Questions re Kriya Yoga, Yogananda and Self-Realization Fellowship (SRF)


#61

Would someone please tell me what is the “bouncing half lotus.” I have not heard of this until now. :slight_smile:

PYislove wrote “Devotees beware, a live guru may not be a spiritually living guru.” Perhaps you are trying to point out that because one calls themselves a guru they may not be living a spiritual life. Please clarify what you mean.


#62

Lavendar;;;;;;
Unless one reaches higher levels of samadhi [ Self-Realization] we are all spiritually dead, even though we seem to be alive and walking around.
We are all still just dreaming that that relative world is real- it is not!
This is the cautionary part - there are many fast talking charismatic
persons who can attract students and are unrealized. They cannot take
you very far as the are not “living Gurus”. Not easy to tell for many out there!
The religious world is really full of false teachers who often have great
ambitions but no realization.
A “living Guru” functions fully for devotees whether in the body or not,
the physical body is no longer necessary for a real Guru to work with
devotees.

Bouncing lotus is a half lotus while bouncing the other knee up and down with the hand to limber up the hips and knees.
I don’t know if anyone teaches it anymore, it may be in a couple of older
books on hatha yoga.


#63

Okay, PYislove, you are talking about false gurus. Unrealized teachers. Much has all ready been said about this on several different Yoga Forum threads. This is nothing new. False spiritual teachers have been around throughout the ages. So, I presume this all boils down to PY being a “living guru” and helping devotees even though he is no longer in the physical realm. Even though I do not share the same kriya lineage as you, I do respect your views and unwavering dedication / support of Paramahamsa Yogananda and SRF.
No, can’t say I have ever seen the “bouncing lotus” done. But, thank you for elaborating on this. I am aware of a pose called the “butterfly” where the side to side motion is like the fluttering of a butterfly’s wings.( I know you are not referring to the butterfly pose)


#64

[QUOTE=Seeking;77231]There are accounts of others that show P.Y. Did modify the Kriya of Lahiri Mahasaya i will put some links up for everyone. And address some more of this busy rightnow.[/QUOTE]

I am not sure their opinions are that reliable.
would you like to enlarge on exactly what these changes are?


#65

[QUOTE=PYislove;77326]I am not sure their opinions are that reliable.
would you like to enlarge on exactly what these changes are?[/QUOTE]

I see now that Kriya is too fractured to be discussed, different groups have different beliefs and devotions so why should I an honest truth seeker beat my head up against that wall? Lol no thanks. If you have doubts just search the answers are available, you may not like what you find though. Probably better of just sticking to what you already know.


#66

Paramahansa Yogananda and Self-Realization Fellowship are one and the same.
SRF accurately teaches and represents the master’s final wishes
and vision for His great legacy.
His founding of an organization does not oppose what LM was telling
most other devotees. LM was clearly making sure that it was launched
by the right divine soul without a lot of initial confusion.

Since Lahairi Mahasaya did give different versions of Kriya Yoga
to various devotees according to their needs. He has set the
precedent for other Self-realized teachers to adapt it for the
needs of others. I believe Yogananda when He tells us that;
"The very same Kriya Yoga that I learned from SY is what
I have taught here.“
Does anyone have clear evidence to dispute this claim?
I hope that no one here holds a mindset that there is
"only one way” to do or teach anything. Yogis should
leave that narrowness behind long ago.
Again - the results will tell the story.

This major global spiritual dispensation was being
set up to bring Meditation and Kriya Yoga globally and Yogananda
was the one being prepared for this huge undertaking.
It had to be adaptable to a very wide range of devotees from
many faiths and cultures.
His work is a great success…

[QUOTE=Seeking;77268]All you are doing is spreading the Church of SRF point of view and it is not correct. Kechari is most certainly needed from personal experience not the company line. I can report it closes the circuit and the effect is profound.

I deeply respect P.Y. More than you will ever know. SRF is not P.Y. Unless you are very old you are relying on those that came after the Masters departure.

I can appreciate the profound change SRF has brought in your life. Truly I can Paramahansa Yoganandas Lessons have been with me for well over 25 years.

Lets bottom line this shall we?

  1. I ask you to stop writing about agendas ok? Everybody & Every orginization to include SRF has one. That does not by itself make it bad as your writing insinuates.

  2. Babaji and Lahiri Mahasaya expressly forbid the forming of groups and orginizations around Kriya.

  3. Lahiri Mahasaya is the ultimate authority on Kriya second only to Babaji. L.M. Codified Kriya for the householder.

  4. P.Y. Simplified as he saw fit, good I will not dare argue what he decided I have no idea what his reasons were. My question is did he? Or was it someone who came after him? Did he sit with you and say dear one I changed L.H.'s kriya because it was not as streamlined as it could be? No he did not now did he? So how do you know anyhing more than those whom you respect have taught you? Answer you do not.

  5. I asked the monks of KYI in person I said Swamaji why is your version of Kriya so different from what I was taught by SRF? Why does it match how his book described the practice so much more than what SRF teaches? by the way he did know the SRF methods. He said you must understand Paramahansaji came to America in the 1920’s people then thought sitting on the floor was insane. So he changed things so his audience of the time could derive some good from Kriya practice. Sri Harinanda came to America in the 70’s he looked around and said the people are ready lets give it all to them.

This very discussion is exactly why forming groups around Kriya practice was forbidden. Furthermore the alterations in Yogirag Lahiri Mahasayas teaching of Kriya is another. I hold suspect every group teaching Kriya based on this injunction not to.

I furthermore state that anyone knowing the forming of groups around Kriya was forbidden even described as such in Autobiography of a Yogi by P.Y. should question everything as well.

There are direct lineages from Lahiri Mahasaya that did not come from the dividing line of Sri Yukteswar who did go against his Gurus wishes and form societies and orginizations around Kriya Yoga. The Kriya they teach is not the same as Sri Yukteswar derived lineages.

In fact the Kriya taught by SRF and Hari Harrinandas KYI both whom are of Sri Yukteswars lineage are very different. Yes I am aware of SRF suing KYI, Donald Walters and anyone who dares go against the world wide church of SRF. Or claim to be the sole holder of the Kriya knowledge.

I also know many of the senior Monks of SRF long time members split from SRF some years ago. Care to explain that.

Bottom line SRF. Is not THE AUTHORITY on Kriya Yoga. SRF is a great orginization serving humanity and does far more good than harm. There are some who find their destination with SRF. I think that is good and nice. I however am not one to be part of an orginization.

Yogiraj Lahiri Mahasaya forbid this I follow the Guru of my heart I have not met in the flesh but have been blessed to be visited by not once but twice in otherworldly circumsances that are not for casual conversation.

His words are my scripture his example my goal. I am very greatful to P.Y. For sharing his lifes story which led me home to Lahiri Mahasaya. I am grateful to his vehicle SRF for making this possible.

What I am not greatful for is groups changing Kriya. Some seem to think oh it is okay the core is still intact even if there are changes.

Pardon my Language but that is B.S. example: In my younger days I was a mechanic. I used air ratchets changed tires rebuilt engines, A/C etc… I gave the tools to a person who wanted to rotate his tires.

He used my air ratchet my torq sticks, my sockets rotated the tires yet took it upon himself to put the lugs on his way.

His way was backwards. He nearly lost a wheel going down the highway. He put the lugs on flat side facing the rim, not the acorn shaped side.

They loosened at high speed, even though the tools and the method were close. 1 little change nearly took his life. This person is my younger brother.

Food for thought. Kriya works with life force. Not simple lug nuts.

What SRF teaches is both safe and powerful at the same time. It is however not the Kriya of Lahiri Mahasaya.[/QUOTE]


#67

Best wishes may those who find a home with SRF as Pyislove continue to grow in God realization.


#68

And may you also find divine realization by
following and learning from the Great Ones.

Those who have reached the goal are showing
us the way to Reality where we are all One.

[QUOTE=Seeking;77426]Best wishes may those who find a home with SRF as Pyislove continue to grow in God realization.[/QUOTE]


#69

[QUOTE=Yoga_questions;67287]Hello Everyone :slight_smile:
Based on the information provided on the Self-Realization Fellowship (SRF) website first I found the teachings and the information regarding the associated yoga compelling, because they promise to be the way to “find God” and to attain “unity with God” and find “God’s eternal bliss” through a direct personal experience, but I started to have doubts after I looked at their claims a little closer.[/QUOTE]

Ya, this is one of the first red-flag fallacies promoted by SRF.

[QUOTE=Yoga_questions;67287]
The above claims - as well as many others listed on the SRF website - are very strong claims and many of them are contradictory to one another. These claims also imply their scientific validity as they are called “definite scientific techniques” and the “scientific methods of yoga” in attaining direct personal experience and unity with God.
[/QUOTE]

Yoga is not scientific. Every so often some EGO-driven being tries and conform yoga to the bracket of known science. It is not, cannot be, and was never “scientific” – My stomach turns when I hear “yogis” take about ‘science’ of yoga.

[QUOTE=Yoga_questions;67287]
I was searching the “Contact us” section on the website for an email address at which I could ask my questions directly from them, but I haven’t found any. So I was wondering if anyone on this forum who is knowledgeable and/or has experience with Yogananda’s teachings, the SRF, and Kriya Yoga, could explain/answer the following questions:

  • How can Yogananda and his followers scientifically prove that someone’s personal experience and the “truths” derived from such experience - either Yogananda’s or that of others - are with objective and scientific validity?
    [/QUOTE]

They cannot, and neither can anyone else. It is not within the scope of possibility my friend.

[QUOTE=Yoga_questions;67287]

  • On what objective basis do they call their yoga methods “scientific” and what exactly is their definition of science and scientific method?[/QUOTE]

This whole thing over the ‘science’ of yoga is an issue or public relations and advertising. The Westerns hear the word ‘science’ and puff up with ignorant pride thinking what they do is so highly intelligent and correct.

[QUOTE=Yoga_questions;67287]

  • If their claim of scientific method has the assumption of objective and verifiable validity - which it has to, otherwise it contradicts the core concept of the definition of science - how can they prove with objective validity and verifiability that their path provides faster results than other spiritual paths?[/QUOTE]

They cannot prove anything they claim, just like Christians cannot prove that the magic baby really existed. In all probability, they are feeding their followers an artificial reality paradigm. It is important for them to convince you of these “key” points because after your mind has “accepted” these “facts” you have bee sufficiently brainwashed.

[QUOTE=Yoga_questions;67287]
Do they have access to all other personal experiences and individual paths? [/QUOTE]

Most definitely not. They are practically terrified by the idea of the path of individuality and strength. Most top monks in SRF are the most brainwashed fools you will ever meet.

[QUOTE=Yoga_questions;67287]
What scientific method do they use to objectively compare the different individual experiences regarding their effectiveness and “speed” to lead to certain spiritual goals and how can they objectively verify the results of such comparison? [/QUOTE]

They do not - they merely follow anything and everything that “Paramahansa Yoganana” (actual name Mukanda Lal Ghosh) told them.

[QUOTE=Yoga_questions;67287]
How can they scientifically and with objective validity measure one’s speed in spiritual development and the opposite effect which they call a “diluting” effect? [/QUOTE]

Starting to notice a pattern? Don’t dismiss your instincts my friend.

[QUOTE=Yoga_questions;67287]
Where can we read such research results from peer-reviewed sources that are accepted and/or debated by the scientific community?[/QUOTE]

There are none.

[QUOTE=Yoga_questions;67287]

  • What kind of scientific proof they can provide that the personal experiences through these yoga and meditation practices are from God, rather than from hallucinations, self-hypnosis, or some other not-shared mental states? (The perceived “beauty” of these personal images, “bliss” or other effects perceived as positive do not necessarily imply the presence of God.) [/QUOTE]

None.

[QUOTE=Yoga_questions;67287]

  • If we assume the existence of God and the spiritual realm, how can they scientifically prove that the experience attained through these methods is from and with God rather than from some other, possibly misleading and malevolent spirits of the spiritual realm? [/QUOTE]

We cannot. I have personally experience and spoken to others that have accidentally opened up something suspicious in the spirit world from “doing” SRF kriya and studying the bullshit the spew forth from their bloated mouths.

[QUOTE=Yoga_questions;67287]
The very fact that a human being is abundantly prone to such deception/delusion is a well-known fact in religious studies and for example evident from Teresa de Avila’s - a Christian/Catholic saint’s - personal accounts as well, whom Yogananda in his own books nevertheless uses as a “reference” to support his statements on the subject.[/QUOTE]

Yogananda was delusional man, put it together. No one is going to tell you the truth. They want your energy and life force for their organization and ideals.

[QUOTE=Yoga_questions;67287]

  • Another question beyond the above: In addition to those of Kriya Yoga, do the practitioners and teachers of other forms/types of yoga and/or meditation claim as well that their methods eventually lead to a personal unity with God or this is a special case?[/QUOTE]

Every path I have every studied has this quality to it. When one makes such a statement like that, rest assured it is sourced from an ignorant and suggestible state of mind.


#70

As Hari Harinanda once said Mistake is not for mistake it is for correcting.

Well I made a mistake I stated the SRF does not teach Kechari Mudra.

Well it turns out after re-reading my lessons from SRF on the very first Kriya initiation they do, it is one of the first steps in preparation for Kriya Pranayama it is just not called out by name.

Sorry if this bit of misinformation caused anyone an inconvenience.


#71

To mndfck666;

you have such doubts and exaggerated fears of many things you don’t yet
seem to see the value of.
To know anything of value about a path one has to do a lot
more than mere study. One has to practice for some time - years.
Not only that, it really helps if you understand what you are doing.
Otherwise there won’t be much in the way of positive results.

In fact, we are constructed in such a way that it is very difficult
to even compare various paths, because to do so properly you
would have to go back to the person you were years ago
each time you wanted to do the experiment over, this cannot be done.
For each test of something new you would be at a different stage.

It is strange that you don’t understand Your own mental conflicts
that in the face of so many hundreds of millions of persons benefiting
in untold positive ways from the practice of various kinds of Yoga
you still [with skewed outlook] are trying to claim there is nothing
to it.
This leads me to believe that you are some kind of confused
orthodox believer of some popular religious movement and totally
fear anything different. Or maybe an atheist - who know?

Just what is it that you are looking for?


#72

What amazes me about Yoga is that it is mystical, physical, and 100% scientific. I use that in a term as in: a method by which anyone who practices it can experience results. Metaphorically speaking, like the science of turning iron to steel.

It deals with the science of the human body, its nervous system, blood system, respiratory ect… you get my drift? It is a human science, it is a medical science, it is a neurological science. When you hold your arms in to a certain degree for a set length of time, with a particular breath pattern, your body will have a physical response to this. dormant parts of the brain start to light up as well, new neurological pathways are strengthened. I could go on for hours about anatomy, the proven effects of pranayam and mantra, but its all out there for any sincere seeker to find and experience.

I think the reason people say things like Kriya yoga or Kundalini yoga are the fastest way to attain high states is for two reasons:

  1. Emphasis on soul, divine, meditation, pranayam, and union with cosmic consciousness. Other forms of yoga focus mostly on assana(physical posture).
  2. There is so much emphasis on a daily personal practice (Sadhana) When you wake up ever morning to practice yoga and chant mantra/kirtan of gratitude and praise, after X amount of time you will come out a different person.

The parts where you hear about unification with god is an individual result because god is an opinion in its self. For what I think god is, yoga definitely provides me a physical practice that allows me to feel deeply connected to the universal one, that according to quantum physics (a science), we are all apart of. “If you can’t see God in all, you can’t see god at all”-Yogi Bhajan.

Yoga_Questions- I appreciate where you are coming from and have had the same questions. Since you are so interested in Science, I challenge you to become the scientist yourself. Do a little experiment and see what happens :slight_smile:

With love
-Sat nam


#73

mndfck666~

Like an analyst.
In any field.
You must cut the wheat from the chaff.
for the work isn’t,hasn’t,and wont always already be done for you.

Even modern “science” is full of corpses.

Authority has the power to corrupt. Many fields have authorities. And people blindly listen to officials and professionals. Lmao.


#74

What I think mndfck666 is trying to express is don’t be so quick to follow an organization’s teachings or that of some self - proclaimed guru. Don’t believe what they tell you without testing and experiencing whether or not their claims bear any merit.

I like this guy — mndfck666 he’s very practical! Not living in fantasy.


#75

He is living in a fantasy of denial and negativity;

[QUOTE=Lavendar;77680]What I think mndfck666 is trying to express is don’t be so quick to follow an organization’s teachings or that of some self - proclaimed guru. Don’t believe what they tell you without testing and experiencing whether or not their claims bear any merit.

I like this guy — mndfck666 he’s very practical! Not living in fantasy.[/QUOTE]


#76

[QUOTE=PYislove;77682]He is living in a fantasy of denial and negativity;[/QUOTE]
What the persons deal is but they do express a lack of compassion,tolerance and peace in their reply as well as a belief in evil entities visiting people who meditate.

Overall I get the impression of someone who is at war with themselves and as such think that they should stick to one name on a forum and practice better community behavior. Hatred written like this is a sign of some serious internal work that needs addressed.

Ones mode of expression in ones writing is like a signature. Do not worry I will not out you. Others know who you are also.

Now as for SRF and orginizations in general it is ones own Karma that draws one to them. If a person is blessed by association with orginizations or not is a case by case issue.

I have been blessed greatly by both SRF and KYI. @ O.P.So find out for yourself or don’t in the grand scheme of things your little ego is not that important it is a fiction as is everyones reading and posting including my own.

Now I have been doing some very serious research and self inquiry and it has found it’s way on these boards. This has been a working out process and my conclusions are such for now.

As long as you are associated with the lineage of Lahiri Mahasaya and have taken initiation from an authorized person of the lineage as I was by Swami Atmavidyananda Giri of KYI in person then your initiation and the Kriya Yoga you practice are authentic. http://www.kriya.org/about__swami.php?id=53

The difference in my practice after being initiated is profound, trust me when I say written instructions can not replace initiation. Shaktipat is needed and if you get initiated and nothing changes then you know there was no true initiation just a show.

I have also discovered Lahiri Mahasaya tailored the Kriyas he taught to the individual based on the individuals need. He did not just hand out a work out plan. This explains exactly why different people and teachers report different things in the teaching of Kriya. ALSO BIG REVELATION HERE as a devotee of Lahiri Mahasaya I pray for his guidance in meditation. During and after Kriya practice new methods of Kriya reveal themselves to me by occuring spontaneously on there own. One of which was P.Y.'s early Kriya Pranayama revisions I was shocked later to discover this outside of my own experience.

Your Karma leads you to your version of Kriya to practice your devotion and practice with aid from the masters teach you more when your Guru is not incarnate.

I have discovered Paramahansa Yogananda changed the Kriya he taught not once but 3 times. The original in the 1920’s used the front channel to the bindu point and triangulated to the point between the brows then to medulla later that changed from this to the point between the eyes over thead. This is not the full description of either but any Kriyaban will understand. The final revision, I will not describe at all it is the version I vowed not to share publicly.

Lavendar has a personal guru of Lahiri Mahasayas lineage here in the United States. This member is very happy with his teachings. Sorry Lavendar get ready for the personal messages.

My conclusion is this it is your own Karma that you are being drawn and serving the way of learning and practicing Kriya Yoga at the time and history you have. You are being drawn to the place you fit. Like attracts like this does not mean you will always fit where you started.

So if you are with SRF that is good they are real.

If you are with KYI Good that is real. Now wait if Pyislove wants to point out that Paramahansa Yogananda declaired SRF was the only ligetamate channel for his teachings there is no issue there. KYI does not just go by P.Y. Teachings of Kriya but the rest of the lineage as well. Yes SRF lost their lawsuit over Sri Yukteswars property and there is probably some lingering sore feelings over that but this is the problem with orginizations.

As such just like P.Y. Wrote they are hornets nests. I for one could care less what orginizations may bicker over. My involvement has to do with being a householder and a yogi devoted to the Masters who have come from Lahiri Mahasaya and are activly helping those such as myself whose karma by just law of God has lead me to learn.

So there you have it just avoid the crooks out there but if you can’t it was your Karma so be wise but not too surprised.:wink:

As an aside my Karma was leading me to a traveling Guru from India then it lead me to Lavendars Guru, then it lead me away from him then to these boards then to Lavendar and back to her guru whom with his kind advice and acceptance steered me away from that traveling fraud. My Karma once again led me away from Lavendars Guru and to KYI.

So don’t think it is a straight path you may have to circle an issue like a wary cat.


#77

PYis love — “He is living in a fantasy of denial and negativity.”

This is merely your opinion based upon his response to Yoga_Questions post. An opinion is only an opinion. Does not make it fact.

I sincerely wish you and everyone else posting on this thread the very best; whatever your chosen path may be. May you all find what you seek!

Peace, Compassion, and Tolerance


#78

“An opinion is only an opinion. It does not make it fact.” This statement also goes for my opinions that have been expressed here. If we are tolerant of others I think we can learn something from each other.

Peace, Compassion, and Tolerance — thanks, “Seeking” these are positive aspects all of humanity needs!


#79

Seeking said;
“Your Karma leads you to your version of Kriya to practice your devotion and practice with aid from the masters teach you more when your Guru is not incarnate.”

Seeking said;
“I have discovered Paramahansa Yogananda changed the Kriya he taught not once but 3 times. The original in the 1920’s used the front channel to the bindu point and triangulated to the point between the brows then to medulla later that changed from this to the point between the eyes over thead. This is not the full description of either but any Kriyaban will understand. The final revision, I will not describe at all it is the version I vowed not to share publicly.”

Pyislove says;
If your teacher is a Living Guru, one who has reached the highest Self-Realization[cosmic consciousness], He can do more for you than one who is not as advanced still in the body. It may seem sort of handy to have your Guru in form. In many cases devotees rarely see Him or are with Him - or when he dies what then. This seemingly handy situation comes with many shortcomings and problems for devotees.[I won’t go into a dissertation on this] Depending on who you are dealing with and where you are spiritually already?

Since Yogananda’s mahasamadhi in 1952 there have been many reports of devotees being taught Kriya yoga and having many direct dealings in their lives re teaching shaktipat, etc., If you do some research on the net many testimonials can be found.
I will personally testify to His ongoing help in many ways in my spiritual life.
If one is not spiritually awakened they may still be teaching, but they are not necessarily a Guru. Few teachers are in the category of Guru. the modern usage of
this sacred word is degraded today. That is one who does not need to be in form, or even if in form He does not need to be in your physical presence to work with you etc.
They have progressed beyond the restrictions of time and space.
They have awakened from the dream and limits of the relative world.
Also, Yogananda via SRF/YSS left all the clear teachings of every major aspect and yogic approach for devotees to use. Each one will find with His ongoing help through the lessons and even by His personal guidance whatever they need without wandering from teacher to teacher. Sometimes a hazardous trip.
Once one has made a commitment to Yogananda’s guruship via SRF/YSS, everything is there, and it is only a restless inconsistency that causes devotees to imagine that they need to keep changing teachers to progress. That is just unnecessary.
People sometimes have problems following instructions, which always gets taken care of for those who make the effort and stick with it. You will not only get it right in time, but you will gain the blessing of perfecting your attunement with your Guru will will develop other spiritual strengths in your process of self-transformation. Going all over the place running after every new guru that show up in town just does not do the same thing. there may be exceptions but don’t imagine to easily the you are the exception - maybe not! It is easy and foolish to find fault with the tools.

A short story;I once met a couple of devotees who said that after taking SRF kriya they went to some teacher from Montreal to get some higher kriyas. When they told me what they got, I told them that all that was in their lessons. They took a look at their lessons again and found that they already had the necessary data - they were quite embarrassed. this happens so often in my personal experience.
We miss many things when there is not enough persistence.

On the other issue of seemingly changed approaches to teaching. there are some things that Yogananda would change as required in different circumstances. But to assume that the teaching of the techniques was one of them could be due to various factors. The only observation that makes you imagine that He had to change his method would be from different version of the lessons you may have read. these lessons were compiled by others under his supervision. His work schedule was extremely heavy to put it mildly. I could be that once he found things were not published properly in lessons He would have them make corrections. The most recent SRF lessons would be the most correct I agree.
Although Yogananda rarely left things half done, a few things had to be upgraded and edited, for which He left ample instructions. Especially for His Autobiography.

Who knows what path will give each one the deepest inspiration needed at this
any in the journey. But once you find a true Guru, your search is over. it will take the rest of your struggling life to make use of His wisdom.
guarde la difference!
with respect, PYislove…


#80

[QUOTE=PYislove;77721]Seeking said;*
“Your Karma leads you to your version of Kriya to practice your devotion and practice with aid from the masters teach you more when your Guru is not incarnate.”

Seeking said;*
“I have discovered Paramahansa Yogananda changed the Kriya he taught not once but 3 times. The original in the 1920’s used the front channel to the bindu point and triangulated to the point between the brows then to medulla later that changed from this to the point between the eyes over thead. This is not the full description of either but any Kriyaban will understand. The final revision, I will not describe at all it is the version I vowed not to share publicly.”

Pyislove says;*
If your teacher is a Living Guru, one who has reached the highest Self-Realization[cosmic consciousness], He can do more for you than one who is not as advanced still in the body. It may seem sort of handy to have your Guru in form. In many cases devotees rarely see Him or are with Him - or when he dies what then. This seemingly handy situation comes with many shortcomings and problems for devotees.[I won’t go into a dissertation on this] Depending on who you are dealing with and where you are spiritually already?

Since Yogananda’s mahasamadhi in 1952 there have been many reports of devotees being taught Kriya yoga and having many direct dealings in their lives re teaching shaktipat, etc., If you do some research on the net many testimonials can be found.
I will personally testify to His ongoing help in many ways in my spiritual life.
If one is not spiritually awakened they may still be teaching, but they are not necessarily a Guru. Few teachers are in the category of Guru. the modern usage of
this sacred word is degraded today. That is one who does not need to be in form, or even if in form He does not need to be in your physical presence to work with you etc.
They have progressed beyond the restrictions of time and space.*
They have awakened from the dream and limits of the relative world.
Also, Yogananda via SRF/YSS left all the clear teachings of every major aspect and yogic approach for devotees to use. Each one will find with His ongoing help through the lessons and even by His personal guidance whatever they need without wandering from teacher to teacher. Sometimes a hazardous trip.*
Once one has made a commitment to Yogananda’s guruship via SRF/YSS, everything is there, and it is only a restless inconsistency that causes devotees to imagine that they need to keep changing teachers to progress. That is just unnecessary.
People sometimes have problems following instructions, which always gets taken care of for those who make the effort and stick with it. You will not only get it right in time, but you will gain the blessing of perfecting your attunement with your Guru will will develop other spiritual strengths in your process of self-transformation. Going all over the place running after every new guru that show up in town just does not do the same thing. there may be exceptions but don’t imagine to easily the you are the exception - maybe not! It is easy and foolish to find fault with the tools.

A short story;I once met a couple of devotees who said that after taking SRF kriya they went to some teacher from Montreal to get some higher kriyas. When they told me what they got, I told them that all that was in their lessons. They took a look at their lessons again and found that they already had the necessary data - they were quite embarrassed. this happens so often in my personal experience.*
We miss many things when there is not enough persistence.*

On the other issue of seemingly changed approaches to teaching. there are some things that Yogananda would change as required in different circumstances. But to assume that the teaching of the techniques was one of them could be due to various factors. The only observation that makes you imagine that He had to change his method would be from different version of the lessons you may have read. these lessons were compiled by others under his supervision. His work schedule was extremely heavy to put it mildly. I could be that once he found things were not published properly in lessons He would have them make corrections. The most recent SRF lessons would be the most correct I agree.*
Although Yogananda rarely left things half done, a few things had to be upgraded and edited, for which He left ample instructions. Especially for His Autobiography.

Who knows what path will give each one the deepest inspiration needed at this*
any in the journey. But once you find a true Guru, your search is over. it will take the rest of your struggling life to make use of His wisdom.
guarde la difference! *
with respect, *PYislove…[/QUOTE]

Pyislove says;*
If your teacher is a Living Guru, one who has reached the highest Self-Realization[cosmic consciousness], He can do more for you than one who is not as advanced still in the body.

Seeking says: Agree 100%

Pyislove says: If one is not spiritually awakened they may still be teaching, but they are not necessarily a Guru.*

Seeking says: Agree 100%

Pyislove says: Few teachers are in the category of Guru. the modern usage ofthis sacred word is degraded today. That is one who does not need to be in form, or even if in form He does not need to be in your physical presence to work with you etc.
They have progressed beyond the restrictions of time and space.

They have awakened from the dream and limits of the relative world.

Seeking says: Agree 100%

Pyislove Says:*Once one has made a commitment to Yogananda’s guruship via SRF/YSS, everything is there, and it is only a restless inconsistency that causes devotees to imagine that they need to keep changing teachers to progress. That is just unnecessary.

Seeking says: Agree to disagree this is too broad of a blanket statement to fit to everyone. It certainly did not fit me nor your implied accusation. This way of addressing others you do not know is the false surety generated by organizations and it is rude.

Furthermore you assume too much I have never Guru hopped I have teaching sought. My quest is over. I came to my conclusions.*

You have mistaken my series of steps as Guru hoping and window shopping, that is both insulting and shows you do not comprehend what others write outside of the confines of you own SRF doctrine which is fine but please don’t disparage this one sir.

SRF and YSS as is KYI and any other are organizations and as such ran by flawed people just like all the rest. I do not agree with your faith in your statements.

PYislove says: wandering from teacher to teacher. Sometimes a hazardous trip.*

Seeking Says: agree Almost 100% but would like to add it is always 100% a hazardous trip, it is incredibly hazardous. For some, not all *the trip is 100% necessary for some it is just curiosity seeking but not all. But what about the firmly indoctrinated that stick with something that is not right for them? What about those who do not have the certainty of mind or faith in themselves because they have let others take on that burden of living for them under the cloak of spirituality. Those are the ones that need help not the ones bold enough to seek and find. Just to be clear I do not say you are of such a kind. I believe you have found your home with SRF. Blessed are they that land in the right spot for them the first time.

Pyislove says: A short story;I once met a couple of devotees who said that after taking SRF kriya they went to some teacher from Montreal to get some higher kriyas.

Seeking says: I think I know who that is. He might even be worse than the great thief Donald himself. Boy that’s bad glad you could help them.

PYislove says:*The only observation that makes you imagine that He had to change his method would be from different version of the lessons you may have read. these lessons were compiled by others under his supervision.

Seeking says: Be nice now, imagine is not correct terminology there are other teachers that come from Lahiri Mahasayas line that teach Kriya much differently. All are pretty similar to what SRF teaches now, yet different. FYI I have no problem with P.Y changing things that was certainly in his prerogative to do. Older devotees and the lessons on Kriya performance from the 20’s and the thirties show that it was done differently.

What the people over at SRF teach is for you and those like you thus is your karma. So how the method is taught now satisfies you and yours, good for you and I mean that I am not trying to be nasty.

I however never felt the completeness of What SRF teaches in Paramahansa Yoganandas name as you do so off seeking I went and have found.

I believe that Paramahansa Yogananda fulfilled his journey to the West in every way. That is my conclusion.

I believe that SRF is for many people and unlike many organizations and self proclaimed so-called Gurus that have formed around the practice of Kriya Yoga they are safe to be involved with. This is my conclusion.

SRF was ok for me over 20 + years ago and introduced me to Kriya Yoga and most importantly my Guru Lahiri Mahasaya so as you can see I never guru shopped or hopped.*

I have made a study of Kriya Yoga to find where I belonged, not for anyone else my own work is enough for me and others must discover things for themselves for it to be useful to them anyway. I went out to discover which of the many offered versions of practicing Kriya Yoga were for me to practice, not some personality incased in a body to be in worship of. This is my karma. I can honestly say I have found what I need.*

PYislove says:*But once you find a true Guru, your search is over. it will take the rest of your struggling life to make use of His wisdom.

Seeking says: My life is not a struggle God and Guru have always made my way for me. I just listen to the best of my ability, feel to the best of my ability and see to the best of my ability and participate accordingly. The rest just falls into place. But yes I do agree 100% it will take the rest of my life and If you read everything from the moment I started posting on these forums it will be clear that as of this date 9-16-2012 I have been working very hard at it and have arrived. That is my conclusion.

So we agree on many things, but not all. Wise people discuss and fools argue may we always strive to be wise, even if the best we can be is wise like the guru at times. Inside joke I jusy poked fun at myself for those in the know.:stuck_out_tongue: