Contemplating and questioning the different yoga paths

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#1

Hello! I hope everyone is doing well today :slight_smile:

I am currently writing a thesis on yoga (for my undergraduate degree) and with all the yoga books I’ve been reading, the same question keeps popping into my mind so I’d love to get some feedback on it.

All of the books I read about yoga explain the differences between the different yoga “paths” – ex. karma, hatha, jnana, bhakti, mantra, etc.
What I’m wondering is… does choosing one path over another mean you understand less of what yoga is about? Shouldn’t you have an understanding and embrace ALL paths of yoga as they are all connected? I guess I’m trying to understand exactly what yoga is. I know to be on the path of the ‘yogi’ does not just mean to practice the physical exercises but it seems to me that the idea of all these different yoga paths seems to imply that.

I hope this question makes sense.

#2

Sometimes there can be several paths at the same time for the practitioner. Or they can overlap each other.

When you do something for others its karma, when you do mantra its mantra. One can choose one path but will surely later cross another. Isnt it great that there is different paths for different persons needs. Not all could start by karma yoga as it implies losing for some. But at a later point giving will not feel like losing.

But if you need a more advanced explanation im sure someone here can give it to you, or maybe you could google it.

#3

Supmjay,

Not a question to be taken lightly.

Most often, a yoga aspirant already has some personal disposition that aligns them more or less, or inspires them, to follow one path more so than another: whether it be more physical, philosophical, or devotional, etc. Any one of these may be a point of departure and may continue to fulfill that person for their entire lifetime. There may be little need to cross paths, or it might be a natural outcome. However, built into the 4 paths of yoga, raja, karma, jnana, and bhakti, is a hierarchy based on the capacity of “human experience.” It can be difficult to begin with something more subtle and progress to the more gross. For that reason, many aspirants begin to explore alternate paths.

For example, some aspects of yoga (and life in general) are of a more emotional or mental nature: they involve the mind, the senses, our emotions and perceptions. These are less so within our capacity to change than are our actions: our bodies and habits. Action is really the only thing we have immediate and direct control of, and for that reason is on the path of raja yoga: the way of action, or the “royal” way. All the rest follows. In other words, through raja yoga, through our actions, habits and our bodies, many of the obstacles to the heart and mind are removed, but not vice versa. This is only a further example of a more natural progression: from gross the subtle. While raja may not be the place for everyone to start, it is inevitably a path they must cross.

I hope that sheds some light.

peace,
siva

#4

The Four Traditional Paths towards Yoga

1.) Karma (karma)
2.) Bhakti (buck-tee)
3.) Jnana (gyana)
4.) Raja (raaj)

Jnana Yoga: is the path of knowledge, wisdom, introspection and contemplation. It involves deep exploration of the nature our being by systematically exploring and setting aside false identities through self inquiry.

Bhakti Yoga: is the path of devotion, emotion, love, compassion, and service to the Absolute/others. All actions are done in the context of remembering the unity of the Absolute.

Karma Yoga: is the path of action, service to others, mindfulness, and remembering the levels of our being while fulfilling our karmic actions in the world.

Raja Yoga: is a comprehensive method that emphasizes meditation while encompassing the whole of Yoga. It directly deals with the encountering and transcending thoughts of the mind.

NOTE: While a Yogi or Yogini may have a predisposition or focus towards one of the four paths the other three are not forsaken rather there is a blending of all four i.e.:

Jnana Yoga: While Jnana Yoga deals with knowledge, wisdom, introspection and contemplation, everybody has a mind and at some point will need to examine it, reflection.

Bhakti Yoga: All people will experience emotions such as love, compassion, and devotion at points along the journey, regardless of which of the four paths of Yoga is predominant.

Karma Yoga: Nobody can live in a body and the world without doing actions. Even an ascetic living in a Himalayan cave has to do some form of actions and thus some degree of Karma Yoga is essential.

Raja Yoga: Everybody will become still and quite from sadhana or spiritual practices, will naturally encounter and deal with attractions and aversion and will meditate, thus touching on Raja Yoga.

~Paraphrased from Swami J?s website, I think.

#5

To what Siva and Ray have already said so nicely, I would just lend some more context.

At the heart of many Vedic traditions is a multi-tier perception of the world and of each of its objects that refers to a spectrum of gross to subtle elements. Some refer to it as body-mind-soul, some prefer 5 enveloping layers (called sheaths), some express it as 5 basic elements (earth, water, air, fire and akash) and some use a classical model of physical, astral and causal bodies.

The types of yoga are tailored to suit where your awareness is located and is in line with your karmic disposition.

  1. Karma Yoga, is about bodily actions of one who is totally immersed in the body who is taught how to dedicate all actions to the divine being so that one controls the body and not the other way around;

  2. Bhakti Yoga, is the same at the emotional level to subjugate the subtle astral body

  3. Jnana Yoga, is at the intellectual level to subjugate the causal body

Raja Yoga is different. In all the three above, mind is a catalyst, a tool to bring about the subjugation. Here, however, mind itself is the target. Though enlightenment is possible through any one of the yoga paths, raja yoga is tricky and challenging. It appears to be meant for those who have tremendous dissecting ability that may pull them perpetually in plural directions, unless they learn to concentrate, use mind’s power and ultimately set the very mind aside!

In a very broad sense, the human history seems to have also evolved through a Hunter-agrarian state where physical action was prominent, then emergence of religions teaching devotion and rituals that catered to emotions more than action and finally today?s world full of systems ? less or more complex ? a product of intellectual genius. Probably, it synchronizes with a preference for karma yoga, bhakti yoga and jnana yoga respectively. Many people believe that now onwards is a time for raja yoga.

Ultimately, however, Shri Krishna the author of the epic Bhagwad-Geeta should have the last word. He says ?all yoga paths are equally valid and it is impossible to call one better than the rest, just as a mother of four children won?t be able to choose?.

#6

It is true, as others have said above, that each path is suited to a different temperament. However, I have found in my own analysis that choosing either exclusively a Jnana, Bhakti or Karma yoga path leads to uneven development. If you choose Jnana, you develop the head more than the heart; if you choose bhakti, you develop the heart more than the head and if you choose karma you put others before yourself. The pitfalls are the path of Jnana can lead to making you highly dogmatic, scholarly and intellectual, floating in an abstract world of ideas; the path of bhakti can lead to making you highly emotional, sentimental and superstitious, stupefying your intellect, and choosing the path of karma can lead to making you religious, zealot, fundamentalist and embroil you into politics. I have seen so many examples in the present and in the past of people who have fallen into these pitfalls.

Raja Yoga, also known as Ashtanga Kriya Yoga is not a path, but the science behind Yoga, which is also known as the scientific form of Yoga. It incorporates elements from all the paths of Yoga in a systematic and structured manner, leading to a balanced development. It is also known as the fastest route to enlightenment. I would recommend to most people to take up Raja Yoga, irrespective of their temperament.

#7

thanks everybody,

siva

#8

Surya maybe thats why buddha said follow the middle way, as he saw people were extreme.

Btw nice to see you back again.

#9

Thank you for all these responses. I appreciate all of them!

“Not all could start by karma yoga as it implies losing for some. But at a later point giving will not feel like losing.” fakeyogis, I loved this statement.

ray_killeen: If I may rephrase my questions because I don’t think it came across completely clear

I definitely understand the connections between all paths and how, ultimately, we all practice these paths in some way. I am just wondering how one person can only be focused on, to give one example, the raja path without also being on the jnana path. If someone only practices the physical elements of yoga without learning about the philosophy and other elements… is that individual still considered to be on a path of yoga?

#10

Surya Deva: I wish I had read your post before my previous response! It resonated quite a bit with me.
That is very much how I feel as I’ve developed my own yoga practice. I understand the importance of each path, however, I wonder if choosing one particular path over another can lead to an imbalance, especially if one path is highly dominant over the rest.

#11

Supmay the problem by choosing one path is the human mind, im not saying this is like this for everyone. But wherever you look in the world you have people misidentifying. Like im a ny ranger supporter. Im a obama voter, etc all this leads to wrong identification as well as dividing to different groups thus separating and sometimes even figthing.

Best would be to do your actions and sadhana but dont identify one self as the path following as it leads to wrong identification.
But i think it is also possible if one identify with his/her path that this identification might lessen over time when one is doing progress.

#12

[QUOTE=fakeyogis;82182]
Best would be to do your actions and sadhana but dont identify one self as the path following as it leads to wrong identification.
[/QUOTE]

Yes. The path you choose is selfreaffirming.

At some point you will find some affirmation of what you’re doing on your own. You come to trust it because of the wisdom it reveals to you: you experience a result, it leads you to take a next step, and you experience the same, etc. You’ll put all books, teachings and our suggestions down and listen to, and see and feel just where your path lies for yourself, and you will either be fulfilled, or you will wander some more, and yet you’ll still be on your own path. So, as fakeyogis says, just practice and don’t worry. The wisdom is already there: there is only the doing.

siva

#13

[QUOTE=supmjay;82178]Thank you for all these responses. I appreciate all of them!

“Not all could start by karma yoga as it implies losing for some. But at a later point giving will not feel like losing.” fakeyogis, I loved this statement.

ray_killeen: If I may rephrase my questions because I don’t think it came across completely clear

I definitely understand the connections between all paths and how, ultimately, we all practice these paths in some way. I am just wondering how one person can only be focused on, to give one example, the raja path without also being on the jnana path. If someone only practices the physical elements of yoga without learning about the philosophy and other elements… is that individual still considered to be on a path of yoga?[/QUOTE]

Yoga is union from that which a human has never been separate, true inner nature, is not the very act of consciousness a path towards yoga, and is not this consciousness a spontaneous happening.

#14

Siva, Ray, very well said. Thanks.

#15

[QUOTE=supmjay;82179]Surya Deva: I wish I had read your post before my previous response! It resonated quite a bit with me.
That is very much how I feel as I’ve developed my own yoga practice. I understand the importance of each path, however, I wonder if choosing one particular path over another can lead to an imbalance, especially if one path is highly dominant over the rest.[/QUOTE]

Yes, I have personally witnessed these imbalances in people I have encountered practicing Yoga. Some examples

Hatha Yoga: Typically, the average Western yogi. There is undue emphasis on body image, weight and flexibility. The spiritual aspects of Yoga are mostly unimportant, in some cases even objectionable. There was a member that posted here Yogiadam in the past who appreciated the Yoga exercises, but complained about the spiritual "mumbo jumbo"
Bhakti Yoga: A friend of mine is a very devoted mata bhakta, he never misses his daily prayers and occasional major religious festivals. He constantly listens to bhajans(hymns) However, he is one of the densest people I know in terms of intelligence. Very gullible and non-discerning, and superstitious. He does not challenge traditions, but follows them blindly.
Jnana Yoga: In my visits to the major Vedanta ashrams in India, I came across loads of Vedanta scholars(swamis, pandits etc) who were very knowledgeable and well read in the scriptures and could quote them verbatim easily, but they seemed to suffer from the same character flaws as the average human being: Anger, ego, greed, pride(lots of it) They also seemed to evince negative attitudes towards Raja Yoga. One Swami, whom I really admired before I went to India, Swami Dayananda(Chinmayananda’s pupil) even mocked the Yogi’s pursuit of spiritual experiences as “pointless, special effects” and argued that enlightenment is purely cognitive, and can never be experienced(I had long protracted debates with his disciples on this issue)
One Western swami living in India, taught a combination of Yoga and Vedanta, and faced persecution from the swami order for it)

This compartmentalization of Yoga into many kinds of yogas is based on a modern interpretation by Swami Vivekananda of the Gita. Based on my own interpretation, the Gita does not prescribe many yogas, but rather it describes the many kinds of spiritual approaches or methods. If we combine them all systematically we end up with the Patanjali’s Raja Yoga. As Raja Yoga is Ashtanga, it ensures that all aspects of one are developed ethical, physical, mental, intellectual etc, leading to an all round and even development.

#16

[QUOTE=ray_killeen;82192]Yoga is union from that which a human has never been separate, true inner nature, is not the very act of consciousness a path towards yoga, and is not this consciousness a spontaneous happening.[/QUOTE]

Ray,

Woah nellie, slow down: the very “ACT of consciousness?” What is that? A path toward yoga, a spontaneous happening? This is quite confusing.

Is “consciousness” an act? Is a “spontaneous happening” a path toward yoga? Are we not separate from from our “true inner nature?” If not, then why yoga?

It need not be so complex: yoga is a union between ha and tha, and therein lies our “true inner nature.”

What do you think?

siva

#17

A Mindful daily practice is all that is needed for the beginner imho love ,devotion , surrender …cheers

#18

Fixed: I very much agree with you. Lately I had not been practicing daily as the stresses of school have been getting to me. Recently, I began my daily practice again and I can once again feel the immense changes in my body (more energy, less stress, calmer, etc.)

#19

[QUOTE=siva;82235]Is “consciousness” an act?[/QUOTE]

Is it not the grand act, the ultimate play in illusion; do you consider yourself this body, mind, consciousness, panchaprana or the everlasting without beginning/end timeless/spaceless original state of awareness that arises as a happening for no apparent reason from the Absolute, or how every you like to describe IT.

[QUOTE=siva;82235]Is a “spontaneous happening” a path toward yoga?[/QUOTE]

Is it not the only path, do you claim ownership for your thoughts or do they happen so quickly you may have failed to notice the spontaneity from which they emerge, is not there an innate desire compelling you to seek Truth or do you consider yourself directly responsible for all your endeavors.

[QUOTE=siva;82235] If not, then why yoga?[/QUOTE]

Without applying tremendous effort perhaps one’s mind cannot be convinced that its boundaries can take you nowhere beyond the mind yet this is the very nature of minds filter ego, confident is can answer all questions, until it becomes hopefully exhausted it thinks everything is explainable by the mind, even the infinite which lies beyond the finite mind, there are endless ways of yoga each of them a happening.

[QUOTE=siva;82235]Are we not separate from our “true inner nature?”[/QUOTE]

It is no pleasant task realizing the “seeker was the sought”, spiritual awakening is a brutal undertaking, deprograming a lifetime of conceptual nonsense, recognizing nothing is to be gained, only lost, as if someone stirring you from an enjoyable dream into an emergency in so called reality, yet you were never separate from the dream or the so called reality.

[QUOTE=siva;82235] It need not be so complex: yoga is a union between ha and tha, and therein lies our “true inner nature.”[/QUOTE]

Setting aside complexity seems to be key, as spontaneous shifts in consciousness occur one stops seeking what you do not have, finding what you have never lost.

Yoga is more of a spontaneous merging between ha and tha, with “true inner nature”, not a mindful choice.

Ironically expansion of my original statement has now become more complex, smiles.

#20

[QUOTE=ray_killeen;82432]

Ironically expansion of my original statement has now become more complex, smiles.[/QUOTE]

Ray,

Not more complex, but more convoluted. No offense, but what you have here is psychobabble, and I hope to show you why, with respect.

[QUOTE=ray_killeen;82432]
Is it not the grand act, the ultimate play in illusion…or how every you like to describe IT.[/QUOTE]

“Consciousness” is not an “act,” for it were, there must also be an actor. My body, mind, prana, the “everlasting without beginning/end…” (whatever you mean by that) does not “happen” for any reason at all, but simply IS…WITHOUT reason, which is not the same as “for NO apparent” reason. No act: no actor.

[QUOTE=ray_killeen;82432]
…arises as a happening for no apparent reason from the Absolute,[/QUOTE]

Consciousness IS “Absolute,” and does not “arise from” IT. I think much of what you say will change if you contemplate this.

[QUOTE=ray_killeen;82432]
Yoga is more of a spontaneous merging between ha and tha, with “true inner nature”, not a mindful choice.[/QUOTE]

I wish this were so. Yoga is not a spontaneous path, but a learned one, and it exists because we ARE separate from our own “true nature.” The question is by what are we separate: that which yoga illuminates. Ha and tha do not merge spontaneously but come about through action: that which is mindful.

What say you?

siva