Alternative vs conventional medicine

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#1

Conventional medicine works great in critical situations, when it comes to save ones life right now.

But how many times office doctors made wrong diagnosis? Conventional medicine failed so many times for me and many of my friends when it comes to diagnose or treat simple and annoying condition like hair loss, insomnia, constipation, indigestion, cold, asthma, diabetes and millions of others.

With all advanced lab work, machines and thousandths-bucks-testing they can not find what is going and how to take care of it that it is not going to become chronical disease

As a child I spent 3 month in the hospital and they fed me antibiotics, made painful procedures and other things… and I ended up in the pine woods doing breathing exercises and drinking weirdest substances with herbs and Badger fat:)) and that was a cure!!

So called Alternative medicine has a million-years-old history in comparison to so called western medicine that has a history of about 100 years or so…and based on putting lab-made chemicals in the body.

I just think that they are not interested in completely treatment…whey need clients!!! The goal is just to alleviate your symptoms and put you back to work so you can pay the bill until you get sick again…and so on…

#2

So what are you saying, CityMonk? :slight_smile:

#3

Traditional Chinese Medicine (acupuncture, Herbal, Tui na, qigong, etc) in China works along side of Western Medicine in Hospitals and both have MDs in Hospitals in China.

TCM in China also will use Western testing, x-rays and lab work. TCM MDs in China will also give Herbal injections

The big difference is Western Medicine treats the resault and Traditional Chinese Medicine is trying to treat the cause.

However any good TCM doc in China knows that there are certain things that are best left to Western MEdicine and certian things that are best left to TCM

#4

[QUOTE=Yulaw;42586]
The big difference is Western Medicine treats the result and Traditional Chinese Medicine is trying to treat the cause.
[/QUOTE]
Well said, Yulaw. But, its not only Chinese. And not only medicine...;) Western purpose almost in everything is to make it [I]look[/I] like its OK.
Stronger socialization based on fears, i guess…

#5

In my understanding of Western Medicine capital S Science has substantiated our “faith” in the Pharmaceutical industry so that generations and generations of medicinal experience have been neglected or just not authenticated with the type of accreditation and power that powerful industries yield in the western world.

#6

In Australia, I see evidence of merging the so-called conventional and alternative medicines. My mother is a psychiatrist, and uses mindfulness-based therapy in her work (she works at a government hospital). I worked with a general practitioner who was also a qualified acupuncturist and a holistic counsellor and used those techniques a lot in her work - and I see a lot of those. In the college where I study my yoga teaching course, one of the ayurveda teachers (professors?) is also a medical general practitioner, combining the two words in his work. There are more holistic treatment centres popping up everywhere. Doctors are not dependent on the pharmaceutical industry. A lot of people I know use both avenues when they want to feel better. Perhaps this isn’t the case in other countries.

Personally, if I get a mild headache or if I would like to have more energy throughout the day I might try to make myself feel better through complementary/alternative methods, but if I get a pneumonia, rabies, malaria, injury - give me antibiotics, anticeptics, surgery and anything else conventional and empirically tested and proven to work any day. So I don’t see why it has to be a “vs” when it can happily be an “and” 8)

#7

[QUOTE=Yulaw;42586]

The big difference is Western Medicine treats the resault and Traditional Chinese Medicine is trying to treat the cause.

[/QUOTE]

That is what I wanted to say:))

#8

I feel that conventional western medicine has literally caused some of the issues I now deal with on the physical level. Western MDs first take an oath to do no harm. I think very few actually abide by that. Maybe they need better lessons in ahimsa, huh? :slight_smile:

#9

[QUOTE=Tanguerita;42675]I don’t see why it has to be a “vs” when it can happily be an “and” 8)[/QUOTE]

I think that this is a really fantastic quote, and I’m going it every day.

#10

I think it is a vs situation and not an and situation mostly. There are four major types of medicine in the world: Western/Allopathic Medicine, Traditional Chinese Medicine, Ayurveda and Shaman medicine.

In these only Western medicine and Ayurveda are considered complete medical systems, the rest are primitive and unscientific. They are complete because they have all departments of a full medicine system: pediatrics, psychiatiry, geriatrics, throat, eyes and ear, pharmacy, surgery, rejuvenation and they have a scientific approach apporach based on observation of symptoms, diagnosis, prognosis and treatment and classification as well theories to back up their system. But the irony is, Ayurveda and Western medicine are mutually contradictory in all departments. They are not complimentary.

The Western approach is isolationist. It isolates the symptoms caused by a disease and then administers treatment which treats those symptoms, by replacing them with new symptoms or even new diseases, which is often based on using synthetic drugs made from chemicals. In contrast, the Ayurvedic approach is holistic, it is based on observation of the entire mind-body system for any disease and diagnosing what doshas/regulation systems are off-balance and then administering a treatment to bring that system into balance which is often based on a combination of diet regulation, natural drugs made from herbs, minerals and gemstones, lifestyle regulations, detox therapy and yoga and meditation.

One does not need to consult Western medicine for most diseases because Ayurveda has a treatment for most diseases known to man, and some some clinical studies have shown Ayurveda does a much better job in treating many diseases which Western medicine struggles with, such as asthma, arthritis, parkinsons, diabetes. New studies have shown that Ayurveda’s rasanaya treatment using minerals like mercury, gold, silver is effective in combating cancer, aids, tubercluousis. This further provides weight to why Ayurveda should be the medical system of choice.

Ayurveda also has its own school of surgery and prescribes complex operations using sophisticated instruments, which many of these operations have been adopted by modern medicine, especially plastic surgery directly from Ayurveda. However, in this department it is safe to say that Western medicine enjoys the benefits of modern technology and thus there is no need to practice traditional methods of surgery. Thus the medical system of choice for anything that needs surgicial intervention should be Western medicine.

#11

I don’t think “western medicine” treats only symptoms. For example, if you get infection, the cause is bacteria. When you go to doctor you may get antibiotics to help you body in getting rid of them. This is treatment based on searching for a cause and dealing with it. So we can’t say “western medicine” treats ONLY symptoms. Question is, what percentage of treatments is just to get rid of symptom and what percentage deals with cause.

For me the worst is this “anti-flu” shit advertised on tv that in fact just blocks signalling pathways so that brain doesn’t know that there is an infection - so there are no “symptoms” which are in fact natural ways of dealing with infection (fever, loss of energy so you get some rest etc.).

#12

Yes, Pawel, Yulaws "result" is more appropriate here than Surya Devas “symptom”. :slight_smile:
In the example you gave, a real deep cause of the disease is not a bacteria.
It`s a human mind which causes particular actions, habits and even circumstances, that let bacteria intrude an organism.

#13

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;42891]I think it is a vs situation and not an and situation mostly. There are four major types of medicine in the world: Western/Allopathic Medicine, Traditional Chinese Medicine, Ayurveda and Shaman medicine.

In these only Western medicine and Ayurveda are considered complete medical systems, the rest are primitive and unscientific. They are complete because they have all departments of a full medicine system: pediatrics, psychiatiry, geriatrics, throat, eyes and ear, pharmacy, surgery, rejuvenation and they have a scientific approach apporach based on observation of symptoms, diagnosis, prognosis and treatment and classification as well theories to back up their system. But the irony is, Ayurveda and Western medicine are mutually contradictory in all departments. They are not complimentary.

The Western approach is isolationist. It isolates the symptoms caused by a disease and then administers treatment which treats those symptoms, by replacing them with new symptoms or even new diseases, which is often based on using synthetic drugs made from chemicals. In contrast, the Ayurvedic approach is holistic, it is based on observation of the entire mind-body system for any disease and diagnosing what doshas/regulation systems are off-balance and then administering a treatment to bring that system into balance which is often based on a combination of diet regulation, natural drugs made from herbs, minerals and gemstones, lifestyle regulations, detox therapy and yoga and meditation.

One does not need to consult Western medicine for most diseases because Ayurveda has a treatment for most diseases known to man, and some some clinical studies have shown Ayurveda does a much better job in treating many diseases which Western medicine struggles with, such as asthma, arthritis, parkinsons, diabetes. New studies have shown that Ayurveda’s rasanaya treatment using minerals like mercury, gold, silver is effective in combating cancer, aids, tubercluousis. This further provides weight to why Ayurveda should be the medical system of choice.

Ayurveda also has its own school of surgery and prescribes complex operations using sophisticated instruments, which many of these operations have been adopted by modern medicine, especially plastic surgery directly from Ayurveda. However, in this department it is safe to say that Western medicine enjoys the benefits of modern technology and thus there is no need to practice traditional methods of surgery. Thus the medical system of choice for anything that needs surgicial intervention should be Western medicine.[/QUOTE]

You have not got the slightest clue about Traditional Chinese Medicine do you not about how it works, what it does or its history and particularly about it as it is practiced today in China.

#14

[QUOTE=Sasha;42918]Yes, Pawel, Yulaws "result" is more appropriate here than Surya Devas “symptom”. :slight_smile:
In the example you gave, a real deep cause of the disease is not a bacteria.
It`s a human mind which causes particular actions, habits and even circumstances, that let bacteria intrude an organism.[/QUOTE]

Yes, it crossed my mind when I was writing a post. I agree that there are deeper causes. But we have to be reasonable. Because at some point causes are becoming too general and vague to cope with. I got infection because I went out and had active life? That I have physical body? That I was born in a first place?
Maybe inefficient immune system activity was the cause? But then from evolutionary point of view it wouldn’t make sense, because living organisms which get sick from time to time are building up resistance and are more fit at the end. So I just have feeling that bacteria is the most practical “cause”.

#15

[QUOTE=Yulaw;42924]You have not got the slightest clue about Traditional Chinese Medicine do you not about how it works, what it does or its history and particularly about it as it is practiced today in China.[/QUOTE]

“I have noticed that the less I know about a subject, the more confident
I feel and the more light I throw upon it.”

               Mark Twain
#16

[QUOTE=Pawel;42947]Yes, it crossed my mind when I was writing a post. I agree that there are deeper causes. But we have to be reasonable. Because at some point causes are becoming too general and vague to cope with. I got infection because I went out and had active life? That I have physical body? That I was born in a first place?
Maybe inefficient immune system activity was the cause? But then from evolutionary point of view it wouldn’t make sense, because living organisms which get sick from time to time are building up resistance and are more fit at the end. So I just have feeling that bacteria is the most practical “cause”.[/QUOTE]

Actually the cause can be rather specific in TCM that is why you talk with the TCM doc first and they do the exam based on TCM not western medicine to find the cause and then base your treatment on that cause. Basically, to over simplify it, not all headaches are created equal therefore they are not all treated the same. AS to teh bacteria, what caused it to be a problem and that is what would be treated not the I have a bacterial infection so treat the bactieria.

But with that said there are things that any good TCM doctor will tell you are best left to western medicine to treat.

#17

[QUOTE=Yulaw;42953]Actually the cause can be rather specific in TCM that is why you talk with the TCM doc first and they do the exam based on TCM not western medicine to find the cause and then base your treatment on that cause. Basically, to over simplify it, not all headaches are created equal therefore they are not all treated the same. AS to teh bacteria, what caused it to be a problem and that is what would be treated not the I have a bacterial infection so treat the bactieria.

But with that said there are things that any good TCM doctor will tell you are best left to western medicine to treat.[/QUOTE]

Yulaw, as you noticed, many people here, myself included, have no idea about TCM :slight_smile: Maybe you could (if you have some free time) put example of condition treated by TCM? Sort of case study showing how TCM is approaching disease and how designs treatment?

Ps. About bacteria vs. bacterial infection: I’m not expert in this area, but I believe its the immune system decision which bacterias are to be exterminated. We have around 1kg bacterias in our gut. And there is more bacterial and viral DNA in our body than our own DNA code. But some germs are not accepted by our immune system. So, coming back to cause: the cause of the symptoms is our immune system deciding that there are dangerous agents in our body, not those agents themselves (I think…)

#18

Traditional Chinese Medicine; Acupuncture, Herbal, Tui na (Acupressure), Cupping, Guasha, jiǔ (Moxibustion)

What is Acupuncture?

Originated in China more than 3000 years ago, Acupuncture is a complete medical system that is used to diagnose and treat illness, prevent disease and improve well being. It?s effective for physical, psychological, and emotional problems. Acupuncture, due to its proven effectiveness, has been embraced throughout the world.

How does Acupuncture Work?

Recent development in science has determined that human beings are complex bioelectric systems. Remarkably, this understanding has been the foundation of acupuncture practice for several thousand years.

Energy (often called ?Chi? in traditional Chinese Medicine) circulates throughout the body along well-defined pathways. Points on the skin along these pathways are energetically connected to specific organs, body structures, and systems. If this energy circulation is disrupted, optimum function is affected and this results in pain or illness. Acupuncture points are stimulated to balance the circulation of energy, Which influences the health of the entire being.

Types of treatment:

The most commonly used technique is the treatment with needles. However, other forms of treatment such as cupping, moxibuation (a form of heat therapy), and a variety of massage might be used as well. Acupuncturists may also recommend dietary modifications, herbal prescriptions, and specific therapeutic exercise.

What are the Benefits?

Acupuncture can be used as highly effective drug free pain therapy. Acupuncture provides excellent slow onset and long lasting analgesia, which continues after needle stimulation and has a continuous cumulative effect by using endogenous-opioid-peptide system. Studies indicate that acupuncture influences the central and peripheral nervous system. Evidence shows that acupuncture can trigger the release of endorphins from the brain. Which make acupuncture very effective for pain control. Acupuncture promotes the body?s natural healing ability. Most conditions can be corrected or improved without any side effects commonly caused by chemical drugs.

The effectiveness of acupuncture is well documented and extends far beyond the conception that it is only useful for chronic pain management. Recently, acupuncture detoxification treatments have been recognized as a valid form of therapy for chemical dependency problems. Throughout its long history, acupuncture has established a solid reputation as a system of health that works.

Commonly Treated Conditions:

Allergies/Asthma/Sinusitis, Anxiety/depression, Arthritis/Joint Problems, Back Pain, Bladder/kidney Problems, Constipation/Diarrhea, Colds/flu Cough/Bronchitis, Disorders of digestion, Dizziness, Depression/Stress/tension, Face Lifting, Frozen Shoulders, Gynecological, Disorders/Menopause, Headaches/Migraines, Health Maintenance, High Blood Pressure, Immune System Deficiency, Infertility, Neck Pain/Stiffness, Paralysis/Numbness, Sciatica, Skin Problems, Tendonitis

Acupressure

Acupressure treatment is an ancient healing art developed in Asia over 5,000 years ago that uses the fingers to put pressure on specific pressure points, on the body, to stimulate the body’s natural self-curative abilities. When these points are pressed, they release muscular tension and promote the circulation of blood and the body’s life force energy to aid healing. Acupuncture and acupressure use the same points, but acupuncture employs needles, while acupressure uses gentle but firm pressure.
An advantage of using acupressure include relieving pain, balancing the body and maintaining good health, reduces tension, increases circulation, and enables the body to relax deeply. By relieving stress, acupressure strengthens resistance to disease and promotes wellness.

Tui Na

Tui Na, mean push and grasp - it is closely related to acupuncture in its use of the meridian system and is considered to be effective for a similar range of health problems. Always used to treat injuries, joint and muscle problems and internal disorders.

Chinese Herbal Medicine

Chinese Herbal Medicine classifies herbs according to their taste and effect on different internal organs and acupuncture meridians. Chinese Herbal medicine uses plants (or parts of plants such as the stems, leaves, flowers, roots, bark, fruits and seeds) to treat illness, relieve common ailments and restore health. Some traditional Chinese systems also use mineral and animal products. Traditional Chinese Herbal Medicine treats the whole person rather than individual symptoms. They have classic formulas to treat common problems. But most prescriptions are individually formulated to stimulate the body’s natural healing powers so that it can treat the different problems that people have. Chinese Herbs can come in concentrated Chinese Herbal powder to make Herbal tea. Sometimes Chinese Herbal Tea is used in combination with acupuncture to treat some problems. In other cases Chinese herbal is used to treat problems on its own, without acupuncture.

#19

I have a lot of faith in Chinese beliefs about the main meridianlines and points of the body and how a blockage in one meridian will result in illnesses connected to that meridian line

I put it to the test with someone who has a number of thing wrong with them…they were all on same Meridian line. So e.g. On one line you could have say heart, sinus, varicose veins, skin eczema problem, and as the blockage remains, in time, each illness, problem arises. Very interesting stuff!!

I recently had a conversation with a Chinese health practitioner and he wasnt long from China, a year…
He made me laugh when he commented that English people are hurt easily, they ooch and oowch too much…hahaha
I also heard that the Chinese people refer to Britain as the land of heroes…

.ooching oowching ones it seems x

#20

[QUOTE=kareng;43033]I recently had a conversation with a Chinese health practitioner and he wasnt long from China, a year…
He made me laugh when he commented that English people are hurt easily, they ooch and oowch too much…hahaha
[/QUOTE]

My wife said the same thing about Americans :smiley: