Should Yoga teachers be Vegetarian

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#88

"But, can you be a non-vegetarian, and still be compassionate/fulfil the ahimsa yama? "

That depends upon your own standards of what you consider to be violent or non-violent. There are some Jain yogis for whom picking an apple from a tree is considered violent, they will have to eat an apple which has already fallen. They will not eat foods which have grown out of the Earth, because to pull them out from their roots is considered too violent. Even if you step on an insect without the intention to kill, it is considered a sin, you will have to bear the consequences of it’s karma. And according to this line of thinking, everything becomes a so called “sin”. Because just sitting here breathing, you are killing thousands of micro-organisms. Just a simple process like walking, you are stepping on countless organisms. And for the mind of one who is far too fanatic with the idea of non-violence, everything that you do can be considered an act of violence.

So it all depends on your own standards of what you consider non-violence. And it is my own understanding that it has very little to do with one’s behavior, but whether one has come to an awakening into one’s true nature. Having seen into one’s original face, one immediately will realize the same nature flows through all things. And out of this, it is impossible not to be compassionate. Once one’s consciousness is in tune with existence, then compassion becomes a very natural state of being. And all of our clinging to conscious efforts to do this or not to do this, should’s or should not’s, do’s and don’ts, are all working just as a substitute for one’s own compassionate intelligence.

For those who have come to know of compassion, these matters are more or less irrelevant. Whatever arises out of one’s being is going to speak for itself, as a life of it’s own. One simply has to remain silent with it and let it do it’s own work. But all of these people who are trying hard to do all kinds of things with an attachment to an idea of what it is to be compassionate have yet to come to the space.

#89

Let us not talk of what the scriptures say. The aim of yoga is self realisation, which effectively means realising that the you and other living creatures are part of the same paramatman. If that is the goal, who eats whom ? I think that is probably a more convincing arguement for being a vegan.

#90

For me it’s pretty clear.

I perfectly know that living on a zero-violence condition is almost impossible, as you need to feed from other life forms, and alter nature for obtaining your crops, your industry, etc…

But between exerting that violence and the same plus bloody steaks on your table, there’s a considerable gap. If one can perfectly override animal products, why should do it? Gluttony is the only answer that arises in my mind.

[B]It is always preferable X violence units, rather than X + Y violence units.[/B]
[I]
Assuming that, X: industry and agriculture, Y: bloody steaks[/I]

Mankind is still young, we’re still learning, do not pretend to perfectly establish yourself in Ahimsa if you live in an industrialized country. And remember that if you lived in a rural region, under totally traditional, rural conditions, you wouldn’t have neither technology for posting your comments here, nor time for your spiritual sadhana. You would have to work day and night for your crops and occasionally deal with famine.

That simple.

#91

Elizabeth,
After coming home from India with my guru, Kali Ray who is an advid vegan; I couldn’t image yoga and meat eaters in the same mouthful. Mahatma Gandhi stated pretty clear that we are judged by the way we treat animals, not eat animals. I also realize that we change only we when we get it and we are not here to judge but to inspire.
Diana Ross
[/QUOTE]

#92

Diana Ross,

“I couldn’t image yoga and meat eaters in the same mouthful”

Then imagine it. In fact, in certain methods of tantra, eating meat can be used as a method to stimulate the senses towards samadhi. And if you have an aversion from eating meat, I suggest you treat yourself to a turkey dinner.

What is far more significant is to transcend all of these childish ideas, that one’s state of being is determined by all of these things which are simply superficial. Unless an authentic compassion arises within oneself, one should not even be concerned with something as irrelevant as whether one is a vegetarian or not. If compassion arises, the way towards existence will reveal itself. And without doing anything, any action that arises out of your being will be the right action.

#93

[QUOTE=Diana Ross;48138]Elizabeth,
After coming home from India with my guru, Kali Ray who is an advid vegan; I couldn’t image yoga and meat eaters in the same mouthful. Mahatma Gandhi stated pretty clear that we are judged by the way we treat animals, not eat animals. I also realize that we change only we when we get it and we are not here to judge but to inspire.
Diana Ross
[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

Diana, this forum is full of meat eating Yoga practioners. I don’t say this meaning to offend, I too was a meat eating Yoga practioner at one stage. But I started the thread as a reaction to one of the members here who is still quite young and wants to preach about love and other things. That’s what started this whole thing. Of course, I have also learnt much from my ex-guru and to me the whole idea of someone teaching Yoga and still eating meat is just absurd. I kind of forgot that I was exposed to tradtional Yoga with an Indian teacher, and that in America or the West in general Yoga is still mostly about Asanas. Didn’t take that into consideration.

#94

Eating meat is the nice way of saying eating an animal, atman and all. Tantra for stimulation, meat for stimulation…Be careful you could reincarnate as a street dog in India. Then you will get it.

Enjoy your happy meal?

#95

Interesting topic certainly!

I’ve been a vegetarian since I was young and I certainly wouldn’t change that but I wouldn’t shove that viewpoint down the throats of those practising around me.

#96

[quote=AmirMourad;48148]Diana Ross,

“I couldn’t image yoga and meat eaters in the same mouthful”

Then imagine it. In fact, in certain methods of tantra, eating meat can be used as a method to stimulate the senses towards samadhi. And if you have an aversion from eating meat, I suggest you treat yourself to a turkey dinner.

What is far more significant is to transcend all of these childish ideas, that one’s state of being is determined by all of these things which are simply superficial. Unless an authentic compassion arises within oneself, one should not even be concerned with something as irrelevant as whether one is a vegetarian or not. If compassion arises, the way towards existence will reveal itself. And without doing anything, any action that arises out of your being will be the right action.[/quote]

In my opinion it is [B]gluttony[/B] what many should transcend.

Pancha Makara ritual says little to me, further, only Viras (rajastic sadhaks) are said to eat meat, and of course, for spiritual and not nutritional or pleasurable purposes.

#97

Could somebody explain me what is the rationale behind Yoga and being a vegetarian? Trying not to eat meat due to fear of karma, I reckon, is not a valid argument, but a generally accepted, unchallenged myth.

I don’t eat red meat because it disturbs my stomach. This is something I do, completely based on my own bodily experience. Yet I eat chicken and fish, as it seems, my body needs it.

So explain a valid rationale behind Yoga and being a vegetarian, that is, if you can.

#98

The moment one places an ideal upon another human being is the same moment they set their self up for eventual disapointment.

I think yoga teachers should be human.

#99

[QUOTE=High Wolf;48286]Could somebody explain me what is the rationale behind Yoga and being a vegetarian? Trying not to eat meat due to fear of karma, I reckon, is not a valid argument, but a generally accepted, unchallenged myth.

I don’t eat red meat because it disturbs my stomach. This is something I do, completely based on my own bodily experience. Yet I eat chicken and fish, as it seems, my body needs it.

So explain a valid rationale behind Yoga and being a vegetarian, that is, if you can.[/QUOTE]

[B]COMPASSION[/B]. My ex-guru, who comes from a long Indian tradition, said we shouldn’t eat meat out of compassionate reasons. And I fully agree. If you go to India, I think Surya Deva mentioned it once, all Yoga Schools require of their teachers that they should be Vegetarian. I’m sure if you send him a private message, he could give you some other reasons as well. I am aware that some people are Vegetarian for other reasons, and don’t really care for the animals, but as far as I know COMPASSION is the reason why Yoga Teachers in India, or trained in India, are Vegetarian.

I also heard of Aghoris in India doing some horrible things and eating meat and smoking hash, but a respectable Yoga School would have nothing to do with such things.

#100

Will all of you vegetarians out there start being compassionate and switch to only local, organic foods so you stop destroying the world’s air, oceans, and fresh water supply?

Thanks.

#101

[QUOTE=David;48304]Will all of you vegetarians out there start being compassionate and switch to only local, organic foods so you stop destroying the world’s air, oceans, and fresh water supply?

Thanks.[/QUOTE]

There you go. Now we’re talking.

#102

Fairtrade products do that. But that enters into green capitalism, which doesn’t really help the industrial demolition of the nature.

Yet I have seen people, for example, in Glastonbury, England, actually do produce locally and consume locally, which seems to work; and looks quite hokey.

#103

Fairtrade products do what?

#104

I agree in principle with what Amir is saying that one becomes naturally compassionate when they reach certain levels of conscousness realization. When one realises that the nature that flows within them, also flows in all things, then one starts to consider the world as their greater self. Then we realise all is that infinite consciousness. This is real compassion, and not just an imagined sense of compassion where we do something simply because we believe it is good.

But I want to ask, should we really wait to achieive higher states of consciousness before we start behaving compassionately and start doing good deeds? I really need to ask myself this, because I rarely do any good deeds self-consciously. I don’t give to charity and I take more from the world than I give back. I admit I am selfish. I aim to start giving back to the world after I have completed my spiritual training. However, I am starting to revise my views on this matter. One need not have to wait for direct experience before conducting good deeds, one can conduct good deeds even before reaching direct experience. I do not need the direct experience of going through the feelings of murdering somebody, to know that murdering somebody is wrong. I do not need to go through the direct experience of taking illegal drugs, to know taking illegal drugs is wrong. I do not need to go through the direct experience of joining the mafia, to know that violence is wrong.

In addition to the faculty of direct experience, I have the faculty of intellect which I can use to know what is right and what is wrong for my well being. I have used this faculty of intellect and concluded that eating meat is wrong for my well being. I could reach this conclusion through the faculty of direct experience by waiting to reach high levels of conscious realization so that I became acutely aware of the vibrations of what I consume and their effects on me, but this requires years and years of intense spiritual training. Why do I need to wait for years and years of training to come to a conclusion that only requires a few moments of logical reasoning?

#105

[quote=Surya Deva;48316]When one realises that the nature that flows within them, also flows in all things, then one starts to consider the world as their greater self.

Why do I need to wait for years and years of training to come to a conclusion that only requires a few moments of logical reasoning?[/quote]
So by a few moments of logical reasoning I can conclude that you are eating local and organic because you are able to logically conclude that since the world is your greater self, if you’re not eating that way, then you’re harming yourself. And harming yourself would be illogical. Yes?

#106

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;48316] I do not need to go through the direct experience of taking illegal drugs, to know taking illegal drugs is wrong.[/QUOTE]

:rolleyes:

#107

[QUOTE=David;48309]Fairtrade products do what?[/QUOTE]

That is, they are organic foods and groceries and such :wink: