Yogah chitta vartti nirodah

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#1

[QUOTE=Bentinho Massaro;22424]There is nothing we can ever modify or change about ourselves. Even when we think we change ourselves, there is nothing there that has changed, since there was nothing to change in the first place. All appearances are pure space arising in pure space.

Love,
Bentinho.[/QUOTE]

I thought we are in Yoga Forum.
Yoga Sutra by Patanjali is the only text book in yoga, the ultimate yoga as i may say.
" Yogah chitta vartti nirodah" is what he says right in the beginning in its second sutra.
You are expected to modify all of your vratties of chitta. you got to change for achieving ultimate yoga state that is unity with Divine

#2

Yoga Sutra by Patanjali is the only text book in yoga, the ultimate yoga as i may say.
" Yogah chitta vartti nirodah" is what he says right in the beginning in its second sutra.
You are expected to modify all of your vratties of chitta. you got to change for achieving ultimate yoga state that is unity with Divine

Hey Prasad,

Well how do you know, have you done so or do you take it on belief because you worship the text?

Have you tried to modify all vratties of chitta and reached the ultimate through that and have you also tried the way of letting the mind be as it is without interference and modification? Controlling the vritties does not have to mean that you should manage every single thought form.

Love,
B.

#3

[QUOTE=Bentinho Massaro;22762]Hey Prasad,

Well how do you know, have you done so or do you take it on belief because you worship the text?

Have you tried to modify all vratties of chitta and reached the ultimate through that and have you also tried the way of letting the mind be as it is without interference and modification? Controlling the vratties does not have to mean that you should manage every single thought form.

Love,
B.[/QUOTE]

For the first part, yes I’m trying to do it for last 15 years or so. As for the second part, belief system of a person certainly does not come from worshipping(quite a loaded word to use) books, certainly not, nor does it come from reinventing the wheel or from inheritance(may be true for some) but comes from contemplation and contemplation alone.your screen image will remind you that lord Buddha did the same to come to a certain belief system.

‘Have i tried to modify all my vartties’ yes i replied earlier, i say it again i am still [B]trying[/B] to achieve, have been able to achieve(now don’t become personal again to ask ‘what are those’) some progress in that direction. Only to follow yam and Nyamas is a life time effort. That is why as per Hindu thought, there is a continuous progression from birth to birth, till you become perfect, you continuously evolve, trying to CHANGE YOURSELF birth after birth. In Indian mythology, there was a great sage who wrote an Epic if you heard it, Ramayana. He was a bandit to start with, and CHANGED to become a great sage.
Picture of lord Buddha again reminds me that under the Bodhi tree while he was contemplating he suddenly realised the eternal truth, the Buddha hood and, suddenly all his own previous millions of incarnations became known to him. This explanation was for your question ‘Have i realised it?’ you have to keep on reincarnating till you realise The Truth (Sat, which does
not change in all three dimension of time and even beyond that).
For your last part. Coming to a state of No-Mind is what the ultimate aim of ultimate Yoga is.
I think all my explination given above was unneccessary,perhaps.

#4

Hello Prasad,

Thank you for your open answers.

Well if you have been trying it for 15 years, than that must indicate that that road is a long one of harship and without much true freedom along the way. How can it be the ultimate yoga if it leaves you in darkness, confusion and duffering for thousands of lives? Sure you can stay on this path because you belief in the things you belief in, but along that path, you can also take some regular moments of letting go of all your concepts and beliefs about enlightenment and truth. Just for a moment perhaps. In these moments of letting them go, you experience that you are free from these beliefs even as they arise in your mind. They don’t really affect you, only if you belief in them.

You say it’s a process of many many lives to become perfect, changing every thought as you go. But is freedom really dependent on what kind of thoughts you are having? Is freedom depending on what you belief and do as a personal identity? Or is True Freedom always free?

About the story of the buddha, as I know it, it is not that he contemplated under the bodhi tree and achieved a belief system, it is rather the opposite: He was contemplating intensely for many years, but when he sat down under the bodhi tree, during that time, he just did not care anymore about his concemplations, he was comletely relaxing all his belief systems. So instead of contemplating and arriving at a belief system, he just rested in his awareness and as he witnessed all his belief systems that he used all his life come and go on their own account, he realized he was the free awareness that was always beyond these belief systems. As he watched all his mental desires and fears and belief systems (the demons of Mara, symbolically) come and go on their own, he realized they are nothing substantial or meaningful. They simply come… [I]and they go! :)[/I] So how could they hold any meaning or truth if they dissolve back into the nothingness of awareness? he saw that whatever thought or emotion or state of mind, from that moment on, would pop up, he was always free as awareness.

So he was [I]free[/I] from any belief system. And it was through being completely uninterested, uncachable so to say, in the process of mental contemplation, that he realized his freedom.

For your last part. Coming to a state of No-Mind is what the ultimate aim of ultimate Yoga is.

I have been to no-mind many times, it is not freedom I can asure you. I believed that too. But it is a copy of freedom, it looks like freedom. But True Freedom my friend, is that which is not dependent on anything, including your state of mind. True Freedom is not having no thoughts, True freedom is being free in either thought or no-thought. Would you agree?

You can see this for yourself: whenever you arrive at that state of No-Mind, realize the presence, the clarity, the alertness, the awraeness that is there when you are undisturbed by thoughts. Now as thoughts are coming back to you, realize how that alertness is still there. It is the space in which all thoughts come and go. Trying to maintain a state of no-mind is practically impossible if you wish to live life fully as a human also, and it will create a dependent kind of freedom, in which you feel only free if you have no thoughts.

Freedom is that awareness which is aware of the state of no-mind. And once again: that is the same awareness which is aware of a state of mind full of thoughts. It is exactly the same fredom/truth/god Whether you are a thief or a saint, awareness is aware of both, and thus it is untouched and at all times free from any sort of action or identity.

Hope this was not too personal? It may have seemed off-topic, even though it really wasn’t in my opinion. Nevertheless, I feel I will stop posting in this topic. If you have any further personal debate Prasad, you may PM me, this way we won’t bother other people and other topics.

Love,
B.