Regulating the Spiritual field, Part 2: Weeding out the nonsense

In part 1 of this thread “Regulating the Spiritual field” I argued how there is simply too much nonsense, irrational and uncritical thinking in the spiritual field which corrupts it, spoils it and undermines its credibility, naming in particular the pseudoscience that passes of for spirituality in the field such as Reiki and crystals, DNA activation, EFT, NLP, channeling, spirit guides and ascended masters, astrology and other such bogus new age nonsense. Not surprisingly, I was met with firm resistance and apathy that we need to do anything at all. Unfortunately, it is these kind of ignorant and irresponsible attitudes, that allow this nonsense to perpetuate and damages the reputation of the spiritual field.

In part 2 of this thread I want to highlight more cases which clearly show how much nonsense, ignorance and delusion the spiritual field is filled with and highlight the common characteristics of people who participate in this.

The following documentary by Louis Theroux who went to India to investigate the guru phenomenon in India is particularly notesworthy and will give you a taste of what I experienced first-hand in India myself, and why that turned me off from the whole guru thing and made me strongly question and ultimately override my previous loyalties and affiliations. It also clearly highlights the common characteristics of the majority of so-called spiritual people.

Hare Krishna Cult:

See: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MxkSIa8e8a0&feature=related

At the risk of offending our fellow Hare Krishna’s folks on this forum, I must say very frankly that the Hare Krishna brand of spirituality is one of the most shallow, childish, corrupt and irrational I have seen.(An old HK monk actually robbed me in India!) The reasons become obvious in this documentary.

Lazy spirituality: Simply, singing and dancing “Hare Krishna Hare Rama” mantra is seen as sufficient to bring about ones liberation. This is effectively all this group does. Blind and silly worship of the Hindu god Krishna is seen as real spirituality - At 3:00 min. Singing and dancing done among the HK group is no different to singing and dancing done anywhere else, it’s for ones own entertainment and for group bonding.

Obedience to the guru: The guru shown here is a joke, a deluded white man formerly from America, who has climbed up the ranks and now enjoys guru status. Watch how those lower down in the ranks literally worship him, throng to his feet, shield him with an umbrella from the sun, and hang of every word he speaks thinking it to be nectar. Louis is obviously not impressed and actually mocks the man in front of him, without him realizing - At 4:50 min

Pseudoscience: The talk about good and bad vibrations, the hallmark of any new ager. The guru here talks about how bathing in the Ganga gives good vibrations, but actually the reality is the Ganga is one of the most toxic rivers in the world and is responsible for all kinds of disease and kills many people in India - At 6:40 min and at 8:50 min(this bit is hilarious).

Having attended a few HK meets in the past I can personally vouch for how corrupt, silly and dogmatic it is. The HK temples in India are highly commercialized, built in such a way that devotees coming in must pass several stalls and shops to buy things(including tickets to attend different parts of the temple) and finally there is huge commercial area to buy expensive merchandise. At meeting any kind of critical thinking is discouraged and the punishment for asking any critical questions leads to alienation and ostracization from the group. This includes topics like questioning their cosmological beliefs that the Earth rests on a giant cosmic turtle and the solar system is fixed to the pole star rotating like a chandelier!

The founder of the HK cult Srila Prabupada is no enlightened master, but a highly religious and dogmatic man, who has some very backwards views, especially on women and gay people.

Another Swami and Guru, with loads of Western followers

See: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FK4gq9dvr0U&feature=related

In this rather surreal video we see a Swami whose USP is that he heals people by playing music on an electronic keyboard! He heals diseases and even cures diseases. At least this is what his gullible disciples believe. It is heart breaking to see the naivety of Mike in this video, but Mike is a classic example of a new-ager and demonstrates so many of the usual characteristics

No critical thinking: Although Mike is by profession a scientist he has suspended all critical and scientific thinking to believe that the guru ‘jamming’ on the keyboard is affecting directly human physiology and curing people of ailments, not realizing that the guru obviously has not cured his eye problem. It is clear from the tone of his voice he does not really believe the guru can do this, but he really wants to believe it. He even believes in the nonsense that the swami materialized his cheap necklace for him, and swami materializing money and other items(cheap conjouring tricks) is proof he is a cosmic being. At 1:05 min.

Escapism: For many so-called spiritual people spirituality is mainly an escape from the mundane life. The real world of pain and suffering, hard work and success and failure, and impersonal nature is seen as undesirabe, so they instead opt for a make-believe world of the imagination. In this case Mike clearly is somebody who is out of touch with reality and disturbed, that he wants to believe in his guru despite evidence to the contrary. At 5:20 min

Exaggeration: Exaggerating either ones own merits or the merits of another. In this case it is very clear the swami has no extraordinary qualities, he’s a very ordinary Indian man, who struggles to speak English and shows nothing exceptional in intelligence and understanding, but Mike has elevated him so highly that he feels like crying when this man changes his name. In his mind he has elevated this man to some godly status, though clearly this man does not deserve it. At 6:20 min.

Beware of these gurus and swamis, the vast majority of them are fakes. Just because they wear an orange/red/white robe does not mean they are any more spiritually developed than you are. Nor are they are more developed than you because they can spout Yoga or Vedic philosophy.


Why am I saying all of this and what is my agenda in starting all these threads criticizing religion, superstition and irrationality recently? The reason I am doing this is to expose this fake spirituality because it is detrimental to ones actual spiritual growth, it retards ones intellect and understanding leading to spiritual regression as opposed to spiritual evolution. My aim is to educate people about the real spirituality which has been taught by the masters from ancient times, the real gnosis or jnana, the self-knowledge and knowledge of beingness and reality which will bring one to self-realization. The pure scientific spirituality of Yoga which will unlock the infinite potential in everybody, so that they will truly become autonomous, free and actualized individuals. Stop being slaves to gods, traditions, gurus, leaders, societies, beliefs and ideologies and your own mind. Be free :slight_smile:

The man who is autonomous sings and dances in the joy of freedom. Men then sing and dance thinking it will bring freedom. Backwords. Lol.

I agree with you. People do not wish for understanding. They want blind escapism.
Some truly become distracted or become trapped in delusion. Simply not possessing a discerning mind.

Sir. an Excellent commentary and I agree with most of what you say.

I could be wrong but I see Kirtan as falling under Ishvara pradinhana or “worship of God” which is a Niyama, and by definition a preliminary or foundational practice. And taken unto itself, without the other foundations or the yogic limbs bears little fruit. This is by no means to be taken as a sweeping statement of truth as progress could be made depending on the characteristics or qualities of the practicioner. A high souled one could be simply swept up into the busom of truth by his devotion to his conception of the LORD. This is a bhakti path, and its efficacy depends on the devotee.

The main problem I see is, the same main problem I see everywhere. Ignorance.

The only remedy for that of couse is truth, education, and understanding.

For the fake swamis on the path of the charlaton, this is most unfortunate for them. The Karmic penalty for the leading of the blind further and further from the path is incredibly severe. The sewing is foul and the reaping of the fruit shall be rotten. If they had any idea what will happen to them when the judgement comes they would abandon their ways yesterday.

H’m. What’s worse? Suffering, or death turning out to be the eternal ceases of your existance.
Fun question :slight_smile: as beyond death is mere words to me. Knowledge can bring understanding. Understanding can lead to direct experiance. But direct experiance and “knowing” are one and the same. :stuck_out_tongue:

Can a man understand something,yet not know it?
Can a man know something,without understanding it.

could be wrong but I see Kirtan as falling under Ishvara pradinhana or “worship of God” which is a Niyama, and by definition a preliminary or foundational practice. And taken unto itself, without the other foundations or the yogic limbs bears little fruit. This is by no means to be taken as a sweeping statement of truth as progress could be made depending on the characteristics or qualities of the practicioner. A high souled one could be simply swept up into the busom of truth by his devotion to his conception of the LORD. This is a bhakti path, and its efficacy depends on the devotee.

Bhakti Yoga can lead to self-realization, and it has for many serious devotees in the past(Guru Nanak, Jneshawara, Kabir, St Francis of Assisi, Meister Ekhart, Ramakrishna etc) So I am not going to deny that it is a genuine spiritual path. However, the question must be asked why can it lead to self-realization, and the answer is like any other Yoga Jnana Yoga, Karma Yoga and Raja Yoga, it creates the condition of single mindedness of mind, the reduction of mental activities or vrittis and as a natural result reveals more of the self which is felt as a growing presence of divinity within and around oneself.

In other words it is actually the psychological process of bringing down vritti activity and hence revealing more of consciousness which is causing it, and this can be affected by several means. It is therefore not essential and superfluous to require a belief in god or to engage in social service, as long as you can bring about the process of bringing down vritti activity you will naturally and logically progress to self-realization. There are far more effective means to bring this about than bhakti and karma, not requiring any adoption of beliefs: Such as Patanjali’s Ashtanga Kriya Yoga/Raja Yoga. In the future we are likely to have more technological solutions to effect the same result(such as neuroengineering)

The best system of practice is Raja Yoga, hence why it is rightfully called the Royal Yoga. It is holistic, practical and scientific. Patanjali looks at the total development of the human organism in every area of its life: social and personal(yama and niyamas) physical and emotional(asanas, pranayama and pratyahara) and mental and spiritual(dharana, dhyana and samadhi) In this way one develops in a balanced way. Raja Yoga includes all of the practices from the other Yogas as well Bhakti(Ishvara Pradhidana) and Hatha Yoga(asanas and pranayama) and Jnana(Svadhyaya) and Karma(Yamas and Niyamas) Thus Raja Yoga is a total system of development. It is the most effective system existing on Earth.

Practicing only one kind of yoga is to approach your development in an uneven way, and it is ultimately dangerous to most. We can see first-hand accounts of this in the spiritual field. As the above video shows the ones involved in bhakti just end up becoming very intellectually deficient, lose their power of discrimination and reason and end up getting exploited by charlatans. Bhakti Yoga has a lot to answer for historically, for it has lead to religious oppression, religious violence and religious wars.
On the other hand, one involved in just Jnana, just end up becoming intellectuals, stuck in their heads, disconnected from living life, world-denying. Those who only practice Hatha Yoga end up becoming obsessed with their physical body, its beauty and health.
Those who only practice Karma yoga become obsessed with society, its needs and its politics, losing sight of their own needs.

Therefore any of these individual Yogas viz Bhakti, Jnana, Hatha and Karma are incomplete Yogas and lead to uneven development. Raja Yoga is a complete Yoga which leads to even development. Even the positive examples one can produce for Bhakti etc such as Guru Nanak, Kabir, Ramakrishna etc reveals that they had a correct balance.

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;76731]Bhakti Yoga can lead to self-realization, and it has for many serious devotees in the past(Guru Nanak, Jneshawara, Kabir, St Francis of Assisi, Meister Ekhart, Ramakrishna etc) So I am not going to deny that it is a genuine spiritual path. However, the question must be asked why can it lead to self-realization, and the answer is like any other Yoga Jnana Yoga, Karma Yoga and Raja Yoga, it creates the condition of single mindedness of mind, the reduction of mental activities or vrittis and as a natural result reveals more of the self which is felt as a growing presence of divinity within and around oneself.

In other words it is actually the psychological process of bringing down vritti activity and hence revealing more of consciousness which is causing it, and this can be affected by several means. It is therefore not essential and superfluous to require a belief in god or to engage in social service, as long as you can bring about the process of bringing down vritti activity you will naturally and logically progress to self-realization. There are far more effective means to bring this about than bhakti and karma, not requiring any adoption of beliefs: Such as Patanjali’s Ashtanga Kriya Yoga/Raja Yoga. In the future we are likely to have more technological solutions to effect the same result(such as neuroengineering)

The best system of practice is Raja Yoga, hence why it is rightfully called the Royal Yoga. It is holistic, practical and scientific. Patanjali looks at the total development of the human organism in every area of its life: social and personal(yama and niyamas) physical and emotional(asanas, pranayama and pratyahara) and mental and spiritual(dharana, dhyana and samadhi) In this way one develops in a balanced way. Raja Yoga includes all of the practices from the other Yogas as well Bhakti(Ishvara Pradhidana) and Hatha Yoga(asanas and pranayama) and Jnana(Svadhyaya) and Karma(Yamas and Niyamas) Thus Raja Yoga is a total system of development. It is the most effective system existing on Earth.

Practicing only one kind of yoga is to approach your development in an uneven way, and it is ultimately dangerous to most. We can see first-hand accounts of this in the spiritual field. As the above video shows the ones involved in bhakti just end up becoming very intellectually deficient, lose their power of discrimination and reason and end up getting exploited by charlatans. Bhakti Yoga has a lot to answer for historically, for it has lead to religious oppression, religious violence and religious wars.
On the other hand, one involved in just Jnana, just end up becoming intellectuals, stuck in their heads, disconnected from living life, world-denying. Those who only practice Hatha Yoga end up becoming obsessed with their physical body, its beauty and health.
Those who only practice Karma yoga become obsessed with society, its needs and its politics, losing sight of their own needs.

Therefore any of these individual Yogas viz Bhakti, Jnana, Hatha and Karma are incomplete Yogas and lead to uneven development. Raja Yoga is a complete Yoga which leads to even development. Even the positive examples one can produce for Bhakti etc such as Guru Nanak, Kabir, Ramakrishna etc reveals that they had a correct balance.[/QUOTE]

Ah nice post. I didn’t consider the reduction of mental flucuation due to devotionaly minded focus. Indeed the ways are many but the end is the same.

I can’t wait till you take up a serious practice. Your mentation is noteworthy, and combined with the harmonizing factors of intergral yoga, should make you a formidable force for, I hope, that which is good.