Hahah. Touche’
hi nichole,
your quotation was cute and childlike and there was no need to hype it but then there are just people who dont appreciate simple things in life. i am sure you will always greet the day with a happy heart and a smile on that face. keep up the quotations and we will continue reading. Om Shanti Om!
- Mel
Hello other threadparticipants,
look: I mocked this whole community and actually the whole so called “yogic” movement of the western world with my post here. How dare I. :rolleyes:
An instant later, a post appears with a quotation about how to deal with nonsense. Yes, it might be a coincidence, people even get hit by flashes and win the lottery. But it’s neither nonsense, nor the fantasy of a juvenile drug-addict to assume a correlation, because it is a very expectable and regular response to react to critcism with “it’s all nonsense!!”.
So if you guys have something a little more insightful to share, I’ll happily read and respond to it, otherwise you unfortunately have to visualize me mildly smiling about your affirmation of my impression.
====================
Edited PS@Nichole:
There is something missing between my
“Finally” (which is actually somewhat a beginning):
and
No, it mustn’t.
in the following post. I wanted to insert it later, it’s your:
It seems you and have gotten our wires crossed here, but I am hoping that they don’t have to stay this way.
I don’t edit that post because it’s pretty much exactly the top-length allowed for a post.
Hi Nichole,
well, as I just said and said before and as you say too: If you had not read my posts before you posted your nonsense-quotation, it is indeed a remarkable example of unfortunate timing. Particularly due to my already “not-so-good” opinion of this community and my prediction that people - at best - will come up with some sweet words full of understanding for the alleged immature guy who dares to falsly critizise the accomplished Yogi/nis, there indeed is no way for you to convince me that there is no correlation.
So all I can do here is telling you that I truly believe what I am saying and that I’m not about brainlessly insulting people, and if there was a way for you to convince me of yourself being truthful, I would indeed be sorry. Not overly ashamed, though, since my “conclusion” is so nearby. It’d be some sort of accident then.
However, to point that out, I have no problem with that quotation itself. It’s fine, I agree with it, as long as the nonsense isn’t (potentially) harmful. Assuming you had addressed it at me, the things I dislike about that (= addressing it at me) are:
- What I said in that linked post isn’t nonsense.
- You did not address me directly with your impression, in my opinion to avoid a discussion about my actual points
I hope that’s understood now, if not, I wouldn’t know how to further explain myself.
“Finally” (which is actually somewhat a beginning):
No, it mustn’t. But I won’t stop my criticism. I could be banned, something I wouldn’t mind. A neater solution of problematic me would though be to simply enter a discussion about my criticism. The persons I dared to critice choose to ignore me, but of course - irony again - they’re not at all responsible for anything, cuz every1 is an island and only responsible for themselves. 
Will you do that? Discuss my criticism? It all makes sense, from my viewpoint, but who knows, maybe I missed to consider some aspects and it all could be resolved easily. But people pertinaciously ignoring me point to another explantion: That I’m right and that they don’t wish to make that even more obvious. The problem with you potentially discussing my criticism is, that I point at individuals. I say “this guy is doing this and that, and for these reasons, I think it is hypocrisy”. You might not want to do such a thing. Hm. Maybe I can picture a behaviour without naming the persons who behave that way, though we all know who I am talking about, and you can comment on that? Do as you wish:
Let’s say there is Yoga-teacher who continously states that learning Yoga without the personal guidance of a teacher, but only via books, videos and the options of the internet, is not only impossible, but will even lead to mistakes, that have to be unlearned and most probably to severe injuries. A fine example is this thread, but you find this over and over again, which is very discouraging and casts those “shadows of doubt”. I cannot have a teacher, because the one closest by is so far away, that I’d have to leave the house for more than 3 hours, which is impossible right now. So I am in that indeed unfortunate position to have to learn and practice on my own. If I’d buy these allegations, I would have stopped my practice months ago, if I had been aware of them, never picked up the practice. Unthinkable, when I see the awesome effects my daily Asana-sessions have on me.
But the problem here isn’t actually that statement. I disagree, but I can accept the standpoint, sure it is more probable to do something wrong if you are a beginner on your own. But the same Yoga-teacher says things like people have to be encouraged and they have to supported on their way. That, in my perception, is hypocrisy or at least foolery, because it does not encourage to be threatened all the time. Much more hypocritical I find that the one who thinks that you cannot learn Yoga without the personal guidance of a teacher, who is in the room and looking over one’s practices, gives guidance over the internet, here on this forum. If that is so dangerous, I don’t understand why he spends such a lot of time doing what he declines so passionately. And not only does he teach the impossible, he even does therapy via a forum. Someone with severe injuries or other health-issues can write a few sentences about their problems, and receives treatment. 
And five minutes later again the litany about how even people in perfect health won’t learn some Asanas via a compendium of books and videos created by the greatest masters alive, that (the media) have proven to work millions of times.
It’s like you’d think that laying cables on your own is dangerous (which it is) and cannot be done without a cable-laying-master’s personal guidance - and then you tell people how to lay cables via a forum, after having read one post by them with no way to judge how smart and reasonable they are. So if that was my opinion, I’d do anything but act against it on a daily base. I still could be present in forums, for example with discussing the theory, particularly the scriptures. But if someone would asked me about an Asana I’d say: No sorry, that is too dangerous and I can’t be involved with potentially hurting you, please find a teacher to guide you.
Outside idiocy I can think of only one explanation for such contradictory behaviour: If you put links to your commercial websites in your forum-signature, it’s a neat way to advertise and thereby make yourself known and thereby: Money money money.
Do you have another one?
Next thing: A Yoga teacher moans about how Yoga is watered down by so many Yoga teachers and abused for other purposes than it’s intended for. He also claims to be one of the best Yoga-teachers in the whole world. What kind of Yoga does he offer? Yoga for NASCAR-drivers, football- and basketball-players, alltogether athlets of the violent multi-million-dollar sport industry. Is that the purpose of Yoga? The Yoga Sutras at least mention nothing of that. The same counts for using Yoga for therapy to recover from injuries or to cure other health-problems. That is not what Yoga is intended for too. I’m not saying using Yoga for such purposes is wrong, it’s just a contradiction and therefore again hypocrisy to moan about abuse, claiming to represent the real deal, and then not doing so. It’s also simply a lie and some sort of slander, as other Yoga teachers are accused of something that is allegedly wrong or at least deplorable.
Can you explain that?
And I give you one more thing to not overblow you (which I probably already did): Every day I read on this forum how super tolerant everbody is, how they accept others, no matter where they stand and how evolved they are. Right? You read it all the time. But when these claims are taken to the test, for example right here in this thread, where - let’s say - an unevolved idiot doesn’t know better, they fail to live up to their standards. As long as you’re in line, they do, they tolerate you. Why wouldn’t they. But just step outside the customs with half a foot and you’ll see what that tolerance really is worth: Nothing. I mean, I really don’t mind, and it’s the reaction of regular people, but it’s even insinuated that I am a drug addict. Some idiot, a troll, someone who should just fuck the hell off. Again: In this case a normal reaction to my provocations, that I itself don’t criticise, questionable it only is that it’s performed by a community that pictures itself as breathing tolerance and openness and acceptance of everybody. Also, that it came this far with evil me is because I have been ignored with my issues for months. It started when I held the view that pain is a normal aspect of an Asana-practice. I was informed that the conversation was over and that an Asana-practice that involves pain isn’t Yoga. No explanation, no argumentation, not pages of quotations of some of the greates living Yoga-masters backing up my viewpoint made a difference. I was like “wtf??!?!?”. Same thing recently with Sunyuting by Pandara, he stated some indeed questionable stuff, but was he enlightened in a positive way? Nope, he was accused and rebuked and threatened (to hurt himself more than others) - and nothing more. I remember a thread of a girl (or woman) from China, she linked an article by some Yoga-teacher who “confessed” to be non-vegetarian. That girl from China then made a list of unyogic things she does. God, was she attacked, here is the thread, her words were turned around in her mouth (charliedharma) and our awesome knower of scriptures, Asuri, even suggested pointlessly that she was lying about her location. Bah bah bah, I was so disgusted. That was pure rudeness and she was understandably pissed; she never posted on this forum again. If you look closely, you also find someone moaning about Yoga, not having much Yoga in it and several times the claim of being oh-so-ultra-super-tolerant, in my head appeared in big glowing letters the word: HYPOCRITE; really a must-read-thread to understand my criticism of this community.
What kind of tolerance is it, that only tolerates like-minded people? None.
So what’s up, get my point? Are these hallucinations or do you find some truth in here? And I could go on for hours, the alcoholism-thing recently, pulled of by a “healer”, immodestly claiming to be one great addition to this forum: Oh my god, how can one be so tasteless and ignorant.
But I gotta go now. 
Hiya Q,
I’m not sure where your post is where you mocked the yogic movement in the west, but I’m well known to call some aspects of it BS, myself. And I’m totally with you on the correlation you speak of. Where you lost me is after Nichole made a rather sincere attempt to affirm that it was just a coincidence, you continued on with your conspiracy theory. And that, is, well, nonsense. And ironic.
With that said, don’t take it personally. I’m so full of BS and nonsense that I would have been Dr Seuss’s best friend.
edit Found your “discerning post”. And in my opinion, it is not nonsense.
Hi David, I linked the post in my first post of this thread. However, I’m not angry about anything, but my son is on my back so I must go now.
Hiya Q,
As I edited in my post above, I found it, and, as I mentioned, I don’t think it’s nonsense. Nor did I accuse you of being angry. I actually agree with some of your statements, including:
And I give you one more thing to not overblow you (which I probably already did): Every day I read on this forum how super tolerant everbody is, how they accept others, no matter where they stand and how evolved they are. Right? You read it all the time. But when these claims are taken to the test, for example right here in this thread, where - let’s say - an unevolved idiot doesn’t know better, they fail to live up to their standards. As long as you’re in line, they do, they tolerate you.
Make absolutely no mistake, this is something that, especially as the owner of this forum, I have to deal with a LOT. I am forever getting PM’s from people who are upset with what someone on this forum said. As the person with the power to ban, where do I draw the line of acceptance? I consider myself extremely accepting, but if someone threatens another with physical violence, do I let them continue? I can see both sides of the coin. Do I accept the person who is threatening violence knowing that they’re simply someone who might be in pain, who is traumatized, who is coming from ego, etc? Or do I accept the person who feels threatened who is coming from a place of fear?
Do I accept you, a person who is obviously full of passion and has taken many steps back to evaluate what he sees going on and isn’t afraid to single people out? Or do I accept the person who you’re focusing on who gets their feelings hurt for various reasons or might feel threatened by you for other reasons?
Or do I accept everyone, do nothing, grab some popcorn, and see how things play out?
What would you do in my position? How, based upon your understanding of yoga, would you proceed?
Quetzalcoatl, even if you did mock the whole yoga community, I really don’t think a lot of people care that much. I know I don’t… I am pretty sure that most yoga people know that not EVERYONE is gonna understand, agree with, or like yoga. And that’s ok. This world would be pretty boring if we were all clones of one another.
For the record, I would like to say that I have not asked David (the owner, administrator and sole moderator of this forum) to ban Quetzalcoatl, or to moderate his membership, or to edit his posts and contributions in any way.
Q: I am hosting a gathering for husband’s birthday in our home today, so I’m just checking in real quickly now. I’ll take some time to read your recent post in this thread more thoroughly over the next few days, though I am presently unsure if I will have much to add to your invited discussion. I simply may continue to have nothing to say about it, or have much of an opinion about what you’ve added, which doesn’t mean that I haven’t read it or considered what you’ve shared. I am also considering too that it may, or may not, be wasted effort on my part to accept an invitation for discussion by a person who thinks me dishonest and covert in my actions. Honestly, this situation is just not that provoking, or demanding of an investment of time and effort from me; even though the lack of harmony between you and me is not my ideal way to be with another person.
I used to be on the forum quite a bit when I volunteered as administrator here, but now I log on here and there to take quick peeks for threads that pique my interest to add to – not all do, nor do I have time to read and add to them all, as I work and have a family. Your recent post in another thread, with regards to Pandara has caught my eye, but I haven’t been drawn to read the entire thread thoroughly, or to participate in it. I now see through your profile that I haven’t added to, or read, most threads you have been a contributor to. As I stated before, I really don’t know you well as a member here, and it is the last few days that I am becoming curious and taking more notice.
My real quick log-on has lingered, so I am going to scoot now. More soon, as I am called to.
I hope you enjoy your day with your son.
Your own,
Nichole
ps Q: Are you familiar with Dr. Suess’s writings? He is a wild and crazy guy! My take on the quote that I add as the original post to be encouraging nonsense as a playful part of our lives, not as a means to “deal” with, or to mitigate nonsense. The quote is not critical of nonsense, but rather it invites it as way to bring more opportunities for laughter in our lives.
this thread on nonsense is the hottest thread on the forum, thats just nonsense if you ask me
there were a couple guys looking up at a flag, one guy says the flag is moving, the other guy said the air is moving, the master walks by and says, it is your mind thats moving
Does the above relate to this topic? Or have I added nonsense to the nonsense
[QUOTE=David;30730]Hiya Q,
Or do I accept everyone, do nothing, grab some popcorn, and see how things play out?
What would you do in my position? How, based upon your understanding of yoga, would you proceed?[/QUOTE]
Tough call
I can see the popcorn as a valid option, however if someone is suffering and a particular topic sets them off, then out of compassion it may be time to put out a flame for them. some people I would send a message back to them, like in this case nichole, stating something like “if you know what you meant when you wrote what you wrote, you dont have to prove it to him, you can look at this as an oppurtunity to let go and surrender to others opinion of you”
this thread is quite ironic, sorry nichole but I am laughing at the irony of it.
[QUOTE=Quetzalcoatl;30726]
So what’s up, get my point? Are these hallucinations or do you find some truth in here? And I could go on for hours, the alcoholism-thing recently, pulled of by a “healer”, immodestly claiming to be one great addition to this forum: Oh my god, how can one be so tasteless and ignorant.
But I gotta go now. :D[/QUOTE]
Did not read
Cliffs plox
Thox
[quote=justwannabe;30734]Tough call
I can see the popcorn as a valid option, however if someone is suffering and a particular topic sets them off, then out of compassion it may be time to put out a flame for them. some people I would send a message back to them, like in this case nichole, stating something like “if you know what you meant when you wrote what you wrote, you dont have to prove it to him, you can look at this as an oppurtunity to let go and surrender to others opinion of you”
this thread is quite ironic, sorry nichole but I am laughing at the irony of it.[/quote]
Let me first say that I wasn’t speaking specifically about Nichole here. As she mentioned above, she didn’t ask me to do anything regarding Q… I was speaking in general terms about people contacting me quite regularly. I’d also like to say that I don’t mind people coming to me when they have problems on the forum as that comes with the territory.
Thank you for sharing how you would handle such situations. I’d love to hear from others in addition to Q. I prefer that the people of this community shape the community rather than just me. As people chime in as to how they’d handle things, I can take their wisdom into account during future decisions.
Hmmmm… what an intriguing question you ask, David!
This is a Yoga Forum. One would think that people would go on here because of their interest in yoga. If someone has some sort of problem with yoga and the yoga community, perhaps this is the wrong forum for them.
I personally do not believe in racism. Would I go on a KKK forum to bash their beliefs? No. Although I would defend my beliefs in a situation when called for, I would not go out of my way to stir something up when I know that I am not going to win the battle. And frankly, I have better things to do then go and stir up conflicts on the internet.
That being said, if it seems that someone’s intention on this particular forum is to stir things up, then I would first message them and find out what the issue is. Why are they here? Is there a reason they have seemed argumentative online lately.
Let’s say after a little conversation, their intention does seem that they are here because of a positive interest in yoga, but some aspects of the community do not sit well with them, I would politely tell them that stating your beliefs and ideas on here about yoga is ok, but attacking someone and starting up conflicts because of your beliefs is unacceptable behaviour.
I would tell them that their comments will be monitored for the next little while, and if any more conflicive behaviour is found then they may be banned from the forum.
I would definitely give them a chance, but also let them know that this behaviour is not what this forum is about.
Q- Lets say you reacted very differently to this all. You asked Nichole if the quote was about you and she said no and you left it at that- maybe even apologized for the accusation, you would look like a much bigger person. I am not too sure what you are looking for here, and even if Nichole did say that yes, that she wrote that about you- would you be satisfied?
Perhaps you should look inward and focus on what is it you are really looking for. I know that sometimes I get snippy at my hubby and I take a moment, and look within and I’ll realize that I’m really sad about something, or feeling lonely, or just need a good cry- and once I look within myself, all my outwards relationships naturally are positive and healthy.
Sorry for the length of this. I hope my ideas help you a little, David!
Nichole, I forgot to mention before that I really love Dr. Suess and I love your quote. And Q, I hope that after spending some time with your little one, your feeling a bit better.
Hugs all around!
[QUOTE=David;30740]Let me first say that I wasn’t speaking specifically about Nichole here. As she mentioned above, she didn’t ask me to do anything regarding Q… I was speaking in general terms about people contacting me quite regularly. I’d also like to say that I don’t mind people coming to me when they have problems on the forum as that comes with the territory.
Thank you for sharing how you would handle such situations. I’d love to hear from others in addition to Q. I prefer that the people of this community shape the community rather than just me. As people chime in as to how they’d handle things, I can take their wisdom into account during future decisions.[/QUOTE]
Yeah brother, I felt your reasonings was not just about the interaction between nichole and Q, but bigger then that. You asked for input on handling challenging situations, so since this thread has turned into what it turned into, that is the reason I wrote a response I may send to nichole, about this thread, if I was in your shoes, if she had asked it to be looked into. Hope with all the commas that last sentence makes sense.
Hey, you surf much in hawai?, if so PM me about it.
later brother
Neil
[QUOTE=gentle_yogini;30743]Hmmmm… what an intriguing question you ask, David!
This is a Yoga Forum. One would think that people would go on here because of their interest in yoga. If someone has some sort of problem with yoga and the yoga community, perhaps this is the wrong forum for them.
I personally do not believe in racism. Would I go on a KKK forum to bash their beliefs? No. Although I would defend my beliefs in a situation when called for, I would not go out of my way to stir something up when I know that I am not going to win the battle.
Hugs all around![/QUOTE]
Q is an obvious troll, why else would he take the time to join a yoga forum just to bash yoga.
Lesson 1 of the internets: Never feed the Trolls!
When threads blow up over drama he created then his objective is complete. If he keeps it up just give him a quick IP ban and send off to another forum to stir crap up in.
Hi Lencho..,
Q is an obvious troll, why else would he take the time to join a yoga forum just to bash yoga.
you know what's obvious? That you have no idea what Yoga is. Not even remotely. Yoga is the same thing and has the same goal, as religion. Yoga is a compendium of methods to reach a state of unity with all existence. Some of these methods can be used for other purposes, though.
And wouldn't you think, with this new information I provided you with, that people who have, or better, who should have completely other goals than you, which would be the actual goals of Yoga, spiritual goals, and if they are worldly, goals of peace and loving friendship, and the wellbeing of menkind, that such people would refuse to support you on your self-destructive "path"? Would it not be inappropriate for such people to behave like it was the most normal thing to use Yoga-methods to support your course, that you yourself already reckognize as being unhealthy for at least your body? This unnatural blowing up of muscles, the intake of a hilarious amounts of calories, the stress you put on your joints, the sleeping problems? And instead (or at least) have a few words of warning for you, some suggestions to alter your lifestyle, values and goals? Or at the very least inform you about Yoga not being intended to be the tool you want to use it as? Not even to begin with speaking about your ego and your immature desire to compete with others and become one of the strongest men in the entire universe? What for anyways? Fame? Money? To be able to pick up some heavy stuff from the ground for a moment?
You're asking if there are Asanas to make you angry! How much of a false picture of Yoga must you have, to come up with such hilarious ideas?! And where does such a false picture come from? You must've gotten the idea from somewhere, right? You must've had some idea about Yoga before you came to this board. I can tell you where it comes from: Selfdeclared Yoga-teachers who water down the real thing, whose Yoga has only little Yoga left in it, who slice Yoga like a pie.
And you know what? It's a little funny: So far, I'm not even having that much of a problem with it. 
One indeed could and should know and do better, but let them rip off Yoga and sell the slices, there are still far worse occupations performable. My problem begins with the same fellows then lamenting that "the others", some evil doers, bad or ignorant or downright stupid people, are the ones to dilute and weaken the real thing. Which they represent. And perform for example by helping Lencho.. with his pointless self-destruction. Which might again inspire others to self-destruct them; a vicious circle right down to hell. 
Isn't that repulsing, my gigantic friend? To make charges against others for doing what one does themselves? Isn't it shameless? Far far away from anything like a spiritual endeavor? And is it not allright to drop those fellows a question like "yo, do you really think your Yoga is so real?" No? One must be a troll? A juvenile drug-addict? Hate Yoga and the great Yogis of the world?
Doubt it.
PS:
A little additional information for you (I hope you could keep up the concentration this far): There is someone living in your city whom I adore. He touched my heart. It's the great Yoga master Dharma Mittra, noone told you about him yet, tsts. Go see him. He will show you what Yoga is. Go to him. You'll easily relate to him, as he did weight-lifting too when he was younger (he's 71 years old now). I envy you for this opportunity. And if you please will, tell him a Quezzatroll told you about him; I'm simple-minded enough to love the thought that he knows I exist.
That's a Yogi.
Hi gentle_yogini,
Quetzalcoatl, even if you did mock the whole yoga community, I really don’t think a lot of people care that much. I know I don’t… I am pretty sure that most yoga people know that not EVERYONE is gonna understand, agree with, or like yoga. And that’s ok. This world would be pretty boring if we were all clones of one another.
and I add this from your other post too:
This is a Yoga Forum. One would think that people would go on here because of their interest in yoga. If someone has some sort of problem with yoga and the yoga community, perhaps this is the wrong forum for them.
I personally do not believe in racism. Would I go on a KKK forum to bash their beliefs? No. Although I would defend my beliefs in a situation when called for, I would not go out of my way to stir something up when I know that I am not going to win the battle. And frankly, I have better things to do then go and stir up conflicts on the internet.
Your whole comment in this thread is based on the misconception, that I would have a problem with Yoga. I don’t. What should that problem even be, I can’t think of one. I have a problem with many of the people who claim to represent Yoga. These I criticize and I criticize these reasonably.
Yoga I love. I do an Asana-sessions almost everyday; I frequently even sleep on my Yoga-mat. I had done Yoga before too, with a teacher and I have included a lot of Yogic conceptions about the mind into my view- and standpoint in life. If what I find here, in this community and if what I see in the so called “yogic” movement in the western world is indeed Yoga, then I must have misunderstood pretty much everything. That I doubt.
I have tried to explain some of my problems precisely in the lengthy post in this thread. Why don’t you comment these instead of making up a false story about me? That only supports my perception. I know: You don’t care. Impressive.
This one is quite interesting too:
Q- Lets say you reacted very differently to this all. You asked Nichole if the quote was about you and she said no and you left it at that- maybe even apologized for the accusation, you would look like a much bigger person.
Probably. But what if I still thougt different? I might look bigger in some peoples eyes, but would I really be bigger? I am as tall or small as I am. Isn’t it a first step towards becoming a spiritual giant to accept where I stand? Work with who and what I am? Instead of faking a fassade to impress others with a size I cannot live up to?
--------------------------*
Hi Nichole,
you are of course free to do whatever you think is right. With your final sentence about crossed wires and your hope to change that, you made the impression to have some interest in me and how I perceive you and this community. If someone would face up to my criticism, that might change my view. So far, it’s only being ignored and avoided, stories about me are made up, so from my perspective it looks like people are either too arrogant to give a damn about what I think or are afraid to engage me in a reasonable debate. It should be so simple, if someone criticized me, I’d lay out my standpoint, explain how I came to it, if necessary discuss it further, just like non-fundamentalist and non-dogmatic people do it all around the world and the clock. I’ve done it a million times before.
--------------------------*
Hi David,
[quote]And I give you one more thing to not overblow you (which I probably already did): Every day I read on this forum how super tolerant everbody is, how they accept others, no matter where they stand and how evolved they are. Right? You read it all the time. But when these claims are taken to the test, for example right here in this thread, where - let’s say - an unevolved idiot doesn’t know better, they fail to live up to their standards. As long as you’re in line, they do, they tolerate you.
Make absolutely no mistake, this is something that, especially as the owner of this forum, I have to deal with a LOT. I am forever getting PM’s from people who are upset with what someone on this forum said. As the person with the power to ban, where do I draw the line of acceptance? I consider myself extremely accepting, but if someone threatens another with physical violence, do I let them continue? I can see both sides of the coin. Do I accept the person who is threatening violence knowing that they’re simply someone who might be in pain, who is traumatized, who is coming from ego, etc? Or do I accept the person who feels threatened who is coming from a place of fear?[/quote]may I assume all those messages aren’t about me…?Quite interesting that you get so many, while stuff like this is pretty much never publicly discussed. Why not? Are YogiNis so afraid of admitting to be upset or annoyed? Does everyone need to appear as an accomplished superguru? Well, I’m none and where I come from, things can only clearified when they’re addressed openly.
Your questions: Threats of physical violence are obviously nothing to tolerate, as well as trivial insults like “asshole” and alike. More subtle affronts are more difficult to deal with, like for example calling someone a hypocrite or a liar, or, even more subtle, telling someone they don’t understand Yoga, do a false Yoga and unsettling statements alike. I guess such stuff would need an explanation: Why is someone called a hypocrite? Is the explanation sound? Can it be debated? If so, I’d guess it should. Of course noone can be forced, but on the other hand: If someone criticizes others, they cannot demand to above criticism.
On acceptance: I personally think that one should even accept a child-abuser, which to me is the worst crime possible. Yes, I’m serious: Accept such people. But one should of course not accept child-abuse and do anything to prohibit it, including killing such offenders, if necessary.
Do I accept you, a person who is obviously full of passion and has taken many steps back to evaluate what he sees going on and isn’t afraid to single people out? Or do I accept the person who you’re focusing on who gets their feelings hurt for various reasons or might feel threatened by you for other reasons?
Or do I accept everyone, do nothing, grab some popcorn, and see how things play out?
What would you do in my position? How, based upon your understanding of yoga, would you proceed?
The answer in my own case is very simple: I would discuss my critcism with me, agree with me, where I do, show me where and why I’m wrong, and relativize what I am exaggerating. I’d also note that I find it quite unpleasant that I have to do so, particularly because the people I criticize are criticising much more than I do (I mostly criticized ppl only when they did it themselves, like recently Pandara).
Is there a general answer? I don’t think so, if not every case is unique, there are still too many different situations to have one answer for them all. Name some and I’ll tell you what Q (:lol:) would do. Doing nothing, especially when asked for support, is not really an option for a moderator though.
Well David, I hope to have been of service here. How about a small favour in return? You say what I say isn’t nonsense. I dare to be self-confident enough to know that already. So do you agree with me? Something that isn’t nonsense can still be wrong, right? Is my only wrong in your opinion not to have the same faith in Nichole like you have? With everything else you agree? Then maybe you can shed some light on the behaviour I criticize, as you probably are in “the business” much longer than since Feb 2010. What’s up with people? Are they greedy? Don’t they understand? Do they try to be something they aren’t? Impress others? What’s going on behind those speeches?
Hi Quetzalcoatl,
I actually agree with alot of your points.Although i think when you single out people you can run the risk of making folk feel uncomfortable.If Nichole did post in response to something you did, i think it is pretty inconsequential.Maybe you should rise above it. You could can always tell how deeply yoga has penetrated folk ( i think yogacharya michael said this) by how folk respond.If they seek to disagree with you for it’s own sake or never ever refer to actual practices they have studied, then i do begin to wonder.
Where i agree however is it’s not practical to constantly drone on at people with t he mantra find a teacher without also handing out some useful pointers in an approproriate direction or basic advice they might appear to be ignorant of.I think it’s lazy and shows a lack of genuine interest.It’s often quite impractical- because otheriwse they probably would’nt be here asking questions or looking for advice.You get a lot of folk issueing a first post and sometimes i’m pretty incredulous by the scantyiness of information volunteered or the way they’ve done it.
It’s also easy to take oneself too seriously.
As forums go this is a pretty laidback forum but then you would expect that from a yoga forum.I rememeber someone put it miles better thani ever could articulate it- that a place like this has nothing like the rough & tumble of an open forum where at most any heat is confined to the playful nips of puppy-dog’s tails.
I think you’re also being tongue in cheek and provocative and that’s just your style ,and i actually quite like it.No one is the same. The only problem when we begin to joke around and have some fun is we can run the risk of being misunderstood.
And by the way hatha yoga stands for forceful yoga but it would be misleading and unsafe to explain it that way. That for e.g force is necessary. This is a mistake btw. Mindfullness and force cannot co-existhealthily together in a sound yoga practice.So i would have to agree with Willem there.
You’ve noticed - i’m not someone that says i’m just so busy right now. You sound like a genuine guy i think who is’nt afraid to speak his mind. But personal attacks is you just monkeying around.
There are a lot of other points but i need to scoot…lol
I might re-join them later.
Hey david, can you pass me the popcorn?
Thanks
Hey Q, another persopective. To read what you have written and not respond is not always the same as ignoring. You say if you were david you would "The answer in my own case is very simple: I would discuss my critcism with me, agree with me, where I do, show me where and why I’m wrong, and relativize what I am exaggerating. "
why discuss this with you, you seem self aware of what you are doing and fairly content with it, so why would asking you to be more compassionate change anything.
A good time for tea now
brother Neil