Hi Fin,
There is a wonderful post I think under the thread of the Koshas which explains the levels of consciousness, if you read that it will explain why plants don’t the same treatment.
maybe part of your process is to get angry and then once it gets hot enough it will boil what happnes when water boils, it turns to steam, what does steam do, evaporate the water, after enough evaporation the water is gone and your anger may go with it.
I grew up dysfunctional and for a long time was sad about it, at 5 my uncle killed himself and my mom said it was because he could not live any longer getting along better with his nephew then his own son. He was upset that we had a stronger relationship then his child. my mother told me this, when I was five. As a kid I sat on the front porch counting cars thinking that “when 50 cars pass by my dad will be here” for the once a month visit if I was lucky. many times I would count cars for an hour or more, cause he was always late.
My point is not to compare who had it worse, I used to live in a place in my mind of “no one understands me or how I feel, no one has gone through what I have gone through”
One day I learn to let go of most everything that has happened to me in this life, and whne I have a bad day there is only one question that I get stuck on anymore. I feel I understand with compassion why the world is the way it is and I pray for the world and souls to find balance most everyday. I pray for you as well
One day will come when you let go of your anger, maybe today, maybe tomorrow, whenever the time is right for you. Because that is what it is all about you. and once you find your place, the world will fall into place
good luck in your journey and thanks for your story
seeker
Hi Amik,
Since it is my post that probably brought out the anger in you, I want to apologize for being a little too abrasive myself in my mention about asking God for forgiveness. It was just my opinion from my learning of yoga with my guru and also my Vedantic guru.
I salute each one of you who have attempted vegetarianism after having been a non-vegetarian. That is no easy task. As I said in my previous post, it is easy for me to preach vegetarianism, being a born vegetarian.
Much Peace
I think when one is able to awake kundalini shakti with it. But that requires a dedication probably unaffordable for a non secluded person.
As I read in the Upanishads, the disciple should practice 4 times a day, morning, noon, evening and midnight and complete a certain number of inhales-exhales of a certain type of pranayama, a total amount of at least 5-6 hours, daily, and after 3 months the first siddhis will appear.
Because of that, I am not having any illusions about this. This is hard work, and perhaps unsuitable for most of us. Not because it is not good, but because we cannot do this. This would require total seclusion and renunciation, I think you agree.
Perhaps there are people who do not believe this. I do. Why ? Because after I started yoga, every little thing did work as it was “advertised” and if it did not, it was me and not the practice. So if the little things work, I believe the “big” ones will work too. The only problem is to decide if we really want them. That is the greatest obstacle. I had to realize that the reasons I am practicing yoga are anything but altruistic. In fact they were quite egoistic ones. So I am cooling down a bit, and learning what real relaxation, and peace are. Perhaps I can start a real yoga practice now.
hubert,
something I felt that I noticed when I read the hatha pradipika and maybe I am reading it wrong
in it they say on multiple occasions for multiple practices that when you master someting you reach the state you speak of. If you stand on your head for three hours you reach this state, do the breathign you descrbe you reach it as well. so what are they saying in that text, to me they are saying there is multiple ways to reach the state of bliss.
but hubert, I could be wrong and it would be beneficial for me to look into this more, but that was my intial impression from reading the hatha pradipika a couple of times
This is off topic, but I think mere technicality will never be enough to enlighten a spirit. The description of a ceirtan way often contains only the surface of what is done, and the core is missed becuase it is better to experience it individually. So I have no idea what happens to someone who does these practices, because I am unable to do them. I only have a feeling that more is happening inside than outside.
Edited. It does not belong here.
I just shared this story with a friend of mine who took some comfort in asking herself this same question. Thanks again for sharing this.
Well, if you are a good yogi, you can transform the chicken into soybean.
Or resurrect the chicken.
Or you can just eat it, and your body will transform it into what it needs. This one is just as simple, and more accesible. 
Everything is energy and some of that energy is conscious. Just as humans, animals are on their own journey and are conscious energy, they have a soul. Just because a lower form of energy (predator) acts a certain way does not mean their action is justified, their energy continues to stay low. When you consume the flesh of another conscious energy, you are consuming it’s pain, torture, and death. You are putting a lower form of energy into your body thus lowering your own energy.
Part of our journey is becoming [B]aware[/B]. Consuming or not consuming an animal’s flesh is not the only way to decrease or increase your energy, but it is a powerful way. It’s up to you to decide if you want to continue being a lower form of energy or a higher form of energy. This is karmic, what you think and do is what you attract back to you.
Namaste,
Ive been “vegan” for a few years. The reason i put quotation marks outside of vegan is because for the last few months ive been eating fish, primarily because i went through a period of time where i lost alot of weight and really needed to increase my food intake in some way and at the time i felt it would be best to start eating fish. The day after tomorrow im going off to my teacher training and i am feeling like this will be an incredible lifestyle change. This past week ive become 100% certain that i no longer want to eat fish, for i no longer want to eat any animal products. I want to hear from you. I know alot of people on here are vegetarian, and if not, i still wanna hear from you. What are your reasons, what are your preferences, how long have you been veg and how does it make your yogic journey more powerful, if it in fact affects it at all. I would really appreciate the responses because this is a definite lifestyle change for me. Thank you for your time!
Love and light and peace to all!
It sounds as though you’ve already connected with what is appropriate for you.
Our feedback at this point would be anecdotal at best, as it should be
As Gary Kraftsow pointed out at a recent Yoga Journal panel, Ahimsa is available to everyone regardless of whether they are vegan or not. Being vegan is a noble and worthy pursuit, for those that want it.
What is more relevant is that one selects what is right for them without projecting their “right” onto others.
So I would support you in your choice to not eat animal products (for your health) just as I would support you for eating fish (for your health).
My journey of yoga is impacted by mindful eating. It has little to do with being vegan directly. But I would encourage students to examine the nature of eating meat (in their body) just as I would encourage them to examine the result of alcohol or coffee in that same vessel.
So much has been said about vegetarianism on this Forum, however I would like to add my two cents here. I think we must never forget that becoming a vegetarian doesn’t happen in one life time, it takes many incarnations to reach a point where one can truely call yourself vegetarian.
Interesting point from one of my yogis the other night in class while we were discussing diet and vegetarianism: She is a devout Roman Catholic and as such she said she believes in the transmutation of the wafer and wine every Sunday to become the Body and Blood of Christ. Therefore she said I belief that when I bless my food and pray over it, I transmutate my food to become Holy, Light filled and of the Divine Itself, therefore the dead animal flesh I eat once or twice a week become more than just meat to me, she concluded. I think she has a point. So few people bless their food these days, perhaps that’s why we don’t get what we need from it and why we are getting so ill from it.
About Ahimsa - how can we talk about ahimsa if we as humans are busy waging war against everything from terrorism right through to poverty. For me the violence we express through our words and thoughts are becoming a bigger problem everyday as it perpetuates and fuels the manifestations of violence in the form of murders, rape, hi-jackings etc. In South Africa we see it so clearly happening at the moment that I even write these words with great care and trepidation.
A little meat won’t kill anyone. But the animal still must be killed. Now, as animals have group souls killing an animal is not like killing a human. The animal group can grow another member.
Still, it is arguably cruel to do this, especially that it is possible to live without meat. Many people would not eat the meat if they had to kill the animal, first. But they do eat it, because they pass the unpleasant action of killing to someone else. So their moral freedom is on the expense of another human being, the butcher. I don’t say butchers or workers in the meat industry are imoral … but the industry per se, is such a thing. All industries what target profit, and profit alone, are imoral. I can accept a carnivore culture what is built on the respect and care for animals, where the animals are not just raw material, but beings, who are given the chance to live. I respect the herdsman who takes care for many animals, and only kills a few, when there is a need. Animals have their meaning, their own purpose in lthe world, and that is not just so we can eat them.
We are masters of this world, we should be good masters. If we can’t realize this, than we are a plague, and the world will hit back, as it often does. (Think of the Creutzfeld Jacob disease - caused by prions, what appear when animals are given to eat the flesh of their own kind )
On transsubstantiation of meat … or the bread and wine in the church, I can’t say I am a good romano-catholic, as I can’t believe that a real transformation takes place. I am not saying this is not possible, but I don’t see the need. Why turn something, what is already the body of Christ, into the body of Christ ? I do not like this kind of practice as it takes the sacred into a sacred place, turns some food into sacred food, while the world outside the church, and other foods are not sacred. We should walk the world as a church, treat everyone as Christs, eat every food giving thanks, as sacred food.
I am not saying organized church is useless, but when the first disciples had their meals in common, they did share real food, and they regarded it as the body of Christ. The theology of transsubstantiation did appear later. They even did share their material posessions.
Organised religion, the church today became a ritual, a show. I am not saying it is useless, but often it is authoritative, demands respect on the clause of blind faith, and is not free from materialism and some cheap sentimentalism.
I very much respect the Church, and see it as the keeper of the gospels. But it is just a frame. Real faith, real christianity is in our own hearts.
I do not want to take away anything, not even the Eucharist. It is truly the body of Christ … but why is that only a priest can perform it ? Why are people restricted to come and touch and taste the Christ through another human being ? The Christ is alive, and here, in us and in our fellow man.
I respect the faith of conservative christians, and I do believe in blessing the meal. Only that if there is a poison in the meal, if the one who does the blessing is like Saint Benedict, the poison will be neutralized. Still I have seen many examples where conservative believers had food intoxication even with the blessings. You can’t force the hands of God just by saying a blessing or believing in it’s power. Real faith is not blind faith. Real faith is knowledge, and working along the universal rules, and not through miracles. Real faith makes miracles understandable as we understand taht they are not miracles, but fit perfectly into the frame of the Universe. Some people live in ignorance, they say they are faithful, than they are suprised that accidents, illnesses, death comes upon them. Many things are avoidable by a little knowledge … why burden our guardian angels with tasks what could be performed by ourselves ?
PS. I know that there is a faith what greatly surpasses mine, where all the things I said above prove to be silly. But I am not there yet.
Dear Hubert,
First of all thanks for using the right word, I couldn’t remember it when I wrote this reply this afternoon, i.e. transubstantiation.
Thanks for pointing out the aspects which you have, I agree with what you say, but I am also one who do not usually argue about these things as I feel it is usually pointless, and in the case of my yogi, I belief I will lead by example. She is new to yoga and even her spiritual path in this life and her challenges are many. I just thought it was interesting what she said, as I have never before heard this argument.
About the blessings, I like to bless my food, not because I belief it will make me feel better, or because the Christ is then ingrained it or what other reason, but I do it to show my gratitude for what I have to eat as I had many previous incarnations where I did not had enough and died of severe hunger and famine.
Surley you act with grace in all your endeavours. I do respect other peopel’s feelings, too, and I am not making these blunt statements to my conservative christian antourage. I believe in the the wisdom of their karma. I was just glad to have this place where I can speak openly.
Hubert, and I am so glad and grateful for you pointing these aspects out which you did. This Forum would be a poor place without your insightful replies and I always enjoy your posts!
I am in the process of converting my diet to a vegetarian diet. Just the thought of eating flesh really makes me feel ill. I’ve fought with this feeling for years and constantly ate meat because I was scared of what would happen to my body with the protein, but after a lot of studying and talking to vegans/vegetarians I finally feel like I am ready to take the next step.
I do feel that there are two different situations…eating meat the way we do here in America is pretty gross, IMO. Just to think of what they do in slaugherhouses makes me sick to my stomach. I wish that someone could somehow step in and fix the conditions and how people treat these animals. After all, they are giving ther lives to us to eat them. Even with fish…so many people won’t eat chicken/beef/pork, but eating fish is ok? I don’t understand because I think they are horrible to them too.
I know that people need to do what is right for their bodies…and I have always thought of myself as someone who needed to eat meat because of my blood type, etc., but I think with slow steps and help it will be possible. I cannot live with the guilt anymore. Take Ana Forrest for example though…she is allergic to most grains and vegetables so she has to eat meat to survive. She kills her own meat…with a bow and arrow. I must commend her for taking responsiblity for what she is doing so unlike what the rest of Americans do.
Xela,
I have been watching with curiosity since I first saw you mention that you were considering vegetarianism, somewhere, not sure exactly since we are friends in a few places. Perhaps it is the many months of committed and deepen Ashtanga practice paired with happiness and the love you have in your life; I would bet on all of that
I am hoping that you will you add links and any information you find in your own search in this thread because so many people are waking up to this for themselves. Mukunda has spoken to me, in his mentoring of my practice, about resulting nadis that are purified with right practice. As we purify them, what comes to the surface of minds and physical bodies is the pain, confusion, anger, fear, etc that was down below. It can become potently acute, but it arrives at the surface for us to finish off with [I]conscious [/I]practice and cleansing. It is the last step. I was working through something incredible this summer, and there is something similar between how your voice sounds to me here and to my own then. It is the watching for how to [I]be [/I]different in the world now that we know that we can’t go back to what we once did. lol, I just considered that maybe I won’t sound similarly voiced to you, even though you are to me! 
I wish you all the best, as your way becomes clearer and clearer to you.
Namaste,
then I must be really purifying cause there’s been nothing but mucky feelings for several weeks now.