Persecution of Hindus and ending it

Spirituality Religion
#221

The situation of India is rapidly changing as it develops rapidly. This is easy for anybody to see who regularly goes India. Everytime they go, they notice phenomenal development. Many analysts have predicted the rise of India as an economic and knowledge superpower, poised to become the R&D hub of the world. Last time I went, India had a new state of the art metro in Delhi, and similar metros were popping up in every city. I also noticed the skyline of each Indian city rapidly changing, there was construction work everywhere I could see. Since, I understand a new terminal has been built at Delhi international airport, bigger than London heathrow and more state of the art. The world’s third largest.

Here is a glimpse of the rapidly changing face of India:




Documentaries on rising india:




The future of India is changing rapidly. It will no longer be a developing country by 2020. It is a question of pure economics. But as I’ve said time and time again, India will truly come alive when it embraces its superior dharmic culture.

#222

[QUOTE=vata07;55646]and how is any of this fact and not just your opinion???[/QUOTE]

You are going to have to be specific with your question. What is my opinion?

#223

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;55650]You are going to have to be specific with your question. What is my opinion?[/QUOTE]your claims that eastern xyz scientist/musician/poet/writer/etc. is better than abc western scientist/musician/poet/writer/etc. that you’ve spent a page and a half talking about.

#224

Oh, those are definitely facts. I have already proven why they are superior. Indian music is far more refined than Western music, based on microtones and very complex arrangement of notes and rhythms. Similarly, Indian poetry, is again based on highly refined structures, such as the use of bandhas where Sanskrit sounds can arranged into geometric patterns to produce highly complex metaphors, such as if you read a Sanskrit poem forwards you get one message, and if you read it according to a geometric pattern(backwards, zig zag, lotus) it tells you something else. This is not possible with any other poetry. I confirmed it with my English teacher back in college when giving a presentation on Sanskrit poetry. She had never heard such a feat was even possible.

And there is no doubt that Indian scientists being ahead of the West. We had all the knowledge that the West has today thousands of years ago: atoms, quantum physics, observer effects, cyclic universe, states of consciousness. Look how sought after our Yoga and Ayurveda is. If the West were not behind, then why are they after our Yoga, Vedanta, Sanskrit and Ayurveda? The answer is simple? Were ahead.

Imagine landing on an alien planet and learning about their languages, sciences, literature, poetry, cuisine, fashion, health care. It is all going to be very refined and advanced. Similarly, Indian things are more refined and advanced than Western things because they come from a superior civilisation. The West is behind in every area. We trump them in every department. These are demonstrable facts.

#225

[QUOTE=kareng;55618]The Egyptians knew about precession SD…did the Hindus know this too then?

I heard on a western documentary that it was the Egyptians that noted precession.something we have only noted a few hundred years ago…[/quote]

The Hindus not only knew about it, they calculated it correct to several decimal places:

http://www.hindupedia.com/en/Origins

Many astronomical constants can only be determined by observation as well as determination of other constants. For example, to understand Earth’s precession[11], the proper motion of stars[12] must be understood, as must the motion of Earth’s perihelion[13], as well as the period of the equinoxes[14]. The vernal equinox is often used to measure the tropical year [15].

The Surya Siddhanta[16] reports the Earth’s precession is 0?0’50.4” / year (or 0.014? per year) </ref> while modern day science has calculated this to be 0?0’50.2583” / year (or 0.013958? per year) in the year 1900[17]. The length of the tropical year varies over time, thus the difference of 0.000042? could be accounted for due to this change over time (ie the Surya Siddhanta provided the correct period for Earth’s precession at the time it was composed).

The period of unaided observation required to observe Earth’s period of motion is approximately 3,600 years assuming that the other constants are known. If they are not, than the total time required would be no less than 10,000 years of daily observation.

#226

Yoga.
+
Sanatana dharma
+
Buddha

=

India the Win!

The Rest is gravy - or a nice curry.

#227

[QUOTE=thomas;55616]God gets the credit–not people or cultures. Nobody has the right to boast since there is nothing they could do without God, upon whom their existence depends.

The most “superior” civilization is the one in which there is the greatest love of God and neighbor. The rest is meaningless without that. (Though such a civilization would not dare to call itself “superior,” as those who have great love have great humility).[/QUOTE]

No one cares about what idiot Christians think.

People and cultures always get the credit. Nothing would happen if people were as retarded as Christians, sitting on their asses and doing nothing but praying and hoping instead of [B]ACTING[/B].

“Superior” civilizations are ones that produce people with [B]character[/B].

“Christian” civilizations have been the most despicable and demonic ones in history. All they have ever done is conquer, slaughter, commit genocides, and be arrogant and supremacist.

Christianity is worst religion in history.

Keep your retarded religion’s dogmatism out of this discussion.

/discussion

#228

[QUOTE=kareng;55618]The Egyptians knew about precession SD…did the Hindus know this too then?

I heard on a western documentary that it was the Egyptians that noted precession.something we have only noted a few hundred years ago…

Music, yes its more complex in India and China…but music can be as complex as you want to make it…there are no restrictions but a matter of cultural taste…My father loved reggae and black music in general…

Poetry…is a matter of personal taste…again, it will differ according to the culture but the West has had its fair share of genius …Virgil, Homer,Yeats, Shakespeare, Byron, Shelley,the Brontes to name a few…my father, a Sikh enjoyed poetry and was impressed by many western poets SD…

It’s just too silly to suggest you have nothing to learn from anywhere but your own country…

The west has its fair share of genius in all subject areas just as the east does…SD, I cant believe you truly mean this…this is narrow-mindedness![/QUOTE]

Then your documentary fails.

All civilizations have noted precession, including the Egyptians, Greeks, Babylonians, Chinese, and so forth. Precession was not something that was noted a few centuries ago. However, some civilizations have had more precise methods of approximating such shifts in orbit.

I have to agree with you in the poetry and music area. It does not matter which civilization had the most complex meter, etc. What matters is the heart and soul they put into their music/poetry.

I also have to agree with your last statement. The West has had its share of genius in all areas, just like every civilization, culture, and so forth.

#229

[QUOTE=The Scales;55666]Yoga.
+
Sanatana dharma
+
Buddha

=

India the Win!

The Rest is gravy - or a nice curry.[/QUOTE]

Speaking of “winning”, India won the Cricket match against Pakistan!

#230

[B]“God gets the credit–not people or cultures. Nobody has the right to boast since there is nothing they could do without God, upon whom their existence depends.”[/B]

-Thomas

[QUOTE=Nietzsche;55669]No one cares about what idiot Christians think.

People and cultures always get the credit. Nothing would happen if people were as retarded as Christians, sitting on their asses and doing nothing but praying and hoping instead of [B]ACTING[/B].

“Superior” civilizations are ones that produce people with [B]character[/B].

“Christian” civilizations have been the most despicable and demonic ones in history. All they have ever done is conquer, slaughter, commit genocides, and be arrogant and supremacist.

Christianity is worst religion in history.

Keep your retarded religion’s dogmatism out of this discussion.

/discussion[/QUOTE]

The stage is set.

The players play.

#231

[QUOTE=Nietzsche;55671]Speaking of “winning”, India won the Cricket match against Pakistan![/QUOTE]

Baseball owns cricket.

#232

[QUOTE=The Scales;55682]Baseball owns cricket.[/QUOTE]

Oh, but I don’t care about cricket! Its the fact that India beat Pakistan. :smiley:

Yes, baseball is better than cricket. I, having played both sports, can readily say that.

Relatively speaking however, baseball is also not a very good sport. Soccer is where its at. :smiley:

#233

[QUOTE=The Scales;55681][B]“God gets the credit–not people or cultures. Nobody has the right to boast since there is nothing they could do without God, upon whom their existence depends.”[/B]

-Thomas

The stage is set.

The players play.[/QUOTE]

Sorry for my outburst, but I will not edit my post. I am absolutely sick of seeing illogical Christian dogma.

What about the Greeks? Egyptians? Sumerians? Babylonians? Chinese? Does Thomas consider their paganism/shaminism not “God-loving?” (Obviously not, since he is required to do so by Christianity) Were these civilizations inferior to European ones?

All civilizations and cultures, regardless of whether they are “God-loving” (more like the corpse fauning characterized by Jesus worship) or not, have produced something of import.

Thomas, never say something so ignorant, arrogant, supremacist, and bigoted again.

#234

I also have to agree with your last statement. The West has had its share of genius in all areas, just like every civilization, culture, and so forth.

I am not a relativist. When it comes to human development, there are only three great civilisations on this planet: Hindu, European and Chinese. All science, technology, mathematics has been from these civilisations and they have shaped world history.

Amongst these three great civilisations Hindus have been the most superior. We are the largest, most advanced and oldest civilisation on this planet. We were the first to build ships and navigate the seas and spread colonies far and wide all over the planet. We were the first to map out the skies, the oldest records of astronomy is recorded in the Vedas itself. We were the first to build planned cities, middle class homes and sanitation. We were the first to build universities and hospitals. We were the first to have literature and schools of philosophy. We were the first to have empires. We were the first to study the sciences and master them.

We have dominated this planet for 10,000 years. This is why we deserve the title of being called a superior civilisation. Not the Europeans who were nowhere to be seen 500 years ago. Nor the Chinese, which India dominated culturally without sending a single troop over.

We still boast of superior culture. These are not opinions, but facts. Like I said Indian music, cuisine, dance and drama, language, philosophy, healthcare is still the most refined and advanced in the world. We are the proud inheritors of a superior civilisation.

Pythagoras, Plato, Aristotle, Newton, Boyle, Einstein, Milton, Shakespeare Schrodinger maybe big in their own Western civilisation, but in our superior Hindu civilisation they do not pass any muster. We Hindus are not impressed by such inferior genius.

You are talking about a civilisation where people like Buddha, Mahavira, Lord Rama and Krishna, Patanjali, Panini, Sushrutha, Charaka, Pingala, Kapila, Gautama, Kannada, Aryabhatta, Vyassa, Valmiki, Chanakya and countless Vedic Risis have walked the planet. Why should we Hindus be impressed by the West? The West has nothing to match us. They can only learn from us, we stand to nothing to learn nothing from them. Indeed, that is exactly what has happened time and time again.

The Greeks and Chinese learned from us first by coming to our giant universities where we educated them. Then they went back to their foriegn lands with our learning. Then the Arabs learned from us, and transmitted this knowledge onto the Europeans. Then the Europeans learned directly from us and are still learning today. We have been the teachers of this world from the beginning. Indeed, that is what our country is all about - the land of risis, gurus and masters.

#235

By the way don’t fall into the Western trap of exaggerating Sumeria and Egypt. The Sumerian and Egyptians put together and doubled could fit into the Indus-Saraswati civilisation. The evidence shows us clearly that the Hindus dominated them in world trade, as we can find more imports of Hindu goods than exports of Sumerian or Egyptian goods. Hindus were well ahead of them. We did not waste resources on useless monuments for the ego of some of their priest kings, but we did use our resources to build excellent cities, which clearly testify to the vast engineering skills of the Hindus. It is a widely recognised fact now that the Hindus had the most advanced civilisation of the ancient world. Not Sumeria and Egypt.

#236

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;55695]I am not a relativist. When it comes to human development, there are only three great civilisations on this planet: Hindu, European and Chinese. All science, technology, mathematics has been from these civilisations and they have shaped world history.

Amongst these three great civilisations Hindus have been the most superior. We are the largest, most advanced and oldest civilisation on this planet. We were the first to build ships and navigate the seas and spread colonies far and wide all over the planet. We were the first to map out the skies, the oldest records of astronomy is recorded in the Vedas itself. We were the first to build planned cities, middle class homes and sanitation. We were the first to build universities and hospitals. We were the first to have literature and schools of philosophy. We were the first to have empires. We were the first to study the sciences and master them.

We have dominated this planet for 10,000 years. This is why we deserve the title of being called a superior civilisation. Not the Europeans who were nowhere to be seen 500 years ago. Nor the Chinese, which India dominated culturally without sending a single troop over.

We still boast of superior culture. These are not opinions, but facts. Like I said Indian music, cuisine, dance and drama, language, philosophy, healthcare is still the most refined and advanced in the world. We are the proud inheritors of a superior civilisation.

Pythagoras, Plato, Aristotle, Newton, Boyle, Einstein, Milton, Shakespeare Schrodinger maybe big in their own Western civilisation, but in our superior Hindu civilisation they do not pass any muster. We Hindus are not impressed by such inferior genius.

You are talking about a civilisation where people like Buddha, Mahavira, Lord Rama and Krishna, Patanjali, Panini, Sushrutha, Charaka, Pingala, Kapila, Gautama, Kannada, Aryabhatta, Vyassa, Valmiki, Chanakya and countless Vedic Risis have walked the planet. Why should we Hindus be impressed by the West? The West has nothing to match us. They can only learn from us, we stand to nothing to learn nothing from them. Indeed, that is exactly what has happened time and time again.

The Greeks and Chinese learned from us first by coming to our giant universities where we educated them. Then they went back to their foriegn lands with our learning. Then the Arabs learned from us, and transmitted this knowledge onto the Europeans. Then the Europeans learned directly from us and are still learning today. We have been the teachers of this world from the beginning. Indeed, that is what our country is all about - the land of risis, gurus and masters.[/QUOTE]

What an Indocentric interpretation of history and not the least bit factual at that!

Surya Deva, stop acting like this. That post had little to no basis in history. The Chinese and the Greeks largely developed their concepts independently.

Rejecting Eurocentrism is fine, but don’t replace it with Indocentrism! Instead, do your best to portray the Truth, by citing the common achievements and developments among all civilizations.

This doesn’t mean that you should not tout the achievements of those civilizations and the superiority of one over another. However, you should not claiming Indocentric things without any proof whatsoever.

#237

Nietzsche, you are your own worst enemy :wink: You claim to be a mortal warrior against eurocentric history and claimed to hate the West, and yet you actually support eurocentric history :wink: You praise Western scientists, mathematicans and engineers, you praise capitalism, and so far I have seen you say nothing about the great scientists, mathematicians and engineers in our Hindu civilisation.

You are neither here or there. I think you are confused what side you are batting on :wink:

There is nothing unfactual or interpretative about the history I have told you. The Greeks learned from the Hindus, they did not develop their concepts independently. They inherited their philosophy from the Hindus. Even Western scholars have pointed this out.

Some of the things the Greeks borrowed from the Hindus:

5 element theory/ mahabhuttas
Pythagorean theorem/
atoms/ paramanus
3 humours of the body/ tridosha
transmigration of the soul
the teacher-student academy/ gurukul
the senses as an imprisonment of the soul and meditation and platonism/ Vedanta
the 7 days of the week named after planets

These subjects were taught in Indian universities like Taxshilla which attracted Chinese and Greek students. So it is hardly surprisingly how this knowledge was transferred to the Chinese and Greeks.

#238

http://www.ideaindia.com/product_detail.php?pid=1637

MANY HAVE noted some strange parallels between Hindu and Greek philosophies, Did one influence the other? Or were the similar ideas spontaneous original growths? Or was a common ancestry responsible ? The author examines such questions in this engrossing book. He warns us that all Hindu philosophy was not idealistic as was not Greek. But Vedantic monism ultimately came to rule the roost in India, and Plato was a major influence in Greek philosophy.

The author therefore, mainly compares Plato’s ideas with those of Hindu idealist philo*sophy. The resemblances, like Plato’s idea of the detached Philosopher-king, like the rajarshi, his three classes, almost castes, in his Republic, his conception of the nous and the Demiurge, like jivatman and paramatman his idea of doxa (appearances), very much like the Hindu maya, his three-part formulation of the soul, corresponding to sattva, rajas and tamas, his doctrine of rebirth etc all point to borrowings from India. which developed these ideas earlier. No direct proof is possible, hut there were contacts between ancient India and Greece, and the circumstantial evidence for Greek borrowing which the author brings forward with judicious care, is overwhelming. Both Socrates and Plato may have had, the author gives reasons to think, Indian contacts. In any case, the Pvthagoreans had them, as the author proves. and these two eminent fathers of Greek philosophy had acknowledged connections with the followers of Pythagoras. whose ideas are deeply permeated with Hindu idealist philosophy.

An article showing the clear influences of Hindu culture and philosophy on Greek culture and philosophy: http://www.rationalvedanta.net/node/84

#239

Some more evidence showing the Hindus originally influenced Greek philosophy:

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=JkOAEdIsdUsC&pg=PA599&lpg=PA599&dq=hindu+philosophy+influenced+greek+philosophy&source=bl&ots=SM3guVI1Bn&sig=QvhHyUlckLSb-gCusp8Aknx_XNo&hl=en&ei=M82TTYn6DcKyhAeUodT0CA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=8&ved=0CEIQ6AEwBzgK#v=onepage&q&f=false

The Greeks themselves admit that their original philosophers went to the orient in order to study philosophy. And what was that oriental country which dominated international trade and education and had massive universities with international students from all parts of the world? India. India was the education hub of the world. There is nothing indocentric about that, this is pure fact.

Philosophy was not welcome in Greece. In fact philosophers were killed. Socrates was killed, do you recall? It was called a pagan activity by the Roman catholic church. This is because philosophy did not begin in Greece, it had Hindu precursors. People from the orient travelled to Greece and this is how philosophy began in Greece. They did not independently develop it.

#240

Another Western scholar who acknowledges very clearly based on his 40 years of research that the Greeks learned their philosophy from India:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4553155406381622401#

Watch from 10 min onwards

For me it is an open and shut case. The Greeks learned philosophy from the Hindus, but then took that learning and went their own trajectory with it. This is evident because the Greek philosophy did not reach the same level of developments the Indians did and same extent of rationality. Thus clearly indicating that whatever they learned from the India originally was only a fragment, which when transposed onto Greece and lost its context and soon developed new meanings. For example the Mahabhuttas being the original source of the philosophy of 5 elements in the Hindu tradition referred to the empirical categories of the senses, each sense apprehending a unique element(eyes apprehend light, skin apprehends forces etc) But when the Greeks received it, they literally took the 5 elements as earth, air, fire, water and interpreted them as assuming a position in the world based on their weight. Aristotle, reinterpreted it further and got rid of the 5th element. Similarly, the Greeks changed everything they originally learned from India. The tridosha of Ayurveda(vata, pitta, kapha) corresponding to the bodies regulation systems in the Greek system became phelgem, bile and wind.

So while, we were the indeed the original teachers of Greece and bought philosophy into Greece, what the Greeks did with it was largely their own work. In that sense I am not taking anything away from what the Greeks did. I am merely pointing out an obvious fact that they inherited the art of philosophy from the Hindus. A fact pointed out by several scholars.