Is Buddhism a religion?

Spirituality Religion
#81

No, that’s not really the question I’m asking. I’m not asking whether I should or should not practice Buddhism, but whether the Buddhist believes he or she will live on in some way that is continuous and whether they are the same person after death.

Buddhism seems very depressing to me, because I can’t see much difference between what they believe and the atheist believes–that everything disolves at death and that’s it.

But…I’m willing to be educated differently, but I’m finding it frustrating that the Buddhists so far are not answering even the most basic questions I’ve asked.

#82

First of all we can actually use our lives to prepare for death

Buddhists see life and death as one whole, where death is the beginning of another chapter of life. The whole of life and death is presented together is a series of of constantly changing transitional realities known as Bardos.

Bardos are junctures when the possibility of liberation, or enlightement is heightened

The Bardos are certain moments,that are much more powerful than others and much more charged with potential, when whatever you do has a crucial and far-reaching. effect.

The greatest and most charged of these moments, however, is the moment of death

So, from the Tibetan point of view, they divide our entire existence into four continuously linked realities

  1. Life
  2. Dying and Death
    3.After Death
    4.Rebirth
    These are known as as the four Bardos:
    1.the natural Bardo of life
    2.The painful Bardo of dying
  3. The luminous Bardo of Dharmata (Distinguishing Phenomena and Pure Being)
    4.The Karmic Bardo of becoming

Back in mo…

#83

[QUOTE=thomas;42490]I just wanted you to answer with your own beliefs in your own words. I want the “kareng account” and not the Teibetan one.[/QUOTE]

Well Thomas Im still learning Im afraid and I dont want to misguide you with a wrong account. Youve asked about specific things.

Start with what ive put, its from a Master, im cutting it for clarity.
Do you want more?

#84

You have to familiarise yourself with the nature of mind in this lifetime.
This done through repeated Meditations
This to prepare yourself for recognizing the full extent of mind when it reveals itself spontaneously and powerfully at the moment of death.

#85

Are you still you after you die? Do you remember your earthly existence? Do you live on eternally afterwards? Do you communicate with others who have done likewise?

#86

[QUOTE=kareng;42494]Well Thomas Im still learning Im afraid and I dont want to misguide you with a wrong account. Youve asked about specific things.

Start with what ive put, its from a Master, im cutting it for clarity.
Do you want more?[/QUOTE]

I don’t understand anything of what you posted from the master. It’s all Greek to me.

I just wanted to know your personal opinions regarding my questions, but if you don’t want to share that, then I won’t persist in asking anymore.

#87

[B]The position for Dying[/B]
Lay on right side, left hand on left thigh right hand under chin, finger closing right nostril, legs strethced out, slightly bent.
Why?
On right side of body are certain subtle channels that encourage the Karmic wind of delusion. So by laying on right side, closing right nostril, it blocks this channell of Karmic wind and facilitates the persons recognition of the luminosity when it dawns at death.
It also aids the consciousness to leave the body through the aperture at the crown of the head, as all other openings through which could leave are blocked. [B]Luminosity explained later

Death process has two main states…Outer dissolution and Inner
[/B]

[B]OUTER DISSOULUTION[/B]
At the point of death, the outer senses of the elements dissolve, (earth, water, wind, fire and space) the senses cease to function…if people are talking round your bed as your dying you will hear the sound but not understand the words, so ear function.is failing.
We look at an object in front of us and all we can see is its outline and no detail, so eye consciousness is failing, and same happens with smell, taste and touch. This ends the 1st phase of the dissolution process.

The elements earth, wind, water, fire, and space are outside BUT we have Earth, air, water, fire and space inside us. So, as we begin to die there is a definite process that occurs and this is it.

[B]Steps for Earth Element beginning to dissolve[/B]
Next, our body begins to loose all strength, we begin to feel like we are sinking underground or being crushed by a great weight., complexion fades, cheeks sink, dark stains appear on teeth, eyes hard to open or close, mind sinks into drowsiness after a few moments of agitated delirium.

The above is a sign that earth is moving to water and a secret sign appears in the mind of a shimmering mirage.

[B]Steps for Water Element beginning to Dissolve
[/B]
We begin to loose control of bodily fluids, can be discharge from eyes, appearing as tears but not, nose may run, mouth may dribble, incontinence, cant move tongue, eyes dry, lips drawn and bloodless, nostrils cave in, mind is hazy, frustrated, irritable and nervous…feelings of being swept awayby a huge river.

The water element is dissolving into fire. The secret sign is a vision of haze with swirling wisps of smoke.

[B]Steps of the Fire element beginning to dissolve.[/B]
Mouth and nose dry up completely. Warmth in body begins to seep away, from feet and hands towards the heart, perhaps a steamy heat risesfrom crown of head. Breath is coldcant drink or digest anything mind swings between clarity and confusion, the inner experience is like being consumed by flames.

The transition from fire to air has a secret sign…,shimmering red sparks dancing like firefly’s.

[B][B]Steps for Air element beginning to dissolve.[/B][/B]
Harder to breathe, air feels like its escaping through throat, panting, eyes roll upward. Intellect is dissolving, mind is bewildered, unaware of outside world, everything is a blur, our last feeling of contact with outside wrld is slipping away, we hallucinate, have visions, may see terrifying forms, dreadful moments of our lives are replayed. If we have led lives of compassion and we may experience bliss, heavenly visions and ‘meet’ loving friends or enlightened beings. For those who have had good lives there is peace at this point and not fear. A feeling inside is a great wind sweeping you away.

The air element is dissolving into consciousness. The secret sign is a vision of a flaming torch or lamp with a red glow.

Our in breaths continue to be more shallow and our out breaths longer. At this point our blood gathers and enters the ‘channel of life’ at the centre of the heart. Three drops of blood collect, one after the other causing three long, final out breaths, then, suddenly our breath stops. Just a slight warmth remains in the heart. All vital signs are gone, you are clinically certified dead…[B],BUT [/B]an internal process still continues. Estimation between last breathe and inner process ending is anything up to 20 mins

By learning the nature of your mind through meditation, you are able to note the secret signs as they appear and hold enough presence of understanding as all this happens, important for next stage…,

Do you want me to carry on anyone? I need a cup of tea…best is yet to come but I don’t want to bore you all…scary bits over now
next is inner dissolution

#88

Thomas I cant just tell you what you want its complex, if I do youll be saying yeah buts all the way…stick with me if you want to know luv x

#89

[B]INNER DISSOLUTION [/B]
This is where gross and subtle thoughts, states and emotions dissolve, four increasingly subtle levels of consciousness are encountered.

Here the process of death mirrors the process of conception. When our parents sperm and ovum unite, consciousness, impelled by its Karma, is drawn in.
When the fetus develops, our fathers essence, a nucleus that is described as white and blissful rests in the chakra at the crown of our head at the top of the central channel. The mothers essence is a nucleus red and hot four fingers width below the naval. It is from these two essences that the next phase of the dissolution evolve.

With the disappearance of wind that holds it there, the white essence descends towards the heart.

As an outer sign, there is an experience of whiteness like sky struck by moonlight.

As an inner sign our awareness becomes completely clear and all states caused by anger, 33 of them disappear.

This phase is known as the APPEARANCE.

Then the mothers essence begins to rise through the central channel and with the disappearance of wind, it stays there.

The outer sign is a redness like a sun shining in a pure sky.

As an inner sign, there arises a feeling of great bliss, all thoughts arising from desire, forty in all, cease to function

This stage is known as INCREASE.

When the red and white essence meet at the heart, a consciousness is enclosed between them, the experience is described like the meeting of sky and earth.

As an outer sign, we experience blackness, like an empty sky shrouded in darkness.

The inner sign is a state of mind free from thoughts The seven thought states resulting from ignorance and delusion are brought to an end.

This is as FULL ATTAINMENT

Then we become slightly conscious again, the ground luminosity dawns, like an immaculate sky, free of clouds.fog or mist.
The Dalai Lama says, “this consciousness is the innermost subtle mind” We call it Buddha nature, the real source of consciousness. This continuum of this mind lasts even through Buddhahood.

THE DEATH OF "THE POISONS"
what then is happening when we die? Its as if we are returning to our original state; everything dissolves, as body and mind are unravelled. The three “poisens”…anger, desire,and ignorance…all die…which means that all the negative emotions, the root of Samsara, actually cease, and then, there is a gap.
And where does this process take us to? To the primordial ground and the nature of mind, in all its purity and natural simplicity…Now, everything that obscured it is removed, and our true nature is revealed.

This is a similar enfolding when we practice meditation and have the experience of bliss, clarity and absence of thoughts, which indicate in turn, that desire, anger and ignorance have momentarily dissolved…

Going back to the process…as anger, desire and ignorance dissolve we are becoming purer and purer.

Becoming familiar of this process is of great benefit. For practitioners theres is range of specialised practices to do at each stage of the dissolutions…e.g. you can transform the process of dying into a practice of Guru Yoga.

Summing up and missing out the Guru Yoga practices, the stages of dissolutions, outer and inner produce a gradual development and dawning of ever more subtle levels of consciousness. Each one emerges upon the successive dissolution of the constituents of the body and mind, as the process moves gradually toward the revelation of the very subtlest of all: Ground Luminosity

pheww r u reading this Thomas?

#90

Putting ground luminosity together, it highly important but I’m tired and its late here.
Will put it on here tomorrow.x

#91

Thanks for posting that, kareng. It was interesting and I read it all.

Now could you answer my questions, please? The ones directed at you and asking for what you believe, explained in your own words?

And can I determine from the following that you posted that the person does indeed live on?

It also aids the consciousness to leave the body through the aperture at the crown of the head

#92

Am gonna venture to say charlatan or con-artist… Not that it should make much difference other than as a warning to others…

Not nice.

Why such a harsh accusation?

And what does she have to gain? She’s not selling any services here.

I don’t accept a lot of what she says, but that doesn’t mean I don’t think she’s being sincere. She’s an honest and genuine person. She at least deserves the benefit of the doubt.

#93

Thank you Thomas.

Well I use to believe in God, Jesus and Heaven and Hell. And if I am totally honest, some of me still does, especially Jesus. And, after every prayer I make, I still make the sign of the cross, instinctively. And I wont change it.!!

But, I don’t believe I should ignore Buddhism, and elements of Hinduism. I think there is a relationship between all of the great Masters, in their teachings, the basic core beliefs…they all ask you to live a good decent caring lives.
So I try to and I haven’t decided about heaven, hell, Nirvana reincarnation and Karma,[B] yet.[/B]

I do know that I found the inner Guru, a Buddha in form , whilst believing in Jesus. I do know that I led a simple life and that is significant. I do believe that simplicity in thinking is a prerequisite to communication with the inner guru. I don’t want to complicate my mind with loads of religious or philosophical thought, I dont think thats the answer.

And being on this religious part of the Forum in particular is not good for what I think…for what I personally believe.

Keep it simple. Be nice, think nice, do nice…for now…but I am looking at Buddhism, slowly, as its complex, in parts, but does contain a tremendous amount of simple sense…(contradiction I know…but some new concepts are at first difficult to grasp but later its easy, if you get me?)

#94

Kareng, I have noticed that you do not answer any questions directly with a clear answer. Almost everything you say, comes back to your ajana chakra, little buddha, ishvara, personal guru jargon. I am familiar with all those terms and concepts, but not how you use them. To be absolutely frank the way you use these terms is nonsensical. You might as well be speaking in Greek.

I have noted you have an almost desperate need to repeat your ajana experience over, and over, and over again in every thread, and the only one you seem to be trying to convince is yourself.

You claim to have psychic powers and see things in your ajana chakra. The only one you have convinced you have this, is yourself. Rather than having the humilty to remain silent because of your lack of ability to demonstrate this to anybody, you react violently with personal attacks against those who question your ability and try to convince yourself that they are all spiritually ignorant/underdeveloped to make yourself feel better.

You claim to have had a darshan from ishvara in the form of the little buddha you see in the lotus position in your ajana chakra. You boast about this “ishvara” to everybody. Yet, it is clear, this is nothing more than a mental projection. Not ishvara. But mere subconscious garbage appearing in your minds eye. That we all experienced meditators have experienced, and had our own mental projection(I had Brahma) but we were sensible enough to acknowledge it, ignore it and continue with our practice. Not to be derailed by mental side-shows.

We are not telling you this because we want to harm you, but we have recognised you have fallen into a trap that we all have encountered and the masters have warned against, when you mistake the mental special effects to be some great spiritual attainment - worse - the ultimate itself. Rather than barking back at us with personal attacks on how were all less developed than you, you should take stock of what we say and humble yourself.

You have not realised Ishvara dear. You have no psychic powers dear. But you one day will realise ishvara and attain those spiritual powers if you continue with your practice with single minded devotion, detachment and discrimination.

Reject the new-age nonsense. Get serious. Ishvara will come.

#95

Can someone tell me if Buddhists believe whether theiir consiousness and a sense of who they are in this life will continue after death?

#96

Yes, they believe e.g. that a reincarnated Master will recognise his own personal things so they present someone they think is a reincarnation of them with the personal things as a measure to see their reaction. Is that what your asking?..ha

#97

Nevermind. This is too frustrating.

#98

Thomas, I have said in post on here that i dont know about all you are asking me. Ive said I am still learning about Buddhism and dont want to mislead you…have you not been following these posts? Go back on here and read again.

This is the explained in long posts I did for you last night:
Consciousness at varying degrees, many subtle carrys on in the death process, and after death in the next stage, and you will be able to be aware of all sorts, and for a number of days, you can come back to your body, if still there, and see your relatives, all upset, after your death, and when you have your rebirth, I know that Buddhists that are looking for reincarnated Masters will show the person they believe is the reincarnated Master, the belongings that were once the Masters, to look for signs…this being so, some people may have vague recollections of their previous life.

Rebirth only happens if the Buddhist chooses to come back, or,
If they fail to meet the requirements/practice to stop being reborn
Many Buddhists are aiming at not being reborn so aim for enlightenment…this is the ground luminosity which I haven’t got round to putting on here yet, this explains enlightenment.

Does this explain it a bit?

#99

[B]Surya Says[/B]
Kareng, I have noticed that you do not answer any questions directly with a clear answer. Almost everything you say, comes back to your ajana chakra, little buddha, ishvara, personal guru jargon. I am familiar with all those terms and concepts, but not how you use them. To be absolutely frank the way you use these terms is nonsensical. You might as well be speaking in Greek.

[B] Kareng Says[/B]
Which Question/s, you need to back this up
I have only used this term recently after it being explained by Suhas Tambe. These words were alien to me. I only know Ishvara as the inner Guru……A little Buddha, in my instance, that sits at the Ajna Chakra, grows bigger, loves the Sun when you look at it……can be found in search via the Chakra, levitates into the Ajna……hmmmmm afraid so Surya……but please, look on the bright side . When you actually start practising it, it will not be a shock for you to meet Ishvara in this way I have described. You will know what to do when you are in Ajna state and see this figure seated and waiting in meditation for you…….and you will always, for the rest of your spiritual life, remember me and what I have told you as being true, after all……

After 40 years of Practice of course I will talk about it silly! and in the context of the thread it applies to or in reply to the post in question……do your searches Surya….tut!
Jargon/Greek…I expect it is to someone who ONLY CAN ONLY READ ABOUT IT.

You have said yourself you have not experienced anything!! Zilch, Zero, Nothing, Rien, null. I can only imagine how frustrating this must be for you, a Hindu, and me, just a simple Gal from tiny England who isn’t even a Hindu to have experienced, Ishvara!!.. So very Sorry Surya….

And, equally to have never had ANY personal experiences with the Ajna Chakra must be awful for you……. So Sorry Surya, but your time will come when you actually start practising seriously, as you have expressed you will be soon.

Finally Surya, I believe you live in India? Go and [B]find a Hindu Master of the Ajna. [/B]There must be one somewhere, being the capital of this practice, print out my description, I have done this in separate post for your ease. [B]Repeat it to this Master….see what they say to you before you set out to attack someone who knows what they are talking about……as I said, …Sorry it irritates you[/B]

The rest you have put has been answered before…[B]boring to go over again and again!!
[/B]

#100

[B][B]Here is what you say, for your ease to print out and take to a Master in Ajna practice, or otherwise, even…
[/B][/B]
….The Ajna Chakra is the seat of the Guru, Ishvara. You can find Ishvara by meditating on a tiny little light , in the dark canvas, [B]BUT [/B]the format your used to, changes and you will be seeing red streaks intermingling with black, slowly moving along at a gentle pace, a journey… till eventually you come to a stop and see a seated, lotus position, monks attired Guru. He is in meditation. In an insignificant darkish space with nothing in there with him, seated to the left of Ajna vision.

You look and think what/who is that? and your eye is immediately brought close to him, he stays still in meditation. You analyse his features, you are thinking all simple thoughts, like how old he is, shape of eyes, nose, etc, or whatever ……he then begins to move by levitation, your third eye is involuntarily moved backwards to its central position as you watch him levitate to this central position , he turns his back on you, goes to the end of the space he is in, or room, but it isn’t a room , still levitating… He is aligning himself with the area between the brows. He then turns to face you and still levitating, cross legged, enters your Ajna chakra area.

You come around to waking. He is sat there still! A tiny little man (maybe woman, I think it might vary??I don’t know) He leans in and out of the area between the brows. You can see him…A perfect man in every way you can see.

When you are going about your everyday business, he is there, and will move out of the area to be ahead of you according to the state of your mind and its thoughts. He likes the Sun and will sunbathe in it, he loves it!! You have to look towards the Sun at an angle for him to do this!! He can become big and bigger depending on the size of your ego and other factors. He can also appear without using Ajna to find him, again, it depends on your minds state and spiritual intensity of practice. Empty mind, kindness, no bad thinking, no nasties, still calm happy mind!! He will suddenly appear in front of you!! Chair size, smaller or bigger.

While he is with you in the open Ajna state, he/you are in a perfect state of feeling.
You emit a light from yourself that is pleasing to all around you. Everything you think is right, everything you say, is right if you surrender your simplicity to him and not use mind to direct you!!

You feel fantastic, perfect peace, love, stillness of mind…you name it!

Okay Surya, there it is…….Find a Master !! Make sure its a real Master, knowledgeable in Ajna practice, not a fake, yes!

And, if you cant be bothered to …wait till it happens to you and I will be there to haunt you…:eek::eek::eek::smiley: