Chronic neck and shoulder pain and yoga

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#1

I’m new to this forum and was attracted to it because of Mukunda’s unique approach to yoga. Blessings to you all.

I have been practicing yoga for 25 years (and teaching for 9) and it has kept me healthy until 2 years ago. Now I have constant neck and shoulder pain and it has developed into first, a right frozen shoulder then the following year the other one. I have used yoga principles to help me through all this and have full range of motion in both arms again. My neck however has constant tension, unrelived by yoga or savasana. Working at a computer or standing to paint, which I love to do, is near impossible for more than 15 minutes. Things seem to be getting progressively worse.

I bought the book Structural Yoga Therapy and have taken on board Ayurvedic principles for an out of balance Vata Pitta. I live on a Spanish island off the coast of Africa and dont have access to anything like Structural Yoga (or even a decent yoga teacher to point out my faults).

Does anyone have any advice? I cant afford to travel to the States for corrective work. Does anyone know of anyone in the UK or Spain for example? Any advice will be helpful.

#2

In my opinion, you need to see a MD first to find out if there is anything serious going on like a herniated disk or something else. Honestly, I wouldn’t do anything until you see a doctor first.

#3

And when you go to see that Doctor please limit their comments to diagnosis as they tend to tell you things like “you’ll never walk again” and the like which I don’t find to be very mentally medicinal.

Can you please tell me the specifics of how you have done sarvangasana please? I may follow this woth other asana questions if you don’t mind.

#4

Thank you for your responses. As I have to communicate in my terrible Spanish all I have so far got from the MD is ibuprofen and a dire muscle relaxant which made me feel so ill I didnt take it. It could be months before I can pursuade them to let me see a specialist. So I use hot and cold pads, and natural aloe vera gel from the garden when things get bad.

I practice savasana on a mat on a tiled floor for 20-30 mins, with 5-10 mins of tensing and relaxing individual groups of muscles, then 15-20 mins of deep relaxtion; sometimes I use someone else’s tape or CD and sometimes I repeat my own relaxing messages, or a CD I made for my students. When my neck is really bad, I cant relax those musles at will and put a small neck pillow under my neck which creates more of a hollow and another under my knees, sometimes another under the small of my back.

I printed off a reseach paper yesterday by Arden Sundari Pierce from this site, and wept with relief at some of the advice in there which I am trying to collate into short term, medium term and long term projects for this condition.

#5

I first wanted to say that you probably overdoing sarvangasana … but when I read you’ve been practicing yoga for 20 years, I got discouraged.

What I learnt in my short experience is that a bad posture is usually the cause of such aches, or activities what immobilizes the body in a certain position for too long a time. As example, I have to sit a lot, I did that for the last 20 years, and now my iliopsoas muscles are so short that I can’t really stand straight, or if I can, with a good bit of effort.

In cases like yours you should concentrate on the aching parts, determine the cause, what usually is a strenght inbalance between antagonist muscles of the particular joint, or articular stiffness - due to loss of elascticity of it’s soft tissues. Age, unilateral use, or overtraining, all can cause such symptoms.
I say usually, because in your case, someone with 20 years of practice, it is to be expected to know all this, and to have a healthy, strong but flexible body. These aches are a sign that you have to change something. Do not expect too much from others … it is you who have to find the cause and make some changes. The real cause is always in the mind … somehow. -Continuing my example, I was convinced that I should do sarvangasana a lot, until I found out about this stiffness in my hips and I realized that I shoud strech my iliopsoas muscles, and now I do the “warrior”. It is what my body needs, not Saravangasana. Sometimes we get to rigid in our practice. We think we should do this or that, when in fact we should let our body tell us, what it needs.-
Of course medical help is important, I am not saying it’s not. But they usually do not dig themselves to deep into your particular problem. If there is no real emergency like, God forbid, cancer, they will just give you something to relief you pain, and recommend rest.For them you are just another patient, and they will never know your body as well as you do. (or should know)

#6

[QUOTE=minaret;3821]…
I practice savasana on a mat on a tiled floor for 20-30 mins, with 5-10 mins of tensing and relaxing individual groups of muscles, then 15-20 mins of deep relaxtion; sometimes I use someone else’s tape or CD and sometimes I repeat my own relaxing messages, or a CD I made for my students. When my neck is really bad, I cant relax those musles at will and put a small neck pillow under my neck which creates more of a hollow and another under my knees, sometimes another under the small of my back…[/QUOTE]

So am I to understand that this is your entire yoga practice, has been for a number of years, and you are not doing sarvangasana at all? You understand my confusion right? You were healthy until two years ago. Now you’ve shared your practice and there seems to be nothing to it that might be the origin of the chronic issue in your neck. Two years ago, what occured I am wondering.

If you could flesh out some details then an appropriate picture of you can be crafted. And thus an appropriate response to what appears to be a call for assistance.

What style of yoga are you teaching, practicing. Is this practice you outline only been going for two years since the neck issue cropped up? If so what were you doing previously. There’s just a glaring gap of missing info which handcuffs me from meeting your request for advice.

More from you will equal more from me.

#7

I was taught and have been teaching hatha yoga from my teacher who was a hatha and Iyenger teacher. I took my instructor training with the Yoga For Health Foundation in Bedford UK. I would describe my style of teaching as gentle as I seem to attract beginner and new students with various injuries. Though for my own practice it is much stronger. I used to do a full range of poses as I had no limits on my physical body. but in the last two years I do not do shoulderstand or headstand, but practice for at least an hour a day with a 20-30 minute relaxation.

Old injuries that might impact: When I was 2 I fell down the stairs with no apparant after effects. When I was 45 I suffered whiplash in a car accident. I started to get headaches but a chiropractor said I had a 99.9% perfect spine and sent me away and the headaches eventually subsided. But I did feel then that my neck had started to go out of alingment and suffered from constant shoulder tension and had monthly back, shoulder and neck massages and have them ever since. more of my practice since then is on the upper body, though I dont neglect the lower body. I also hike and cycle and am helping my husband renovate a house (lifting, painting, gardening). A recent chiropracter has informed me that my left leg is slightly longer than my right.

During the JFS I discovered:
R dorsiflexion slightly greater than the left
R dorsiflexion with inversion slightly greater than left
During hip external rotation the left hip feels stiffer
Spine extension: SCM and mid trapezius feels tight
Wrist flextion: L is slightly greater
Elbow extension: Both shoulders feel tense
Shoulder extension: tendency to raise both shoulders
Neck flextion: tension in mid and lower trapezius
Neck latel flexion: tension and slight trembling between shoulders

Many thanks for any comments.

#8

Also I should add that before the car incident I sprained my left ankle when I fell in a pothole in the road, then 3 years later I sprained the right ankle when hiking on a slippery mountainside.

#9

Great! Thank you.
Are you able to do garudasan in virasan?
And what is JFS please?

#10

Hi again

what is gaurudasan in virasan please? I’m afraid I was only taught the English names?

I apologise for typing the short version of Mukanda’s Joint Freeing series (JFS)

Thankyou.

#11

"In cases like yours you should concentrate on the aching parts, determine the cause, what usually is a strenght inbalance between antagonist muscles of the particular joint, or articular stiffness - due to loss of elascticity of it’s soft tissues. Age, unilateral use, or overtraining, all can cause such symptoms.

Sometimes we get to rigid in our practice. We think we should do this or that, when in fact we should let our body tell us, what it needs."

I very much agree on your observations Hubert. Thank you for reminding me. Without a teacher and with a reasonably healthy body I think I have become v lazy, ignoring my own defects. I have always been a great believer in allowing my body to dictate my practice, though perhaps I have become too reliant an a particular set of routines.

#12

No apologies necessary.

Virasana in English is hero’s pose.
Garudasana can best be described as an intertwining of the uper limbs and the lower limbs. That is the arms wrap about each other and the legs wrap about each other. In the example I am inquiring about, the student is in Hero’s Pose so the legs are NOT in garudasan.

It would be best to observe you obviously.
I’ve re-read your original post.
I was asking about poses where you might learn to engage and develop the serratus anterior. This mmuscles is the reciprocol inhibitor for the upper fibers of the trapezius (=neck) and might, when developed, provide you some relief.

There is a peer of mine in the UK. He’s teaching in central london.
His name is Drew Stallcop. You can find him using google. He and I are both students of Aadil Palkhivala and I believe Drew would be very helpful.
I’ve refered several UK folks his way.

I’m not turning you away but rather turning you to a better use of your time.
I think your neck needs attention I cannot provide from here.

#13

Thank you so much for your comments. I can see the sense in engaging and developing serratus anterior. And I will look up Drew when I’m next likely to go to the UK. I am pleased to say that for the last seven days I have done nothing but the JFS and neck strengthening from his book on structural yoga and am already feeling the benefits. Om Shanti.

#14

Minaret,

Thank you for your posts here and I am hopeful that you will find JFS to be both helpful in evaluating your muscular balance and also a restorative practice on it’s own. I am checking in here to see if you are asking for specific advice about asana practice as it relates to your personal condition or if you are sharing your experience with the community, not necessarily wanting to be told what to do… Injuries can be humbling, instructive, and compassion building events. I am sure you are learning much from this which will benefit your students and deepen your understanding of yourself.

Namaste,
Chandra

#15

Chandra thank you for responding. I would have to say I am very greedy, I want both! I would love advice on asana practice for this condition and I am also sure it will help others with their knowledge base. As a teacher, I am humbled by this condition and perhaps it shows a gap in my own training which I would like to fill. Namaste.

#16

Minaret,

Sorry for delay in responding. You are familiar with Mukunda’s work and doing some of the JFS. Your body readings are suggesting overuse of supraspinatus (muscle which raises the shoulder and shoulder blade) and weakness of lower trapezius (muscle which lowers the shoulder blade) and possible weakness of sternocleidomastoid (SCM) or large muscle of side of neck. JFS movements for shoulders can be used lying flat on your back. To help you isolate the movements to stabilize the shoulder blade, keep them (the shoulder blades) flat against the floor as you do flexion, internal and external rotation. Instructions for strengthening SCM are also in his book. Further, by training awareness of keeping shoulders “B&D” (back and down!) during all yogasana you are more likely to avoid overuse of supraspinatus which is often a culprit in rotator cuff injuries. Finally, the advice given by Inner Athlete is valuable - someone who can see you move, and observe you in person is ideal. His suggestion of Garudasan - arms only - is good for stretch to rotator cuff muscles, but should be done very gently if there is injury/pain. Work to strengthen imbalanced tone should be done too.

By the way, M is doing a training in London. You can check his web site for dates and perhaps have a chance to learn more about his methods there.

Namaste,
Chandra

#17

Thank you for the detailed advice, which I have started to put into practice. I am sure this will help others. Om Shanti.