Student/teacher relationship

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#1

This seems to be a contentious issue, but my take is that I see no inherent wrong in it. In advance, this post may seem tl;dr, however there are a number of points I wish to convey.

Some equate it to a doctor/patient relationship, but personally I don’t see how this is so. As a doctor cures/manages illness, then obviously ethical practice and good judgement can be compromised should a doctor and patient be friends or more. Also, medicine is obviously a case of life and death in numerous cases. In contemporary society at least, yoga is seen largely as a means of improving fitness, and certainly not a life and death thing as medicine. This may detract from how yoga was envisioned thousands of years ago, but societies and norms change over time and per place.

Also, I would have no issue attending a class in which the teacher and his or her students were friends. Provided that all students had means to approach the teacher concerning asana advice, or that modifications/adjustments were provided to all, then I see no issue. the teacher could even say at the start of the class “say hello to Tim my husband over there” and I wouldn’t mind. Provided the teacher didn’t only offer adjustments to “Tim”, then again it’s immaterial as I see it. I would say in general, people leave yoga classes if they feel uncomfortable, for whatever reason.

On this general topic though, I am a new yogi, since I started about a year ago. I go to a studio about 5 miles away from me, and attend a class run by a 30 year old woman. I had to have a hiatus, due to work commitments, but left some messages on her Facebook page regarding her classes. She added me as a friend there, and said she missed me in classes and wanted me to come back. When I did return (as work tasks eased) she welcomed me warmly and said it was good to see me again.

I’m a bit confused of her intentions though. I know that everybody is different, but is she just happy to see a familiar face in class, or does she want to be friends? Per the points above, I don’t see an issue with it, however I don’t get what she is about here.

Thanks. :smiley:

#2

Could you kindly be more specific as to the type of relationship you are inquiring of? Friendships or intimacies?

thank you.

#3

Both. Though in the case I made in the latter paragraphs, I mean in terms of friendship not necessarily dating.

#4

Healthy, clean boundaries are all that is required of a teacher of yoga. However it is apparent that such a miniscule requirement is often overwhelming to some and they cannot shoulder the responsibility. Typically this is a result of lack of practice, ineffective practice, or a teacher training program lacking in ethics.

Yoga teachers, by definition of Yoga, are in a constant state of self-examination. Ergo each interaction and its context may be evaluated independently. However there are some ethical parameters that are best adhered to - and by “best” I mean in the interest of less suffering for both teacher and student. After all, the practice itself is a suffering reduction program.

Yoga teachers should be kind, caring, and friendly to all students. The job is to support those interested in learning the practice and growing as human beings. Confusion isn’t helpful when trying to make progress - be that in a posture or in a behavior. So whatever message is being sent by the yoga teacher it should be as clear as possible and have no room for being misinterpreted.

Yoga meets you where you are. If you are moving in and committed then you receive that level of relationship back. If you are tentative, on the fringe, skeptical, and infrequent then obviously the energetic response matches your own. There are additional energetic issues which we refer to as “cording” and it’s a conversation unto itself.

A nice practice is to absorb sutra 1:33 from Patanjali’s work and try to live it for 21 days.

#5

The question is what is the subject-matter here, in the student’s perception. This may vary from ‘simply imitating the physical configuration as per the demo’ to ‘knowing why and launching an ever-evolving quest’ for life.

So, the next question is whether it is the right location. All yoga studios are not made equal, neither are the teachers. So, a teacher should know exactly why any one is there and remain in sync.

When not in sync, the other aspects of life creep in. Namismybabe, for example seems to be so much aware of the teacher and her behavior that his/her own definition of yoga appears to be very narrow.

Thus, ‘her intentions’ are in focus; not yoga.

#6

[QUOTE=Suhas Tambe;83696]The question is what is the subject-matter here, in the student’s perception. This may vary from ‘simply imitating the physical configuration as per the demo’ to ‘knowing why and launching an ever-evolving quest’ for life.

So, the next question is whether it is the right location. All yoga studios are not made equal, neither are the teachers. So, a teacher should know exactly why any one is there and remain in sync.

When not in sync, the other aspects of life creep in. Namismybabe, for example seems to be so much aware of the teacher and her behavior that his/her own definition of yoga appears to be very narrow.

Thus, ‘her intentions’ are in focus; not yoga.[/QUOTE]

lol… so instead of answering my question, you insult me? lol…

Moreover, why is it so “bad” or reprehensible to form relationships in any avenue of human endeavour? Granted, the ancient yogis may not have done so, but I don’t live nor was raised in ancient India. I can only thus act and adapt based on my own culture, environment and upbringing.

#7

[QUOTE=InnerAthlete;83695]Healthy, clean boundaries are all that is required of a teacher of yoga. However it is apparent that such a miniscule requirement is often overwhelming to some and they cannot shoulder the responsibility. Typically this is a result of lack of practice, ineffective practice, or a teacher training program lacking in ethics.

Yoga teachers, by definition of Yoga, are in a constant state of self-examination. Ergo each interaction and its context may be evaluated independently. However there are some ethical parameters that are best adhered to - and by “best” I mean in the interest of less suffering for both teacher and student. After all, the practice itself is a suffering reduction program.

Yoga teachers should be kind, caring, and friendly to all students. The job is to support those interested in learning the practice and growing as human beings. Confusion isn’t helpful when trying to make progress - be that in a posture or in a behavior. So whatever message is being sent by the yoga teacher it should be as clear as possible and have no room for being misinterpreted.

Yoga meets you where you are. If you are moving in and committed then you receive that level of relationship back. If you are tentative, on the fringe, skeptical, and infrequent then obviously the energetic response matches your own. There are additional energetic issues which we refer to as “cording” and it’s a conversation unto itself.

A nice practice is to absorb sutra 1:33 from Patanjali’s work and try to live it for 21 days.[/QUOTE]

So what is to be taken out of this situation? I agree that yoga teachers must be as friendly as possible to all students, but is her intent simply to be welcoming to a familiar student, or to essentially say “let’s be buddies”? I have no true preference towards either, however it’s confusing. I don’t want to start to misinterpret her actions as the latter, as of course not all yoga teachers are open to making friends with students (and not in a bad way, but many people like to keep work and private life separate).

#8

Only you can find out her intentions. We can sit here and imagine but the outcome would be far from truth. Just be nice and dont do anything hasty, just be neutral. You will soon find out what her intentions are. Patience is what you should practice which will come handy for you later on in life as well. So see this patience as a part of your yogic practice.

#9

Verily a contentious issue.

As with most things, it is not the issue but the reactiveness to the issue that really needs consideration non?

Suhas Tambe offers some insight and instead of due consideration you react, perhaps in jest, as if the intent is an insult to you.

Relationships between student teacher will illicit numerous reactions.

There is more than the student and teacher in this relationship.
There are the other students, coworkers, and general public to consider.
In fact there is the community and of course since we are a global village there is the word’s reaction to this studio, to this practice, to this style, and to Yoga to consider.

Please consider the world wide reaction to John Friend, Anusara community, and to Yoga after his alleged trists and exploration of sexuality and substance on and off the mat.

Hundred’s of teachers resigned their Anusara licences, thousands of students were effected and the practice of Yoga was criticized world-wide.

Likewise sexual scandal resulted in Kripalu founder YOGI AMRIT DESAI formerly the head the “largest and most established yoga retreat in North America", being reportedly forced to leave by his own students.

There is much to each of these highlighted stories and to consider. There is much to your story to be considered. Your actions create reactions.

Good luck with your journey, and your choices on and off that mat.

Namaste

#10

I would assume “welcoming a familiar student” until something else is overtly expressed. However it is completely up to you what your take-away is.

#11

My first post was really a response to [I]Moreover, why is it so “bad” or reprehensible to form relationships in any avenue of human endeavour? [/I]

The examples show how reactions to relationships between student and teacher can have great consequences.

In your particular case I don’t think there is a relationship to question.

I work at a large studio and many of the teachers contact their students using social media. If students do not show up for a while they are sometimes contacted.

I myself have been contacted by an instructor who said that she missed me in her classes, and it encouraged me to go back to her classes. I was flattered by the contact but did not need to think the contact message was anything more than it was.

You were missed, easy to contact, so you were.

#12

[QUOTE=namismybabe;83681]I’m a bit confused of her intentions though. I know that everybody is different, but is she just happy to see a familiar face in class, or does she want to be friends? Per the points above, I don’t see an issue with it, however I don’t get what she is about here.[/QUOTE]

This particular livelihood relies on the number of people who attend her classes. The optimist might say:
-She’s a people person, and enjoys meeting new people (which is a great trait for a yoga teacher).

The pessimist might say:
-She is only being nice to you because you’re a paying customer and she wants to retain you.

I think either way you will be able to tell if she is genuinely interested in being kind for kindness’ sake, or kind so she can keep you as a student. The friendship may not go outside the classroom, but let that take its pace naturally. Maybe you both attend a yoga workshop elsewhere and find you’re both interested in hiking, etc.

#13

[QUOTE=Yogamark;83718]My first post was really a response to [I]Moreover, why is it so “bad” or reprehensible to form relationships in any avenue of human endeavour? [/I]

The examples show how reactions to relationships between student and teacher can have great consequences.

In your particular case I don’t think there is a relationship to question.

I work at a large studio and many of the teachers contact their students using social media. If students do not show up for a while they are sometimes contacted.

I myself have been contacted by an instructor who said that she missed me in her classes, and it encouraged me to go back to her classes. I was flattered by the contact but did not need to think the contact message was anything more than it was.

You were missed, easy to contact, so you were.[/QUOTE]

Sorry, but I did interpret his or her comment as an insult. Perhaps s/he needs to learn to communicate better, but that’s his or her issue.

#14

Namismybabe I have some anxiety around social contact and your misgivings about your teachers’ motives sound very familiar. I won’t offer you any advice because the previous posts are very helpful. That being said - this is an interesting, thought provoking, podcast which looks at student teacher relationships and the general attitude towards the practice:
http://www.decolonizingyoga.com/rethinking-yoga-podcast-inclusion-activism-and-sex-scandals/

YG

#15

[QUOTE=Yogamark;83718]My first post was really a response to [I]Moreover, why is it so “bad” or reprehensible to form relationships in any avenue of human endeavour? [/I]

The examples show how reactions to relationships between student and teacher can have great consequences.[/quote]

Yes, since s/he questioned by so-called “commitment” to yoga. And?

In your particular case I don’t think there is a relationship to question.

I work at a large studio and many of the teachers contact their students using social media. If students do not show up for a while they are sometimes contacted.

I myself have been contacted by an instructor who said that she missed me in her classes, and it encouraged me to go back to her classes. I was flattered by the contact but did not need to think the contact message was anything more than it was.

You were missed, easy to contact, so you were.

OK. So anything that happens to you must occur to all others?

#16

lol… so instead of answering my question, you insult me? lol…

Moreover, why is it so “bad” or reprehensible to form relationships in any avenue of human endeavour? Granted, the ancient yogis may not have done so, but I don’t live nor was raised in ancient India. I can only thus act and adapt based on my own culture, environment and upbringing.

There is neither time nor inclination to insult.

This appears to be a relationship issue and as likely to happen in a yoga studio as in a doctor’s waiting room or a public garden. And as the doctor’s proficiency or the garden-keeper’s skills will not be the points of focus, yoga is not either a promoter or a cause.

In contemporary society at least, yoga is seen largely as a means of improving fitness, and certainly not a life and death thing as medicine. This may detract from how yoga was envisioned thousands of years ago, but societies and norms change over time and per place.

One of the writer’s own rhetorical statements “anything that happens to you must occur to all others?” answers the above quote. If the ‘contemporary society’ is a Western country, yoga is seen as a fitness thing, because yoga isn’t born here. It is a misconception nurtured by the commercial interests. Because yoga of thousands of years legacy answers very profound and fundamental questions, it addresses the whole humanity and is rooted in the universality. The yoga of thousands of years’ existence is not tailored for societies or fashioned after cultural trends to change with time or place.

The creators of yoga developed the practice in the labs of their own self by dwelling within. Hence, yoga’s ends states occur in the inner domain making the external events inconsequential. If this was to be the focus of this thread, one could have discussed a yoga teacher’s behavior in the context of yama-niyama or a need for a student to disengage from the external triggers to march ahead on the yoga path.

#17

I met an indian guy at the indian airport and he asked me what i did in india, i said yoga and he said aha yoga, you mean exercise for body?

#18

The only relevant study with a population of one is self study.

#19

[QUOTE=Suhas Tambe;83770]There is neither time nor inclination to insult.

This appears to be a relationship issue and as likely to happen in a yoga studio as in a doctor’s waiting room or a public garden. And as the doctor’s proficiency or the garden-keeper’s skills will not be the points of focus, yoga is not either a promoter or a cause.

One of the writer’s own rhetorical statements “anything that happens to you must occur to all others?” answers the above quote. If the ‘contemporary society’ is a Western country, yoga is seen as a fitness thing, because yoga isn’t born here. It is a misconception nurtured by the commercial interests. Because yoga of thousands of years legacy answers very profound and fundamental questions, it addresses the whole humanity and is rooted in the universality. The yoga of thousands of years’ existence is not tailored for societies or fashioned after cultural trends to change with time or place.

The creators of yoga developed the practice in the labs of their own self by dwelling within. Hence, yoga’s ends states occur in the inner domain making the external events inconsequential. If this was to be the focus of this thread, one could have discussed a yoga teacher’s behavior in the context of yama-niyama or a need for a student to disengage from the external triggers to march ahead on the yoga path.[/QUOTE]

ha hah… yet you said that I didn’t understand yoga. It is up to you to determine who understands yoga “properly”?

#20

Some equate it to a doctor/patient relationship, but personally I don’t see how this is so. As a doctor cures/manages illness, then obviously ethical practice and good judgement can be compromised should a doctor and patient be friends or more. Also, medicine is obviously a case of life and death in numerous cases. In contemporary society at least, yoga is seen largely as a means of improving fitness, and certainly not a life and death thing as medicine. This may detract from how yoga was envisioned thousands of years ago, but societies and norms change over time and per place.

If your idea of yoga is for fitness and your fitness instructor sees herself as such, then as pointed out by Suhas, it is no different than going to a gym. And while there are many teachers of yoga who teach only “fitness” yoga, I think the majority teach “Yoga.” I don’t see Yoga as being diluted, but actually the opposite. I see a movement to bring Yoga back to its roots in the West. How do you view Yoga? Your answer will guide you to handling this situation.

I think you have received very good offerings from the contributors of this thread. Some may be difficult to embrace, but nonetheless a perspective that needs to be considered.

As a teacher of Yoga, it is my responsibility to guide my students and assist them on their journey. A good teacher will foster a sense of community where a safe place to practice is created and communication is open and honest. There are no hidden agendas. Yamas and Niyamas are are taken seriously, discussed and practiced. Intentions of both teacher and student should be clear and not open to interpretation. If one of my students has been out for some time, I most definitely will write or call them. But usually this never happens as they will communicate when they need to miss class. Is this unusual? I can’t say if it is or not. This is my experience.

OK. So anything that happens to you must occur to all others?

Yogamark was simply answering the question in your last paragraph based upon his experience.

Unless your teacher has conveyed that her intention is romantic in nature, accept that she does genuinely care for you as a student and thus her concern was appropriate in the context of a “teacher-student” relationship.