I?ve often been told that you don?t need to believe in god (which I don?t) to chant mantras, though many refer to worshipping a ?supreme being? or ?lord?. For instance when I chant the Maha Mrityunjaya Mantra it includes the line ?Trayambakam Yajaamahey? which means ?We Worship the Three-Eyed One (Lord Shiva)?. Surely then I?m worshipping a god which I don?t believe in, which seems hypocritical. I?m confused 
well…sun salutation were a worship to god Suriya (?not sure?), indians revered sun as a god…now days we know that Sun is a star composed of gases and stuff:) but we still practice sun salutation… go figure
Ha, ha! Very good point I guess it’s because I’m saying the words out loud in the Mantra that I have an issue. If I had to say ‘I worship you oh sun god Suriya’ at the beginning of each Sun Salutation I would find that problematic. So… in essence what I’m saying in a Mantra is no different to what I’m doing in Sun Salutation. Hmmm, I really enjoy chanting Mantras but I think I need to define what they actually mean to me…
This is a very good question and it illustrates how misinterpreted Sanskrit can be. It is far too similar to how different passages of any sacred text (I’m thinking Bible here) are “massaged” to suit someone’s human purpose.
While I’m not at all a Sanskrit scholar it has become quite obvious that the language doesn’t simply pop right over into English. For example in the sutras there’s a reference to meditation BEING a stilling of the mind. However that reference is, in fact one of meditation REQUIRING stilling of the mind. A subtle language difference but an enormous translational difference.
What I would suggest is a hop over to Swamii’s web site to read the discourse on the mantra posted there. Even if one does not buy your definition OR the one there the point that interpretations can vary still holds water. Take the Mantra based on your feeling of it and its results in your living. If you don’t love both find another mantra.
And of course I’ve resisted my default response here which would have been “why are you doing this particular mantra in the first place and who is guiding you to do so?”.
@ell dee:
Think of those gods as abstract structures of consciousness you cannot “grasp”. Of course, not under human form but abstract.
Universal consciousness gets individualized in atoms, bacterias, plants, animals, and why not? in planets, galaxies, etc, and who knows, we could be just cells of the latter. Are your cells aware of what you are? Are you as a cell aware of the structure you belong to?
We all belong to the same quantum field from which material universe springs as forms and structures. It’s all united. It’s all consciousness.
If this is too much for you, think of them as archetypes of our collective unconsciousness you can work out in order to release their psychic power, or at least, to give your mind the their positive qualities.
Many thanks for everybody’s replies, they have been very insightful. The difference in interpretation and emphasis of the Maha Mrityunjaya Mantra at swamij.com is fascinating.
I like the approach of ‘abstract structures of consciousness.’ I guess I have been looking at all of this from a very western viewpoint of god/gods in the sky, as it were.
The person who has guided me to this Mantra is… me. It was the first one I ever learnt and I’ve always enjoyed chanting it. The teacher who originally taught it to me just said it was for new beginnings, which I suppose it is
There is a lot lost in translation; but a lot more is lost in not understanding the anatomy of such phenomena, like mantras.
Not everything in Sanskrit is mantra. A mantra is an inspired expression in the highest spiritual state of a yogi who is addressing some aspect of the spiritual journey in a peculiar mode. The mode is “sound vibrations”. Sound or the phonetics are of primary importance here; knowing the meaning only helps it.
Bringing in ‘god’ and ‘belief’ would unnecessarily distort the import of mantras. In the first place, the word ‘god’ is a poor equivalent to the Indian sense of deities which represent several aspects of unknown and the unpredictable. Vedanta doesn’t seem to give godhood in the same sense as the West knows, to anything beyond the three aspects of life - Brahma (the creator), Vishnu (the sustainer) and Shiva (the destroyer) - which it is easy for any sensible mind to know are not “persons”. There is no reason for any inhibition in singing prayers in the name of any aspect of the life-force.
If someone has an overbearing difficulty with the Indian gods, chanting mantras should still be possible as the recital is more important. Mantras are so powerful, that said right they will themselves create images embedded in them and there will remain no question of any belief as a precondition.
@ell dee:
There are other Buddhist and Sikh Mantras which are not Mantras addressed to Hindu Gods like Om Mani Padme Hum (buddhist) and Ek Ong Kar (Sikh) so maybe you can try them.
You need to understand few things here.
Mantra means man (thoughts) + tra (tool) . That means making your thoughts directed in your Sankalp (There is no equivalent word in English but you can say Purpose) by means of some tool (here vibrational sound waves).
Mahamritunjay Mantra is from Rig, Yajur and Atharva veda. When we call any God name in any ancient mantra, it does not mean per se GOD that we understand in terms of religion. Nature (Or creator) is represented by different symbols in such mantra. Through this mantra , you are not worshipping anyone particular god but you are invoking nature or power or creator to make you strong to deal with death. I tell you another misconception people have with this particular mantra. Many people think that by chanting this mantra they can live longer but reality is that this mantra has absolutely other purpose, if you know proper meaning. This mantra is not intended to increase years of anyone’s life, rather it is more directed towards becoming strong from fear of death.
That’s why knowing entire meaning of mantra is very crucial part. You may find different names but each name was given to represent something. For example Sun is called with different names in Mantra. Many people consider Sun as God also but real purpose is not to be limited with name or god but to understand the remaining meaning of the mantra because that is core part of it.
If you focus on the actual meaning of any mantra (keeping it independent of any religion) then you can move beyond name. Most of the mantras were created much before any religion that exist now.
It’s irrelevant what mantra you do or what it means because the effect of any mantra is only in the aspect of breath and vibration (for a vocalized mantra only) and rhythm. You could actually say anything, even nonsense words, and achieve the same meditative effect as mantra with a capital M. All of the religious mumbo jumbo attached to mantra is just that: religious mumbo jumbo. Believe it if you like. It can’t hurt, but it won’t help, except to create delusion, which may have some psychological benefit. If you doubt the physiological aspects of the functions I mention above, just Google it up. You’ll find I’m right. In the meantime, chant away whatever mantra floats your boat. It’s good for you on many levels. Just don’t worry about God. For have you not heard? God is dead!
You could actually say anything, even nonsense words, and achieve the same meditative effect
yogaandy, I would like to correct few things here. It may be obvious for you to say
so because it seems you have absolutely no idea about Mantra or Sanskrit Language.
Let me put some light.
It is true that mantras are independent of any religion but any word or especially nonsense words wont work at all.
Mantras are very scientific and mathematical , just like musical notes. Can you play any nonsense random notes and make beautiful piece of sound ?
Mantras are based on the following RULES.
- Siksha - Rules of phonetics and laws of pronunciations and intonation
- Vyakarana - Grammar
- Chandas - Metric composition
- Niruktam - All words must have root words
- Jyotisha - To decide time /day when mantra should be chanted
- Kalpa - Preparations if required for mantra
Because of these mathematical and scientific rules, Mantras in India are still 99% pure without change in letters or word even though they were preserved without the aid of printed books or recoding for thousands of years.
Therefor mantra should only be chanted by people who have knowledge about these rules.
To give you glimpse of what I am talking about; just focus only on the Consonants part of alphabets of Sanskrit and you will know how 5 scientific divisions are made.
- Gutturals - कण्ठ्य
These letters are pronounced with the help of the throat. - Palatals - तालव्य
These letters are pronounced with the help of the jaw. - Cerbrals - मूर्धन्य
These letters are pronounced with the tounge hitting the roof of the mouth. - Dentals - दन्त्य
These letters are pronounced with the help of the teeth. - Labials - ओष्ठ्य
These letters are pronounced with the help of the lips (the two lips should meet each other).
Hope this will help so that no one plays around with these sacred and powerful sound vibrations.
Hi, Umesh,
Thanks for your thoughtful response. I must, of course, disagree with your basic premise: that I “have absolutely no idea about Mantra or Sanskrit Language.” In fact, I do have knowledge of both, in addition to knowledge of Chinese and Japanese and the respective Buddhist chanting done in both languages, in addition to knowledge regarding Hebrew and Christian chanting traditions. I have based my opinion above on the knowledge attained in the study of these fields, while I am guessing you are basing your opinion on your personal experience, which is limited to Sanskrit.
You indicate that Sanskrit mantras are thousands of years old, and at the same time state that they “are very scientific.” Obviously if the former is true, the latter cannot be. You are as aware as I that science, as such, was not truly developed until the 19th century (please refer to any history of the subject to confirm that this is so). Sanskrit mantras, therefore, cannot be scientific. What is scientific, however, is research into chanting as a general practice, in any language, which indicates a varied range of physiological and psychological effects. The overarching finding of this research, on which I base my statement above, is that the actual words are not important; what is important is the rhythm, the pitch (i.e., vibration), and the breathing patterns. Below is a link to an abstract of one such study, but there are many more I have read and studied over the years.
If you want to apply religious significance to your practice, that is fine with me. I hope it helps you, and I’m sure it does. But the antiquated and disproven notion that any particular set of sounds, which are essentially arbitrary, are “sacred” or “powerful” is, I’m afraid, the product of religious dogma, and as such, is in the realm of delusion, or what psychology would term “magical thinking.”
I hope this helps.
Best,
Yogandi (one “a”)
(BTW: I checked your website; it’s full of grammatical errors. You might consider hiring an editor to clean it up.)
No point debating on this further. Readers are free to choose whichever reply they find more appropriate.
I concur 100%.
Are there some other citations of merit? This one on the Gayatri and Poems is not particularly compelling for me. I’d be interested in reading 3-4 of the “others” mentioned if you care to cite them.
Hi, Gordon,
Rather than me citing other studies, just do some Googling on your own. It’s a vast subject, obviously, and worthy of an in-depth look. I’m sure you’ll find plenty of information. Focus on the phrase “neuro-linguistic effect” or “NLE.” The point is that the vibratory frequency and rhythmic aspect of chanting is the active ingredient while the actual meaning of the words chanted is irrelevant, except on a personal, emotional level. I’ll give just this one link below for the sake of the following quote, which sums up the point very well:
“The Neuro- linguistic effect will be possible even if you do not know the meaning of the mantra. Hence knowing the meaning of every mantra is not compulsory.”
I think that says it all.
(http://www.zenerationsofboca.com/meditation-talk-benefits-mantra-chanting/)