My Knees

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#1

I have to be honest with you all: I wasn’t treating my knees with as much love as I could have while practicing yoga and I think I might have tweaked them a bit. The don’t bother me at all on a regular basis but from doing pidgon pose and reclined hero pose I think I pushed them a little too far. Now when I assume poses that I need good knees for they feel a little too soar to do those poses. Even when I sit cross legged I can feel a tiny bit of pain. Also after some of those sessions I felt a bit wobbley standing up, like my knees were too flexible.

I really don’t think I did anything hugley damaging to them since I caught my mistake this early, but I want to make sure I rest properly to heal them up. Also, I don’t know if this is related but I think I might have been hyperextending my legs in the knee area when doing leg stretches, namely triangle poses.

So heres the thing: I know many feel I need a teacher, and I agree that a teacher would be helpful. It is simply not an option for me at this point. In 2 weeks Im moving to a national park in costa rica and I will be in the middle of the forest with no car…so I won’t be able attend classes out there…

I can either stop asanas alltogether and become tight again or I can continue and be as carefull as possible, by asking questions (like I am now)

So I would ask please don’t tell me I need a teacher because I would like to do the best I can on my own.

So I ask you all:

How should I go about healing my knees and the muscles behind them that I was hyperextending doing leg stretches?

What poses do I need to stop? and for how long?

In the future when Im all healed up how do I prepare my hips for poses like pidgon pose so that it doesn’t demand too much work from my knees?

How can I strengthen my knees?

Also, is reclined hero pose really even safe to do in the first place? I have a hard time imagining anyone doing this pose without some kind of knee trouble.

Im learning!

#2

When sitting cross legged…sit up on a firm cushion so that the illiac crest (top of your hip bones) are higher than you knees. You may also want to put support under you knees if they are high off the floor to give your legs something to relax onto.

Do hero pose sitting on a high firm cushion or block so there is no stress in the knees and do NOT lie back…unless whole of back of body is supported and at least as high as your bum…you can find how to do this in any good Iyengar book.
Knees only need to bend enough to touch heels to bum…they do not need to go ore than this and it is not a good idea to try to make them…some people (me included) find hero and reclining hero very easy with no stress on the knees this is partly to do with the femurs/hips moving easily in inward rotation (outward rotation much harder for me).

In all straight legged standing asanas make sure you are lifting the knee cap by contracting the thigh muscles so that the legs do not hyper extend. (when your thigh is relaxed hold your knee cap and see if it moves easily…then engage your thigh muscles…knee cap should not move).

When stretching the back of your legs(hamstrings) try a reclining hamstring stretch so that your back can be relaxed on the floor then as you stretch the hamstring…experiment with flexing/pointing foot…internal/external rotation of the leg…contracting the quadriceps…until you find the stretch in the bulky muscle ares and not in the back of the knee.

Pigeon pose…which one?..Kapotasana (a deep back bend) Ekapada kapotasana(hip opener…with/with out back bend)…double pigeon/fire log pose?

#3

I had this issue when I first started. For some reason I wanted to get into lotus as fast as possible, and when I tried to force the pose before my hips had the range of motion to do so, I had to deal with some pretty bad knee pain. As hard as it may be on your ego, what worked for me was to just back out of any pose that bothers your knee. That doesn’t mean you can’t work towards it - go to your edge, but if something hurts you have to recognize it as the stopping point.

#4

thanks alot for the advice!

Im talking about Ekapada kapotasana while beding forward to deepen the stretch.

I have had a nice little reality check, I will be MUCH more careful from this point on.

For a beginner would you reccomend me practicing once a day vs twice. For a while I felt like I was benifiting from twice a day untill my knees started feeling funny. I know it usually varies from person to person…also, should beginners avoid holding poses too long or if care is taken, is it just preference?

thx

#5

If you do want to practice twice a day then I would do an active stimulating strong practice in the morning and then a relaxing or restorative session in the evening. Once a day is often enough for most people…and take one day off a week to rest.

As for holding asanas too long…depends…how long?..are they weight bearing/non-weight bearing upsidedown/rigthsideup strenuous/relaxing???

Ekapadakapotasana folding forward…if you have props…
1.front shin on a bolster(as high as needed) with 90’ at ankle and 90’at knee…keep foot/ankle active.
2.block under front thigh as needed.
3. Back leg straight with knee on floor…so leg is not rolling out.
4.hips square to front…body weight in the center…not dropping to one side.
slowly over weeks/months/years reduce the height of the props until you are on the floor.
Have a look at some Iyengar books to see how to use props.

of no props…then have the front leg more bent…so much less than 90’at knee…keep hips square, back knee on floor, body weight in middle(not dropping to one side)…then slowly over weeks/months/years work on bringing the front knee towards 90’ be sure to keep foot/ankle active to protect the knee.

with or without props take care of the knee by keeping foot/ankle active and not feeling any stretch in the knee… and lower back by keeping hips square and body weight in the center so you are not twisting or compressing the lower back.

Take it slow.

#6

Hi Zack,

I’ll have a go at your OP.

[QUOTE=zackw419;65679]
How should I go about healing my knees and the muscles behind them that I was hyperextending doing leg stretches?[/QUOTE] Zack, there should never be sharp pain in a joint, ever. Add to this that the knees are one of the three weakest links in the human body and you are wise to seek out information for self-care in your practice.

Healing the knees requires a complete protocol of things done in a very specific way. Since you say that is not possible, please begin pumping (or contracting) your quadriceps in Dandasana. If you have the tendency and latitude to hyper-flex your joints please do the action with a rolled mat or blanket running under the medial and lateral epicondyles of the femur (perpendicular to the thigh bone). Do this nine times twice per day and with each doing enlist more muscle fibers int he contraction than the time before (using mind in muscle).

[QUOTE=zackw419;65679]What poses do I need to stop? and for how long?[/QUOTE]

Poses the require hip opening when there is no hip opening will likely vector torque into the knee joint. Padmasana is a fine example. This is similar in Vira I when the student plants the back foot in the inappropriate position then swings the back hip forward toward the front of the mat. Again the torque goes into the knee. In standing poses there absolutely must be two things; the knee over the ankle bone when the knee is flexed AND a powerful external rotation of the femur (thigh bone) in the poses where the knee is not flexed (and therefore straight). Additionally, a finer point is the bones should align. You can see the absence of this when you look at the leg of a woman wearing high heeled shoes. The lower legs bones are pushed one way while the upper ones are pushed the other. This is an extreme example. If you can see your own leg bone alignment in standing poses you are “better” than any student or teacher I’ve encountered in ten years. But that is what is required - the alignment of the bones.

At very least you may have to slightly flex the knees (what some in my field call microbending) just to avoid injury. Can’t say without seeing.

[QUOTE=zackw419;65679]In the future when I’m all healed up how do I prepare my hips for poses like pigeon pose so that it doesn’t demand too much work from my knees?[/QUOTE]

We teach an entire hip series. In so doing we’ve noted the eight movements of the hip AND never work the hip in one of those movements since that is it’s nature. Ergo we always work the hip in its opposite (traction). That leaves six actions and they must be balanced based on the students living. No two students require exactly the same work. To only work external rotation (that which is mandated for the pose you mention) may mean working toward imbalance. This tends to happen when the student clings to some purpose manifested by the ego. So watch that crafty critter. Balance int he joint is far more profound over your life than "can I do Eka Pada Rajakapotasana). On the latter point the big-picture answer is “who cares”.

[QUOTE=zackw419;65679]How can I strengthen my knees?[/QUOTE]
See answer one.

[QUOTE=zackw419;65679]Also, is reclined hero pose really even safe to do in the first place? I have a hard time imagining anyone doing this pose without some kind of knee trouble.
[/QUOTE]When it is Eka Pada, done with height under the sitting bones AND the virasana shin stays rooted, AND that inner thigh stays wed to the arch of the other foot, AND the practitioner understands where to put their mind in the muscle, yes absolutely. Supta virasana however, no not at all until you have required opening. There is a vast difference between a pose that delivers opening and one which requires it. Supta Virasana requires it.

#7

Ok lots of info to go over. Thanks so much guys. Your advice is invaluble.