Reincarnation question

Spirituality
#1

See I was at this party last night and a group of people started to discuss spirituality, new age, Buddhism, Hinduism, yoga and whatnots.

So, I heard two things that they discussed that I’m a bit curious about;

Anyway, someone asked that if we are reincarnated, how come there are more humans now that earlier in history?

Can the “souls” live in inorganic things, like a rock or in the air.
(I always assumed that was the case)

I’m wondering what yoga philosophy says in regards to this.

Well, thanks in advance.

#2

This question has many aspects to it and i’ll try to address some of them.

Firstly, do we really know for sure that there are more human souls now than before? Some recorded human histroy goes back about 7500 years (and then it is very sketchy), but what about before that? What about civilisations that didn’t record anything? We simply do not know, therefore I think it is shortsighted to assume that there are now more souls than before. Truth is we simply do not know for sure.

Secondly, my beloved teacher, Sri Durga used to say that we’ll see an ever increase in human population due to the Kali Yug. The Kali Yug is the most opportune time for a soul to reincarnate to work through layers and layers of old karma, but because it is the Kali Yug, it is also the most difficult time to work trought all those karmas. If you can make your spiritual strides through this difficult Kali Yug, the rewards will be so much greater.

Personally, I do not belief so as the consciousness of being human and being a rock are just so different. This is a personal opinion and not based on any philosophy or teaching.

hope this helps.

#3

Namaskar,

In my opinion, “souls” do not “live in” but “manifest through”. It is the same universal god-consciousness who manifests through the system of infinite nested structures that universe is, which looks to be a “soul” shaped as an individuality when “living” in a high order structure.

In this sense, all forms of matter, all structures, from particles to animals, and even stars or galaxies, are fit for “hosting” consciousness. We humans, are the first structure in the evolutionary chain who can go further and fully awake that consciousness (nirvana).

So, when you die, depending on your karmas and evolutionary stage, you might take birth as a human again or as a lower life form. Nature would give you a body/organism fit to your drives and desires, it’s up to you to decide. Read The Tibetan Book of the Dead for more information.

It’s a paradox, because in reality we don’t reincarnate neither die, we are brahman, god, atman, spirit, consciousness… but our subtle bodies do seek and find a next physical structure where to resume the karmic game going on, and the effect is that we “reincarnate” and continue to manifest in the phenomenological world.

Regards.

#4

Hello friends,

Panoramix,

In my view as well, “consciousness” is One, however then also is that “order structure:” no higher or lower in my opinion, although I do understand you what you mean.

Right, but how can we know that the entire evolutionary chain is not already fully awakened, and that it’s only humans, because of mind and ego, who are not?

Yes, but again, not a higher or lower life form, only one that is appropriate.

Very good! I would add, that it’s the quality of the “resonance of Om,” its balance and purity, etc., that manifests what “physical structure” one might become. What one does to improve or diminish that resonance in life (karma), shapes its remanifestation, giving it form in the physical/phenomenal world. For this reason we are thankful for the yoga. Jai to the Rishis for resolving that “paradox!”

Nice to see you all again,
peace and love,
siva

#5

The Samkhya philosophy says that the self of all beings is of one kind. In other words, there is not a human soul that always incarnates as a human, or an animal soul or a plant soul. So it would stand to reason that a self could become associated with any kind of living form. I personally do not believe that inanimate objects have a self.

If you think about it, the argument “why are there more humans now than there were in the past” is really silly. It’s making an assumption that if there is reincarnation, then there must be a finite number of human souls that always incarnate on this earth all the time.

#6

[QUOTE=Tangle;39169]

Anyway, someone asked that if we are reincarnated, how come there are more humans now that earlier in history?

Can the “souls” live in inorganic things, like a rock or in the air.
(I always assumed that was the case)

.[/QUOTE]

Yep, you assumed right…as far as I understood: the stone lives good life and becomes a flower, flower reincarnates into insect, insect in to bird, bird into cat…and so forth…

#7

[QUOTE=CityMonk;39400]Yep, you assumed right…as far as I understood: the stone lives good life and becomes a flower, flower reincarnates into insect, insect in to bird, bird into cat…and so forth…[/QUOTE]

Although stated in a roundabout way, this is a good philosophical point. It seems a little silly to think that a rock could live a good life, but the same applies to plants and animals too. If we think of reincarnation as an evolutionary process based on karma, which we do, how can a plant or animal accumulate karma that would lead to evolutionary progress? If a lion kills, is it a bad lion? This reasoning is actually an argument against reincarnation, or at least against animism (the belief that souls evolve through different life forms).

#8

I think the simple answer to this question is there are more bodies today. More bodies means there are more hosts.

#9

I’m with Surya Deva. Who says all souls choose to be incarnated at once? There is an afterlife, perhaps we choose, as souls, to spend some time over there before incarnating again. After all, they do tell us that time is an illusion, and it truly does not exist in the spiritual world.

#10

The great Edgar Cayce commented that everything happens at once

#11

[QUOTE=Asuri;39418] If we think of reincarnation as an evolutionary process based on karma, which we do, how can a plant or animal accumulate karma that would lead to evolutionary progress?
…This reasoning is actually an argument against reincarnation, or at least against animism…[/QUOTE]
Thats how i see it: Every incarnation gives to a soul some experience. It is good anyway, but in most cases there is a possibility to make it better ;). The simpler life form is, the less opportunity to use the will it has. Humans have much greater choice of experience than, for example, amoebas. So, lets use it properly.

#12

I think the message is that the circumstances of your birth are not to reward or punish you based on accumulated merit or demerit. It has more to do with your evolutionary development of self realization.

#13

I think the message is that the circumstances of your birth are not to reward or punish you based on accumulated merit or demerit. It has more to do with your evolutionary development of self realization.

I have to agree with you, Asuri. :slight_smile:

#14

It’s OK to disagree if you want to.

#15

Hi asuri…If its true that it is an evolutionary process then is that saying that we cant interrupt that process to attain self realisation…and does it mean that all the people aiming for that now, doing it because their evolutionary time is now?

#16

It has more to do with your evolutionary development of self realization

If its true that it is an evolutionary process then is that saying that we cant interrupt that process to attain self realisation…and does it mean that all the people aiming for that now, doing it because their evolutionary time is now?

Kareng, the evolutionary process includes the quest toward the attainment of self realization. It’s the evolution of the soul, and all evolution time is now. We all experience different things that offer us chances for insight to self-awareness, and growth. That is evolution, all moments are evolution in progress, however slow or fast. :slight_smile: Does that make sense?

#17

[QUOTE=kareng;39919]Hi asuri…If its true that it is an evolutionary process then is that saying that we cant interrupt that process to attain self realisation…and does it mean that all the people aiming for that now, doing it because their evolutionary time is now?[/QUOTE]

No…and yes. I think what Sasha said is true. We humans have evolved to a point where we can make choices that better or worsen our state in life. But attaining a karma in which we experience a lot of enjoyment or pleasure doesn’t necessarily lead to self-realization. On the other hand, I think that it is definitely possible to consciously create karmic connections that take us further along the path. Some Buddhists are heavily into that.

Maybe there is a bit of a contradiction, but we just don’t see that many people suddenly becoming realized and ascending into heaven on a cloud, so to speak.