Upavistha konasana

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#1

Hello,

I had my first one-on-one session with my yoga teacher the other day (excluding ones where nobody else in the class turns up). We were mainly working on my arm strength, but I also asked her for help in my upavistha konasana.

I am very flexible (probably not compared to some of you, but still…). I find it easy to put my face on my shins when I’m doing folding forward in any ‘legs together’ poses, but for some reason, I cannot roll my hips when I have my legs out for this pose. I feel as though I can’t even imagine how it would feel to arch my lower back in this position. I showed my yoga teacher and she was a bit baffled. She suggested it might be a mental block more than anything else because she knows I don’t have hamstring or hip tightness.

Any ideas? Thanks

#2

Hello Hanu,

Just an idea: There is a big difference between forward fold (legs together) and upavistha konasana (legs spread).

In the starting position of upavistha konasana, you spread the legs. This means that you are putting tension on muscles on the inside of your thighs. With your legs together, there is more slack in these muscles. The tension of these muscles prevents your pelvis from tipping forward. This is not a mental block, but tightness of the muscles!

If you want more anatomical details: When I speak of the muscles on the inside of your thighs, I am referring to the hip adductors, mainly the adductor magnus. This muscle inserts - in part - at the sitting bones. I am also referring to the two hamstring that insert on the inside of the knee (semimembranosus and semitendinosus). These also insert at the sitting bones. Tension on muscles that insert on the bottom of the pelvis (sitting bones) hinders the pelvis when you want it to tip forward. Yes! Spreading your legs makes life more difficult for the hamstrings that caused you little difficulty in forward fold.

What to do? Prepare yourself by lengthening your adductors and “inner hamstrings”. Poses like extended triangle (trikonasana), bound angle (baddha konasana) and wide leg forward bend (prasarita padottanasana) could help. Along with patience! :smiley:

P.S. Since you mention that you are good at forward fold, I have assumed that your sacroiliac flexibility is good and I have left this out of the discussion. However, there is one trick you could try. In the starting position with spread legs, use your hands to spread the sitting bones. Move your buttock muscles sideways. Spreading the sitting bones makes it easier for the sacrum to tip forward within the pelvis (nutation).

#3

Hi Willem, thanks for this.

The thing is, I am absolutely fine with trikonasana, baddha konasana (knees near to floor) and prasarita padottanasana (I can easily get my crown to the floor), but I can’t tilt my pelvis in upavistha konasana at all. Not at all. When I seem so flexible in every other position I know, I can’t understand why I can barely move in this one. I am happy to be patient, but I just want to know what I can do to work on it. I’m not convinced flexibility is the problem.

#4

I’m still puzzled by your statement that flexibility of adductors and hamstring is not an issue.

What does your reclining hand to toe pose (supta padangusthasana) look like? Can you move your leg towards you beyond the vertical? This will tell you something about hamstring flexibility. And how is your revolved reclining hand to toe pose (parivrtta supta padangusthasana)? Can you reach the floor with your outer foot? This will tell you something about adductor tightness. These poses are good preparations, too.

I was happy to read that you can do the other poses with ease. However, note that the final position of upavistha konasana (chest to floor) is more demanding than the usual final position of prasarita padottanasana (crown to floor). Even though the poses look similar when rotated through 90 degrees. In baddha konasana, the bent knees give some slack in the adductors. Triangle does not require forward bending. Are you sure that your forward fold doesn’t rely on too much lumbar flexion and too little hip flexion and pelvic tilt?

I do hope we can solve this mystery.

#5

Hi Willem,

Your reply made me laugh! Maybe it’s not such a mystery, it’s just that both my yoga teachers have seemed a bit confused. In supta padangusthasana I can get my leg to abut a 45 degree angle from my body, sometimes a bit less. In parivrtta supta padangusthasana, my butt comes off the floor atabut 45 degrees, so I can’t get it to the floor unless my hip comes up. If my hip is up, it goes to the floor easily.

Sorry if this is a silly question - it just seems like I am bolted upright in this position. It’s ann odd sensation. I feel like I don’t even know where to begin with rolling my pelvis like this.

#6

It’s good to have a laugh! You made me smile, too. :slight_smile: I sometimes take asana and anatomy too seriously. I’m enjoying this discussion, because I’ll be teaching spread leg forward folds in about a months time.

From your feedback on reclining hand-to-toe poses, you seem to have excellent hamstring flexibility. You adductors are less flexible than your hamstrings, though. Please remember to keep both sides of your pelvis on the floor in the revolved position. Otherwise you are putting too much stress (torque) on your lumbar spine. This is potentially harmful.

So my best guess is adductor tightness. How about using a rolled up towel under each knee? Does this improve your pose? What about sitting on a folded blanket? This could help with pelvic tilt. Have you tried to spread the sitting bones with your hands to help with sacrum mobility? And all of the above?

Finally, if the adductors are not responsible, there can also be limitations in the hip joint (ligaments or bony). From your proficiency at other poses, I would put my bet on the adductors, though.

Sutra I-12 “The vacillating waves of perceptions are stilled through consistent earnest practice and dispassionate non-attachment”.

Mystery solved?

#7

Willem, I am dying to try these! I’m in the office and wearing a dress, so I will hold off until I get home…

Thanks so much - I will let you know how I got on. I am planning some moonlight yoga on the beach tonight, so I will write these tips down and try them there. :slight_smile:

#8

Hi,
I’m new to this forum and just happened to come across this thread through googling ‘chest to floor in upavistha konasana’ or something similar (isn’t the internet amazing!) Hanu - your experience sounds so similar to mine! Upavistha konasana is the bugbear of my ashtanga practice. I’ve been practising (admittedly not always consistently) for around three years, and although it probably took me about a year to get my chin to shins in ‘legs together’ poses like paschimottanasana, with wide legs I’m still miles away. I know exactly what you mean when you say you feel ‘bolted upright’ and can’t tilt the pelvis. I also came to the conclusion it was an adductor issue through looking at anatomy books but I’m still not sure of the best way to overcome it.
Willem, I was really interested in your suggestion to use towels, as having only ever really practiced Ashtanga I have very little experience of using props in my practice as this isn’t encouraged in class. I tried upavistha konasana earlier sitting on a (big!) book and I do feel it helped my pelvis tilt more. I was also thinking that maybe if I hold the asana for longer it might help. I’m used to holding everything for five breaths, but I have been reading recently about yin yoga, where the poses are held for considerabley longer and wondered if this would be beneficial for poses that are not ‘coming’ as quickly as others. If you have any more suggestions for ways to work on this pose they would be very gratefully received!
Namaste
Tammy

#9

Greetings Tammy! Welcome to the forum! Upavista Konasana is my very favorite pose. It is probably my favorite because it took practicing every day for 1 year before I could lay my head flat on the mat. I haven’t seen Willem post for some time, so I will try to assist as best I can.

My students also have a difficult time with this as well. When we prepare for this, I have them spread their legs wide, knees pointed to ceiling and feet flexed. Towels under the knees and a pillow or blanket, as Willem suggested, under the bum to tilt the pelvis can greatly help. I have them bring their left fingertips to the front of the mat and their right fingertips behind them. You need finger strength to do this, but lift yourself off the mat and rest your bum back down. Then bring the right fingertips in front and left behind and do the same thing. Now your legs are nice and wide. Place your hands on your hips. Lengthen through the spine and as you do so, engage the abs and bring them ever so slightly in toward the lower back. Keep the upper back straight and begin to spill forward from the hips. When your hips stop moving, you stop moving. This is your starting point. It is also important to lighten the load as I call it. Don’t try to keep you bottom so firmly planted on the mat. I would try to measure your progress somehow, because this pose really does require persistence, and this way you can feel good about your progress. You can use a block that your rest your hands on and as you begin to loosen up, you can move the block away.

There is also a sequence that helps. With your legs wide, doing the same prep as I stated above, slide you right hand down the right leg and bring your left arm up and over trying to reach your right big toe. Hold for several breaths. Now turn to face the right leg and release head and torso over the right leg. Again, hold the pose for several breaths. Now walk your hand to the center and hold for several breaths and then come back up, repeating on the other side. When you walk the hand to center, most students are farther down then just going into the pose without the sequence. You can try it and see what you think.

If you have 2 people who can place their feet about 2 inches from the hip crease on you upper thigh, have them put a slight amount of pressure on your thighs. Now try to come forward. Sometimes it’s the grounding of the thighs/legs that is the problem. The top of the thigh moves toward the back of the thigh which presses into the mat.

And also, preparatory poses such as Baddha Konasana, Trikonasana, Supta Padangusthasana will help immensely if practiced daily.

I just gave you a bunch of info, so if it is confusing, let me know. This pose is soooooo worth the effort! Truly liberating!

#10

Hi Lotusgirl,
Thank you so much for the information, and for being kind enough to share your knowledge with me (so quickly aswell!) I also love the pose, even though I’m so bad at it - I do actually enjoy it while I’m doing it! I generally attend class in the evening so I’m going to take 15 minutes every morning to practice what you’ve recommended and hopefully I’ll progress! I’m glad you recommended measuring my progress, as that kind of thing really works for me (chalk marks on the mat!) but I’ve always felt slightly guilty about it because I hate to feel that I’m ‘chasing’ a pose. With Ashtanga, esp. Mysore you’re only given a pose when you deserve it. My teacher fortunately doesn’t work too strictly and lets me practice full primary series even though I can’t do full kurmasana, supta kurmasana or upavishta konasana. I’d be interested in your view on Ashtanga generally to be honest as over the last few years I’ve found it’s given me great physical benefits (fabulous abdominal and shoulder strength) but I do struggle with the medatative aspects of the practice (I’m always the first up and out at savasana) and find it really hard to relax or find mindfulness during or after practice. The only times I feel in that kind of state is during very challenging/intense postures such as Bhujapidasana, or kapotasana, where my mind is completely and utterly focussed (because of the pain/intensity). I really struggle to focus in more relaxing postures during finishing sequence or savasana. I’ve just realised it sounds like I’m blaming Ashtanga for my lack of ability to focus! Of course I don’t mean that - I love my Ashtanga practice. However my teacher focusses mainly on asana, and I’d probably be annoyed if he didn’t, as that’s what I go there for, - however after three years of practising I sometimes wish I could lie in savasana for more than five minutes without wondering what I’m having for dinner, or hold a pose for more than five breaths without getting bored. Should I try something different or just accept how it is?
Thank you so much again for your views and experience
Namaste
Tammy

#11

@Tammy

Much depends on what it is that you want out of your practice. Personally, shavasana is the most important aspect of the practice, hence the most difficult pose. When the body/mind are relaxed this is where the real healing takes place. You are able to allow the asana practice to “do its work” and resonate. As a teacher, it is wonderful to see progress in a student. For me I get the greatest delight in seeing my students, not move at all during shavasana. And then to see them arise with content smiles. I do many different things during shavasana, depending on the class, my observations on what they need and even what they request of me. Yoga Nidra is something I highly recommend. It keeps your mind from wandering, by keeping you focused on present. You can probably google it and print it. Deepak Chopra has a CD of Yoga Nidra that is quite good too. I hear your struggle and also your desire to be able to relax and enjoy relaxation and even poses that you hold for longer periods. Perhaps once you are able to still the mind during shavasana, you will be able to fully engage and enjoy being the pose you are doing. Do you also practice at home? If so, put on some nice background music, light a candle and set the mood. It does wonders.

As far as Ashtanga, I do admire how physically demanding it is. But I also realize that there are also many injuries from it. Especially rotator cuff injuries from students not performing Chatturanga Dandasana correctly. I teach Power yoga which is taken from Ashtanga, but with no set sequence. (I also teach Vinyasa Flow, Yin/Yang and mixed level class) If you feel that your practice is lacking in something perhaps discuss with your teacher. Try a different style that is quieter than Ashtanga. Yin is wonderful and could help with Upavistha Konasana too. Personally, Ashtanga is not for me. I’m more playful and spontaneous, so Power or Vinyasa suites me quite well.

Explore if you feel something is missing. Do you meditate? If so, is it easy or difficult? One more ?. How does your teacher lead you into shavasana? What poses are done just before?

#12

Hi Lotusgirl,

I have recently started trying to practice at home more. The plus side being that I can play about and experiment more. However the downside is that I am easily distracted, and will often find myself wandering off to do something else, or rushing through the postures (why?! It’s not as if I have anywhere else to be!) and getting very annoyed with myself as a result! However, I did practice full primary series at home tonight and I gave myself a good twenty minutes in savasana, which I actually found easier and more enjoyable than I thought I would!
The weekend classes I attend are an hour and a half, so there is generally ten to fifteen minutes to rest, but during the week we often only have an hour, so there is usually hardly any time for savasana at the end. During the longer classes, we do the ashtanga finishing sequence before taking rest, but during the shorter classes, my teacher will often finish at navasana, before moving into backbends and then savasana.
I think that you are right about making more effort with my space when I practice -candles, music and making sure there is no clutter, etc. I lit a candle when I practiced today and I’m sure it made a difference even though it’s just a little thing. I have done yoga nidra in class before and sometimes I have enjoyed it and sometimes not. I’ve never really meditated but would like to try. I believe I will find it very difficult because I find it so hard to stop my thoughts going at a million miles an hour. I’m sure this means though that it would be very beneficial for me in the long run! I think I just feel that I’m not enjoying my practice as much any more - sometimes it feels like a chore. I’ve recently started a new, quite stressful job and it sometimes feels like yoga is just another stressful thing to get through before I can go home - which is certainly not how it should be!

By the way, I used your tips for Upavista Konasana and it’s really helped. Obviously it’s early days in terms of progressing in the posture, but it feels like everything is in the right place, if you know what I mean? Using the block means I can hold it for longer more comfortably too.

Namaste
Tammy

#13

Glad you found the tips helpful! It just takes patience and time. Celebrate those small gains!

If you feel like your practice is a chore, maybe it’s time to try something new? Alternate between Ashtanga and a more gentle quiet practice like Yin or restorative yoga.

Meditation, while it is very difficult for most, is so important! But again, it takes patience and time and you need allow yourself mistakes. It’s how we learn. Try starting off your home practice with a 1-2 minute centering. Just focus on the breath and finding a nice rhythm. I use a visual with my classes that may be helpful to you. I ask them to take their stress, to do lists and worries and place them in a file. Then take the file and put it in the file cabinet and lock the drawer. You can have it back if you so choose after practice. This works quite well for them. Most people enjoy visual learning. You can also try ending your practice with Supta Baddha Konasana (reclined cobblers pose). I end every single class with this. It restores balance and realigns the central nervous system, the weak, the strong, male, female, left and right. Rest with your hands on your belly to feel the breath. Very soothing for the soul.

Also glad you tried setting the tone by lighting a candle. Atmosphere is very important in a home practice. Try to set it up so you won’t want to be distracted. Dim the lights, burn some insence, have water handy, turn off the ringer on the phone,if you are not using a DVD, play some nice music. All of this helps keep you in the present.

Keep us posted!