Dear Friends:
I just read an interesting article at
Any comments on this article?
regards, anand
[QUOTE=Anand Kulkarni;62797]Dear Friends:
I just read an interesting article at
Any comments on this article?
regards, anand[/QUOTE]
Nvm. Sorry for jumping to conclusions. I did not see that the article was from Rajiv Malhotra. Now that I have seen it, I agree with it.
This is a good article by Rajiv Malhotra, one of the better he has written in a long time.
Kundalini-like manifestations have occurred sporadically among Christians, but mainstream churches treat them as aberrations and even as the work of the devil. Those who have such experiences are conditioned to doubt their own sanity and are often regarded as mentally ill and even institutionalized.
Not true. Throughout history there have been many Christian mystics who were treated as…mystics; i.e. having experienced some type of mystical or transcendental experience. There are a few instances of ‘demonic possession’ described in the bible. These are entirely different from mystical experience. The difference in Christianity is that there is no method taught for achieving the mystical experience.
“Nvm. Sorry for jumping to conclusions. I did not see that the article was from Rajiv Malhotra. Now that I have seen it, I agree with it.”
So depending on who wrote something you will agree or disagree?
OK I forgot. You’re only 16.
Still unable to engage ideas. Only people.
I was thinking about this a little, and I realized that Christians do have a sort of common ‘mystical experience’ . We don’t call it kundalini, we call it communion. It is not an individual experience but occurs when people come together, which is the reason for weekly services. Catholics in particular employ specific prayers and rituals for bringing about this experience.
[QUOTE=ClydeRight;62907]I was thinking about this a little, and I realized that Christians do have a sort of common ‘mystical experience’ . We don’t call it kundalini, we call it communion. It is not an individual experience but occurs when people come together, which is the reason for weekly services. Catholics in particular employ specific prayers and rituals for bringing about this experience.[/QUOTE]
ClydeRight, can you elaborate please? I attended Catholic school/church as a child from around age 5 til age 18 (attended church weekly for 12 years) and we never employed specific prayers to bring about any kind of Kundalini or related experience or any mystical experience for that matter. Communion was never regarded in that way. So I’m curious about your experiences. Thank you.
Namaste.
[QUOTE=GORI YOGINI;62884]So depending on who wrote something you will agree or disagree?
OK I forgot. You’re only 16.
Still unable to engage ideas. Only people.[/QUOTE]
No. Once I ascertain who wrote something, I know their thoughts, motives, and ideals and thus, can better understand their viewpoints.
Besides, the article itself is self-explanatory (though not to the average American) and I had no reason to disagree with it: Abrahamic religions have no spirituality whatsoever whereas Dharmic religions do. Superior Dharmic ideals and viewpoints are not to be conflated with primitive Abrahamic ones.
Once again, I understand this may be difficult for whites to comprehend. After all, you guys were fighting and dying under barbarism for 3 millennia before you came into contact with the civilizing influence of the East.
[QUOTE=ClydeRight;62883]Not true. Throughout history there have been many Christian mystics who were treated as…mystics; i.e. having experienced some type of mystical or transcendental experience. There are a few instances of ‘demonic possession’ described in the bible. These are entirely different from mystical experience. The difference in Christianity is that there is no method taught for achieving the mystical experience.[/QUOTE]
Only that after these “mystical” Jesus-worship-exclusive experiences, such people turn out to be more religiously supremacist and xenophobic than ever.
we never employed specific prayers to bring about any kind of Kundalini or related experience or any mystical experience for that matter.
Of course you did. The entire mass is a ritual that culminates in the consecration of the host.
Communion was never regarded in that way.
The eucharist is regarded as the actual body of Christ. If consuming the body of Christ is not a mystical experience, I don’t know what is.
Only that after these “mystical” Jesus-worship-exclusive experiences, such people turn out to be more religiously supremacist and xenophobic than ever.
What’s the difference between a rational man and an idealogue? If confronted with facts that tend to disprove something he previously believed, a rational man will take the new facts into consideration and adjust his position. On the other hand, an idealogue is not interested in the truth, he’s only interested in that which supports his position. If the facts don’t support his position, he ignores the facts.
So who are these xenophobic and supremacist Christian mystics? Nice word by the way. How long have you been looking for an opportunity to use that?
[QUOTE=ClydeRight;62932]What’s the difference between a rational man and an idealogue? If confronted with facts that tend to disprove something he previously believed, a rational man will take the new facts into consideration and adjust his position. On the other hand, an idealogue is not interested in the truth, he’s only interested in that which supports his position. If the facts don’t support his position, he ignores the facts.
So who are these xenophobic and supremacist Christian mystics? Nice word by the way. How long have you been looking for an opportunity to use that?[/QUOTE]
Precisely. Christians, as history shows us and as their actions in the modern times show, are ideologues. They care not for scientific inquiry, except for that which supposedly proves their religion to be true. When it comes to BBT and Evolution, its time for flame wars to commence.
All of them. Christians are required by their faith to be religiously/culturally supremacist. This supremacy unfortunately leaks into white supremacy due to the Christian identification with the white Western world. Hence, xenophobia.
As I suspected, you cannot name any xenophobic supremacist Chtistian mystics. Its all the ephemeral [I]them[/I]…all those awful Christians. You, unfortunately are a true idealogue. The thing about idealogues is that they are easily dismissed, and never taken seriously.
They care not for scientific inquiry, except for that which supposedly proves their religion to be true.
That’s actually true of all religiously oriented people. It’s ironic that the greatest scientific, technological, and political advances in human history have all come from western civilization, not Christianity or Hinduism or any other religion.
[QUOTE=ClydeRight;62958]@Nietzsche
As I suspected, you cannot name any xenophobic supremacist Chtistian mystics. Its all the ephemeral [I]them[/I]…all those awful Christians. You, unfortunately are a true idealogue. The thing about idealogues is that they are easily dismissed, and never taken seriously.[/quote]
Let’s make a couple of things very clear:
-
Christian mystic is a contradiction in terms.
-
Correct, I cannot name specific Christian mystics. That’s because I’ve never heard of them (for good reason) and because there is no such thing. Mysticism is heresy in Christianity (and equated with seditious cult practices and body worship) and thus, mystics are not Christians. Refer to point 1 are please refer to the linked article.
[But please, give me your examples of these so called “mystics.” I won’t be surprised to find religious intolerance, for example, in their works.]
- In reality, it is Universalists, such as you, who are ideologues. People like you continue to defend this Jewish excrement of a religion simply because it is a religion. You guys cannot see that such a conservative and ridiculously dogmatic religion has been a blight upon humanity since its inception. It fueled religious intolerance, white supremacy, imperialism and rape, murder, and torture of “pagans.” It continues to fuel scientific ignorance, homophobia, Negrophobia, racism, and moral conservatism. There is nothing peaceful and tolerant in Christianity, or any of the Abrahamic faiths for that matter. There is no metaphysical element and no ontological quest for answers.
When presented with the evidence, such as a primary document written by a Spanish soldier extolling the slaughter of the Incas (which the copy-pasted on some thread) in the name of God, people like you dismiss as merely a socio-political issue (:roll::roll::roll:). In short, you refuse see that these religions contain bad seeds and in doing so, y’all continue to let wrongdoings occur in the modern world.
[QUOTE=ClydeRight;62959]That’s actually true of all religiously oriented people.
[/quote]
Correct, but it is more true for conservative and supremacist faiths such as the big 3 monotheistic religions.
It’s ironic that the greatest scientific, technological, and political advances in human history have all come from western civilization, [B]not Christianity[/B] or Hinduism or any other religion.
Uhm, yeah? No one disputed this (except Surya Deva).
But don’t forget that without the pioneering accomplishments of other civilizations, Western civilization would have progressed nowhere.
EDIT: In the scientific area. Western political systems and technology are unique.
[But please, give me your examples of these so called “mystics.” I won’t be surprised to find religious intolerance, for example, in their works.]
I suggest you start with the excellent and extensive article on wikipedia. Just google christian mysticism. It’s pretty clear that Christian mysticism does exist. I’m waiting to see how you wiggle out of the stark reality that you’re blatantly wrong on that one.
Holy-Spirit-is-not-the-same-as-Shakti-or-Kundalini-or-Ruh-?-?-?.
[QUOTE=ClydeRight;62970]I suggest you start with the excellent and extensive article on wikipedia. Just google christian mysticism. It’s pretty clear that Christian mysticism does exist. I’m waiting to see how you wiggle out of the stark reality that you’re blatantly wrong on that one.[/QUOTE]
I did look up the article on Wikipedia and did see mention of the Gnostic sect of Christianity. The, AHEM, heretical one. This sect has actually been much discussed on this sub-forum and has many parallels with Dharmic religions. Thank you for reminding me of this sect, albeit indirectly. I accept defeat in this regard.
A lot of the mysticism here is related to the not-so-unique concept of the relation of man to God/Christ/Spirit.
A lot of the mysticism here is also tied into Christian dogma. Unsurprisingly, I see things like “not something we can attain by ourselves, but the gift of Christ.”
From what I can see, I was both partly wrong and right. There is mysticism in Christianity but it is heavily downplayed, scorned, and shunned these days due to the dogma of the religion. I cannot fully consider such a religion as sanctioning/incorporating mysticism when the majority of the religion’s adherents/sects are opposed to it. Nevertheless, it is still there.
Thanks for the interesting article.
From what I can see, I was both partly wrong and right. There is mysticism in Christianity but it is heavily downplayed, scorned, and shunned these days due to the dogma of the religion. I cannot fully consider such a religion as sanctioning/incorporating mysticism when the majority of the religion’s adherents/sects are opposed to it. Nevertheless, it is still there.
Downplayed, scorned, and shunned by whom? One of the mystics mentioned in the article, St Theresa of Avila, is a Doctor of the Church. In the 2,000 year history of the Catholic Church, there are only 34 Doctors of the Church, so I think that’s a high honor, not downplayed, shunned or scorned at all. You should read her book ‘The Interior Castle’.
Another mystic mentioned in the article, St Ignatius Loyola, wrote the ‘Spiritual Exercises’ that are the foundation for the spiritual practices of the highly respected Jesuits, a mainstream Catholic religious order. Most ordinary lay people are not aware of this information, but it is well known by the religious. I hope you will further consider this new information.