correct. We need a separate thread for discussing Karma, Bhakti, Jnana and Raja yoga.
BTW:
Bhagavad Gita 9.2 says:
raja-vidya raja-guhyam
pavitram idam uttamam
pratyaksavagamam dharmyam
su-sukham kartum avyayam
This knowledge is the king of education, the most secret of all secrets. It is the purest knowledge, and because it gives direct perception of the self by realization, it is the perfection of religion. It is everlasting, and it is joyfully performed.
I would advice you to join some social groups and make friends to end your loneliness…
Because all people are not the same…Yoga can help you to maintain peace and remain calm…It is best for keeping yourself fit and healthy but not to end your loneliness.
For that you should make new friends.
I have too dealt with loneliness but you just have to force yourself to go out and connect with people. I wish that you had a yoga studio near you where you could practice yoga alongside others. Are there any meetup groups near you? Organizations? I have found that to be an easy way to meet people. I am an introvert so I don’t need a lot of social interaction to ward away the loneliness.
Yoga can help bring inner peace which can make it easier to interact with others. You begin to know yourself through yoga and with that are able to present a more authentic self to the world. I think it is this authenticity that attracts as they say “true” and “genuine” friends.
[QUOTE=om_namah_shivay;70537]Hi,
For the past few months I have become very lonely. I had 2 friends but due to some unavoidable circumstances I no longer talk to them.
I am maintaining my regular routine of asanas & pranayamas but that takes not more than one hour a day.
How can I use yoga to minimize my loneliness ?
TIA[/QUOTE]
It’s funny you should mention this because I just saw Robert Downey Jr. on the cover of a Men’s fitness magazine and I read some of the article and he talked about how he was surrounding himself with yogis so that he was never lonely… It seems to be working for him.
I find the qualities of clearing my mind and concentrating on moving and breathing really help me forget that something like “lonely” exists!
[QUOTE=om_namah_shivay;70537]Hi,
For the past few months I have become very lonely. I had 2 friends but due to some unavoidable circumstances I no longer talk to them.
I am maintaining my regular routine of asanas & pranayamas but that takes not more than one hour a day.
How can I use yoga to minimize my loneliness ?
TIA[/QUOTE]
The price of happiness is solitude.
Pramahansa Yogananda