Cults In Yoga - Siddha / Brahma Kumaris / Sahaja Yoga, etc (often non physical Yoga)

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#101

Buddhi evolving from Prakriti and Samkya Karika is clear that Enlightenment is full discrimination between Purusha and Prakriti. To speak that “your buddhi that you need to sharpen” is nonsense.

How can you get to full discrimination of something, before you get to half discrimination of something? How can you get to half discrimination of something, before you get to a quarter discirmination?

To develop such great powers of discrimination that you can discriminate every degree between purusha and prakriti you first need to sharpen that faculty of discirmination. You cannot even discriminate an unheathily obese woman whose mobility is severely compromised from a healthy person.

If somebodies buddhi is working properly they will spot everything. Having a very precise intellect/buddhi leads to a very precise and fine consciousness. You will spot everything. Nobody will be able to pull the wool over your eyes.

I am an intelligent person, it is hard to deceive me. Many have tried to fool me, but I have such a good intellect, I spot it. The BK’s tried - they failed; Sahaja tried - they failed; Anandamarga tried - they failed. Is it because I am stubborn and hold on firmly to my beliefs? No, because even my beliefs cannot deceive me. When my intellect spots errors in my belief, I throw the errors out. I stick to facts always. And the fact here is clear: your guru is a fraud. I can see it loud and clear. You cannot see it, because you cannot spot it. This is why I know you are very low down on the spiritual ladder. In fact more than half of the people reading this thread can spot it. This puts you down even lower.

#102

The Real knowledge will come to you when you become The Spirit-Atma. Then you will know what is SAT-Truth, because the attributes of Atma are SAT-CHIT-ANANDA.

In this way there is no need to do discrimination because you will know the Truth.

BTW, quality of discrimination is coming from Hamsa chakra.

#103

And to get to the atman and hence ultimate truth requires ridding yourself of all vrittis in the mind. How is that done? Through discrimination.

You are not going to get to the final stage, without first passing the first stage. If you refuse to use your intellect, like any part of your body-mind system that is not used, it will die. If it dies you will lose what is needed to clear up those vrittis. If you are not going to clear up those vrittis you will not get to the atman - and hence SAT.

Like I said, your mind is full of garbage. You cant spot it because your buddhi is poor. You will remain like this for much of, if not all of your life. The longer you remain like this the more and more your buddhi will die. You are not growing in spirt, but dying in spirit. Just as an animal that gets ensnared gradually dies in the trap. You are dying in Shri Mataji’s trap. There is no hope for you.

#104

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;56659]And to get to the atman and hence ultimate truth requires ridding yourself of all vrittis in the mind. How is that done? Through discrimination.

You are not going to get to the final stage, without first passing the first stage. [/QUOTE]We are living in 21 century. We are not cooking with wood.

In 21 century it is not possible to get results with old methods.
With Sahaja yoga, Kundalini will awaken your Atmaand will establish SAT-CHIT-ANANDA within you.

I am sorry that sahaja yogis didn?t clarify this important fact to you.

#105

Shri Mataji: You have to become the Spirit

#106

Seeker33,

Does Shri Mataji ever claim to have mastered physical Yoga or been very physically active in life? Show us few photos of her doing Yoga poses.

It is common knowldege she is grossly obese and overweight and cannot possibly be in perfect health - [B]does she know better about health and medical science than any Doctor? [/B]I think not! Well any Doctor will tell you she is grossly obese, needs a diet badly and cannot possibly be in the best of health, carrying such bodyfat of course can lead to diabetes, heart problems, etc, etc.

[B]Why can’t Shri Mataji control a basic thing like appetite?[/B]

[B]Serious question - do you believe she is above Buddha, Jesus , Krisna, etc??? Or at least equal with them? Do you believe she is above Paramahansa Yogananda, etc, etc i.e. all the Yogi greats past & present??? [/B]
[B][I]Here are Shri Mataji’s claims about herslef in her own words [/I][/B]http://www.sahajacult.com/claims.htm

Grossly overweight (click next for more photos) :
http://www.sahajacult.com/photos/0001.htm

[B][I]Shri Mataji refuses point blank (as does Sai Baba, etc) to prove her claims and cites all manner of feeble excuses : [/I][/B]http://www.sahajacult.com/press/indian_press_articles.htm

[B][U]It is common knowledge Shri Mataji learnt her trade from a Master Conman - Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh OSHO , it is well documented including several photos of her attending talks and meetings with Osho. Note too - she attacks Osho now, as she wants all the limelight on herself. [/U][/B]

#107

lets not get obsessed in physical plane, much. The Kundalini is in The spirit.[B][/B]

#108

[QUOTE=MindNinja;56663]It is common knowledge Shri Mataji learnt her trade from a Master Conman - Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh OSHO , it is well documented including several photos of her attending talks and meetings with Osho. Note too - she attacks Osho now, as she wants all the limelight on herself. [/QUOTE]Osho and Shri Mataji

#109

We are living in 21 century. We are not cooking with wood.

In 21 century it is not possible to get results with old methods.

We are living in the 21st century, but our body and minds are the same as they were 5000 years ago, as they were 10,000 years ago, as they were 100,000 years ago. The science of Yoga applies to all humans no matter what time period you are in.

You have vrittis, the humans 5000 years ago had vrittis. In order to realise the atman just as the humans 5000 years ago had to clear away their vrittis to leave a pure mind without vrittis which then reflects the true nature of anything it is put on, likewise so will you. How is that done? through discrimination.

When your consciousness becomes finer and finer this discrimination power comes naturally. You can detect every subtle difference. But like I said you cannot even detect that your guru is unheathily obese. You cannot detect very gross difference, forget about very subtle difference :wink:

The truth is people of your kind live in a fantasy that you are self-realised and prefer this fantasy over reality. You convince yourself your in connection with the atman and that your method gives you fast enlightenment - and what do you need to confirm that? A cool breeze. And that is enough. But as much as you can fool yourself, you can’t fool nature. Nature knows exactly where you are at, and it is nowhere where you think you are. Like I said you are a dying soul. There is no hope for you. You are so brainwashed those vrittis have solidified in your mind and they will remain with you even in you next life. RIP

#110

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;56669]We are living in the 21st century, but our body and minds are the same as they were 5000 years ago, as they were 10,000 years ago, as they were 100,000 years ago. [/QUOTE]In this way you are denying Evolution.
Shri Rama, Shri Krishna and Jesus came to establish different qualities within us and to support our evolution. [B]Shri Mataji came to open Sahasrara chakra.[/B]

Shri Mataji opens the Primordial Sahasrara (May 5th 1970)

#111

Nope, evolutionists do not at all support the garbage that SY teaches that each teacher came and opened up a chakra one by one and Shri Mata Ji opened the last one. According to evolutionists modern humans emerged approx 250,000 years and attained a modern human body. Even if they are wrong about 250,000 years ago and it is far older, they are right that humans have not changed anatomically since. We know this through fossil records. The oldest human fossils have the same brain capacity as humans in the 21st century.

Do you realise how many people are reading this thread right now, reading the garbage you are writing and turning against SY. You are making the worst case for SY you can possibly make, which includes posting pictures of a fat jesus to justify your unheathly fat guru :wink:

#112

Seeker 33,

[B]See my post above, can you not answer those simple questions? [/B]
Tell me also why are Shri Mataji’s speeches carefully edited or overdubbed to cover up her severe flatulence? It is well known from ex devotees and alsopeople that have interviewed her she has a severe flatulence problem and does ‘rude smells’ very frequently whilst not apologising or excusing herself once, she carries on as if nothing has happened.

#113

Seeker 33,

You are in a Cult and clearly very much in denial, that much is excusable but seriously look at the links against Sahaja Yoga in first post on this thread (then do a search for others), try as hard as it may be to look at it with an open mind. If you were not in Sahaja Yoga and someone showed you all the material by SY official sources, and all the material against them - believe me you would never ever dream of joining Sahaja Yoga. That is why the movement is very small, anyone outside it that objectively looks at it would never dream of joining it in a million years.

Look carefully at the parallels between your Cult & other Cults , here are just a few :

  1. The so called proofs - spiritual energy, the cool breeze, etc. Many other Cults have exactly the same - Scientology ‘highs’ from auditing, Mormonism - burning in the bosom when you pray to ask if it’s true, etc, etc.

  2. The leader completely unable to verify their claims and making all manner of excuses not to be independtly tested and evaluated. Critics and the Sceptic, and Science community especially in India have repeatedly asked to test Shri Mataji since the 1980’s, she has refused every time making all manner of excuses, even at times saying she would have no problem accepting then refusing to do so. Sathya Sai Baba, etc has done exactly the same. People like Sathya Sai Baba, Shri Mataji, etc know fine well they are complete charlatans and fakes, and would never risk getting completely exposed under test conditions. If what they claim to be able to do is genuine, it would be undeniable and proven true in tests.

  3. The leader tells untruths about their background, or completely changes undeniable evidence e.g. L. Ron Hubbard (Scientology) was heavily involved in the Occult, Aleister Crowley, etc incl. practicing ritual magick - the cover story later by the Scientolgists he was working as a secret agent and only involved in the occult under cover to break up the group - ha ha!

Shri Mataji studied under people like Osho (Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh) & attended numerous meetings learned a lot from such people on spirituality, and more importantly gave her a eureka moment - ‘I can run a cult too, become a leader & make some money from this racket’. The cover story from Sahaja Yoga now - Osho bowed to her and declared her a great one and predicted the wonders in enlightenment she would bring to people, eh actually he never ever did that’s why you have only Shri Mataji claiming this, and in thousands of interviews and written works - he never mentioned Shri Mataji or the wonders this great spiritual master would bring. Osho was a Master Conman Phd level, Shri Mataji studied with some of the best before making her move to start a Cult.

  1. Everything against the movement or the leader is absolutely denied or flat out ignored, even when the proof is absolutely overwhelming. It can be proven Shri Mataji’s claims and her background just like L. Ron Hubbards are full of untruths and fabrications. Those in the movement are in complete denial and the majority stay in the movement, they are so indoctrinated by the Cult. Go look at the mountain of evidence against Scientology, no wonder at Scientology orgs they block free Internet access you cannot search for anti Scientolgy sites or info.

The fact you are caught up in a Cult doesn’t mean you have to be for ther rest of your life.

#114

The cover story from Sahaja Yoga now - Osho bowed to her and declared her a great one and predicted the wonders in enlightenment she would bring to people

I find this hilarious. From what I know, read and seen of Osho, Osho would never do that. He did not have a devotional attitude - he was anti god/s. He never mentioned her anywhere, because she was just his insigificant devotee at the time, amongst other devotees. She learned how to manage a cult from him, then left and started her small group and was able to turn her small group into a larger group. She has a very wealthy husband. Did Osho ever even hear about her in his day?

#115

Surya,

"Obesity is a disease, and your guru is very obese that it compromises her mobility. "

That she is obese has nothing to do with the matter. It is simply that she is unconscious. Being obese has nothing at all to do with one’s inner awareness, there are many masters who were overweight.

#116

Surya,

"And to get to the atman and hence ultimate truth requires ridding yourself of all vrittis in the mind. "

One may be far too hypnotized by those passages in the yoga sutras. If one is truly in tune one’s original nature, then even if a million thoughts are there, it makes no difference to one’s communion. Perhaps to bring the mind to a stillness may just give you a glimpse into something beyond mind - but one has to return to the world, with all it’s shapes and forms, and live an ordinary life. If one were to remain in a thoughtless state, then one is just falling into useless passivity. An awakened consciousness is active, tremendously active, but there are very few who are capable of being involved in action without becoming entangled in action. Because of this, so many traditions from the beginning have been saying that you have to stop all your thoughts, bring the mind to a stillness - not realizing that stillness is not separate from activity. One master, Hakuin, has said that meditation in activity far surpasses meditation in stillness, because that is the true stillness. Even if you are involved in a wild storm, one can remain totally balanced and grounded, even if millions of ripples start surfacing - the mirror shines clear and bright.

#117

I answered my own question. He did know her, and this is what he said about her:

Lecture Number 6 of Rajneesh’s book The Goose Is Out states:

There are so many fools in the world that any Indian can find disciples. It is not a problem at all. Just your being Indian is enough and you are a guru. I have seen such things happening before my eyes.

One of my disciples Nirmala Srivastava has now become a great spiritual leader. Now her name is long: Her Holiness Jagatjanani - “The mother of the whole world” - Mataji Nirmalaji Srivastavaji. She was once travelling with me in a car and I passed by Muktananda’s ashram. The people staying in Muktananda’s ashram invited me to be there for a five-minute stay just to take a cup of tea, And it was a long journey so I said “There is no harm in it” Anyway I love a cup of tea. So I stayed for five minutes.

Nirmala saw Muktananda. She could not believe that this stupid-looking man - disgusting more or less a buffoon - had become a great spiritual leader.

After the tea when we re-entered the car she said, “If this man can become a spiritual leader, then why can’t I?”

I said “You can”, And she became one.

There is one man here from Australia who asked me a question, because now she is in Australia doing great spiritual work. He asked me: “Once in a while you talk about a woman Rabiya el- Adawiyat. What do you think about Mataji Nirmala Deviji? Is she also of the same category as Rabiya el-Adawiya?” The Man is here.

I know her perfectly well, for ten years she was my student,. There is nothing in it, no spirituality, no meditativeness but she got the idea from Muktananda. And it is not the only case.

#118

[QUOTE=AmirMourad;56889]Surya,

"Obesity is a disease, and your guru is very obese that it compromises her mobility. "

That she is obese has nothing to do with the matter. It is simply that she is unconscious. Being obese has nothing at all to do with one’s inner awareness, there are many masters who were overweight.[/QUOTE]

I would certainly not accept a master who is unheathily obese. If they cannot even master their own health, then what will they teach me. Shri Mataji is so obese she sinks into her chair and has mobility problems. I understand her problems have worsened now.

Whoever you accept as your master should show they are masters of their body and mind, because that is what you are going to them to learn.

#119

Seeker,

If you find that your being is fulfilled through Sahaja Yoga, then remain with it. But one should be completely straightforward with oneself and ask whether one is truly fulfilled, or whether one simply believes that one is fulfilled. For this, there is no other answer except through witnessing yourself directly in daily living, seeing how you are from moment to moment. If you have enough courage, then you will see yourself as you are without any veils or decorations, without censorship, without clinging to a sense of identity. One’s attachment to one’s identity is one of the greatest barriers for seeing oneself clearly. If you look and find that you are still unfulfilled - then obviously you are not doing something right. Those who are condemning you for being a part of Sahaja Yoga should be ignored, because they do not even realize that their condemnations is only strengthening your attachment to Sahaja Yoga. The more they condemn, the more one clings in defensiveness. Don’t be concerned with them, or anybody else. Just take a few moments and look clearly into your own situation, and perhaps some insight into the matter shall arise.

#120

One may be far too hypnotized by those passages in the yoga sutras. If one is truly in tune one’s original nature, then even if a million thoughts are there, it makes no difference to one’s communion. Perhaps to bring the mind to a stillness may just give you a glimpse into something beyond mind - but one has to return to the world, with all it’s shapes and forms, and live an ordinary life. If one were to remain in a thoughtless state, then one is just falling into useless passivity.

You don’t need thought to live your life. In fact it is when you are not thinking and doing and living, that you live your life. If your mind was completely silent. You would have none of that mental noise. Just a crystal clear consciousness revealing the essential nature of everything. I have had moments when I have much less thought, and those moments are the ones when I am in my alive state.