Nope as you would say. Please read this excerpt from an article by William Rand. My definition included universal and did not say it was only God-Consciousness. You are misrepresenting my words.
Who is William Rand, and why should I care about what he thinks? The philosophy of Reiki has got nothing to do with ‘god-consciousness’. You’re just adding more fluff to something that is already fluffy enough 
[QUOTE=lotusgirl;73986]Once again, you completely skirted my post and all the misinformation you have been handing out.
Might I ask then why some of the major hospitals and Doctors are incorporating Reiki?
And yes, I do charge for my Reiki sessions. I also freely give it without charging.
I’m finished here.[/QUOTE]
Nope, once again you have refused to acknowledge the evidence, which I have now cited several times, that Reiki has been proven in scientific controlled studies to be no more effective than a placebo.
I know why you will not acknowledge the evidence, because you make a living of offering Reiki sessions to people 
How much is it per session, $100? Nice way to make money by profiteering on peoples beliefs!
It’s unfortunate how the general Yoga and spiritual community get grouped together with new-agers. This is why responsible and rational members of the Yoga and spiritual community need to self-regulate themselves by speaking up against the new age quacks and people turning Yoga and spirituality into a business.
I would like to cite this article published in the Guardian UK again, because it echoes the same voice of reason I am providing here:
The scientific stance may appear heartless and cruel in light of the suffering of cancer patients, while the attitude of the nurses seems patient-centred and caring. This impression is wrong. By insisting that patients must not be treated with placebos like reiki, scientists also advocate that they receive treatments that demonstrably work better that placebo. For instance, massage has been shown to improve the wellbeing of cancer patients beyond a placebo effect. If a patient receives a massage with empathy, sympathy, time, understanding and dedication, she would benefit from the placebo effect – just like the reiki patient – but, in addition, she would also benefit from the specific effect of the treatment that massage does and Reiki does not offer.
Simply administering a placebo like reiki would deprive patients of the specific treatment effect. The allegedly caring approach of some enthusiasts of alternative medicine would therefore rob patients of benefits that they need and deserve. In other words, behind the smokescreen of alternative medicine – or integrated healthcare, to use the currently fashionable term – patients would not profit more, but less.
So who is heartless and cruel? Those who promote wacky placebos in the name of caring or those who stand up for science in the best interest of patients?
The Yoga community and spiritual community at large need to stop endorsing this quackery and commercialization of Yoga/spirituality. We endorse it in two ways: by actively participating in these sham brands like quantum Yoga, Reiki, Secret, Law of Attraction and by by remaining silent on them and letting them get away with it.
What do we have to lose?
Purity and potency: Yoga and spirituality today has been diluted down so much that like in homoepathic medicine, the actual active ingredient is negligible. We are getting dumbed down and substandard products on spirituality.
Respect and credibility: Outside the Yoga and spiritual community, we are seen as quacks, irrational and fluffy people. That the scientific and academic community seldom want to be associated with us. This is because we are not making an effort to self-regulate ourselves by dissociating ourselves from the quacks and greedy merchants that riddle our community.
Thus as responsible members of the Yoga and spiritual community we need to promote more honest,scientific and rational thinking in our community and regulate against the quackery and commercialization. Say NO to Quantum Yoga - and Reiki
I finally took a look at the Quantum Yoga site, and I like it. What I find most interesting is that the woman behind it grew up in India and started practicing at an early age. She studied with both BKS Iyengar and Pattabi Jois in India, and is actively involved in practicing and teaching yoga. I don’t completely buy the connection she makes between yoga and quantum physics, but I find her yoga to be far more authentic than somebody whose only involvement with yoga is posting on the internet.
[QUOTE=Asuri;74007]I finally took a look at the Quantum Yoga site, and I like it. What I find most interesting is that the woman behind it grew up in India and started practicing at an early age. She studied with both BKS Iyengar and Pattabi Jois in India, and is actively involved in practicing and teaching yoga. I don’t completely buy the connection she makes between yoga and quantum physics, but I find her yoga to be far more authentic than somebody whose only involvement with yoga is posting on the internet.[/QUOTE]
You’re funny
[QUOTE=Asuri;74007]I finally took a look at the Quantum Yoga site, and I like it. What I find most interesting is that the woman behind it grew up in India and started practicing at an early age. She studied with both BKS Iyengar and Pattabi Jois in India, and is actively involved in practicing and teaching yoga. I don’t completely buy the connection she makes between yoga and quantum physics, but I find her yoga to be far more authentic than somebody whose only involvement with yoga is posting on the internet.[/QUOTE]
This is your second unprovoked personal attack against me in this thread. I have reported it to David 
My sincere apologies for closing the thread with harsh words. I’ve deleted the posts that provoked my poor handling of the situation so the thread can continue.
Please continue the conversation without any personal attacks.
Again, my apologies for handling the situation poorly. I let my frustration get the better of me.
This is probably why I’m so against banning people for outbursts and “poor behavior”. I’d have to ban myself too
[QUOTE=Asuri;74007]I finally took a look at the Quantum Yoga site, and I like it. What I find most interesting is that the woman behind it grew up in India and started practicing at an early age. She studied with both BKS Iyengar and Pattabi Jois in India, and is actively involved in practicing and teaching yoga. I don’t completely buy the connection she makes between yoga and quantum physics, but I find her yoga to be far more authentic than somebody whose only involvement with yoga is posting on the internet.[/QUOTE]
I am going to respond to your post without any personal attacks, as I think at least one of us has to conduct themselves maturely. First let me respond to your personal attack: You state my only involvement with Yoga is posting on the internet, and I presume you mean posting on this forum. Recently, I have been posting much less on this forum because of work and other activities. The fact that I am a prolific poster on this forum does not reflect on me poorly at all. I contribute to this forum because I have interest in and enjoy the discussions here. I am sure this is reason many people post here. You yourself are also a prolific poster here.
Secondly, although I do not have to justify my involvement in Yoga, as you have personally attacked me by insinuating I have no involvement in Yoga other than posting on the internet, I feel I must put the record straight. Here is what my involvement in Yoga is:
Evidently, my involvement with Yoga is not just participating on a forum, but I am actually very passionate about Yoga and Yoga is a very important part of my life. So you insult me deeply by undermining my involvement with Yoga. If you have any decency and maturity you will public-ally apologize to me for this comment and never make such comments again.
Now, let me explain why personal attacks, more technically known as ad-hominems(to-the-man) are a waste of time and space, and end up ruining discussions
It is perfectly possible to have discussions on any subject without adhominems. Adhominems are known as informal fallacies because they do not add anything to an argument or discussion. They are used by those who cannot actually contribute any valid arguments. Three of your contributions in this thread(two of which has now been deleted) were personal attacks. They detracted from the subject and poisoned the atmosphere.
This portion of your most recent post is fine:
I finally took a look at the Quantum Yoga site, and I like it. What I find most interesting is that the woman behind it grew up in India and started practicing at an early age. She studied with both BKS Iyengar and Pattabi Jois in India, and is actively involved in practicing and teaching yoga.
It is actually making a point, and offers some reason as well that the founder of Quantum Yoga has studied with Yoga masters like Iyengar and Patabi Jois in India from an early age. This will contribute to the flow of discussion. I can respond to it. Here is my response:
If she is studied with Iyengar and Patabhi Jois, then she should continue in their lineage - be an Ashtanga or Iyengar Yoga teacher, like others who have studied under them. Why does she feel the need to start her own Yoga lineage? Is she offering anything new that justifies a new brand of Yoga? No, she is effectively deriving everything she has learned from Iyengar and Patabhi Jois, repackaged it using gimmicks like quantum physics and Ayurveda, and now sells it as her own brand to gain money and fame.
The commercialization of Yoga is definitely one of the things I am criticizing in this thread. There are far too many merchants in the Yoga community who take a legitimate practice like Yoga learned from somebody else, and then do business with it. The result is the practice loses its potency and suffers.
The solution is the Yoga community needs to self-regulate. We must not endorse the commercialization and quackery of Yoga and spirituality, but actively speak up against it.
The hypocrisy of this lecture on the evils of personal attacks is appalling, considering the source. People who have been around this forum for a while will know what I mean. I consider a practice that consists of actually practicing and teaching yoga, without pretention, and learned from acknowledged masters to be far more legitimate than a “neck-up” practice that consists mostly of reading books and tapping at a keyboard. The woman goes by her real name, has an M.A. in religious studies from an institution that she has named, she is an advanced practitioner, a published author, and an international yoga teacher. Her accomplishments in the field of yoga far outweigh your own, and the connection she makes between yoga and quantum physics is something you yourself have done many times, so I think it’s really a joke for you to be critical of her.
f you have any decency and maturity you will public-ally apologize to me for this comment and never make such comments again.
You have proven that you have no decency and maturity. I have reported your posts again to David for continuing personal attacks. I am not going to just sit here and let you personally attack me and ruin a good discussion. I think you take advantage of David’s good nature and tolerance, that despite him requesting that you do not make personal attacks and deleting your previous ones, you still continue with impunity.
This discussion is not about Surya Deva vs the founder of Quantum Yoga. It is about commercialization and false misleading promises in the Yoga and spiritual community and need for self-regulation. An issue that many people in the Yoga community share. Stop making this discussion personal. In fact don’t participate if you cannot be civil and mature. I don’t mean this just for this discussion, but any discussion. I am tired of your constant and unprovoked personal attacks. You have ruined many discussions.
It’s really unfortunate that another thread has to degenerate into childish bickering. I really do not wish to participate in that sort of thing. I have to point out, though, that your own post contains a blatant personal attack. This demand for an apology is really laughable, considering the numerous occasions that you have attacked me on this forum. If merely expressing an opinion as to what constitutes a legitimate form of yoga is going to be misconstrued as a personal attack, then it’s time for me to leave this forum anyway.
It’s really unfortunate that another thread has to degenerate into childish bickering. I really do not wish to participate in that sort of thing.
You are the only one engaging in childish bickering here. You are the only one making personal attacks. I have still not returned any of your personal attacks, and requesting an apology for a personal attack, is not a personal attack. This goes without saying.
Asuri just leave this discussion if you have nothing valid to contribute.
Unfortunately the definition of what is valid seems to be “agrees with Surya Deva” and the definition of invalid seems to be “does not agree with Surya Deva”. I’ve already learned that it’s impossible to get rid of “quackery” in yoga, mainly because no one person can set themselves up as the arbiter of what is or is not “quackery”. If they attempt to do so, they become a would-be yoga dictator, which itself is a form of “quackery”.
I suspect that this campaign against commercialization in yoga is really a veiled attempt by hindus to “take back” yoga. Personally, I think its a good thing that yoga has escaped hinduism.
HAtha is taught as a ladder leading to the pinnacle of Raja.
THe END, even though hatha has, at least to some, highly desirable side effects.
Don’t care bout the Big things? Haven’t had enough suffering? You’ve built 34 mansions of bones and thats not enough yet?
.
Want to feel the ENERGY? Want to know, through experience, that you are more than a slab of meat? Want to know that there is energy, you are energy, and that it lasts far longer than dust?
Can you be still for ten minutes or less and simply put your mind on a spot in your body?
The energy follows mind. Gather the mind to a spot and energy will follow. THis sensation, if you have some measure of clarity, and aren’t composed of sludge, and fire, you will feel. Give it time… And it’s not just your mind that you feel but the energy gathering. Conregating. Gesticulatin…
It’s even easier to feel if you do asana first for a bit - then gather the mind.
Double benefit to you, you will feel, and your faith will be shorn, but you will also give a measure of love to your body thats worn…
AMEN.
[QUOTE=Asuri;74102]Unfortunately the definition of what is valid seems to be “agrees with Surya Deva” and the definition of invalid seems to be “does not agree with Surya Deva”. I’ve already learned that it’s impossible to get rid of “quackery” in yoga, mainly because no one person can set themselves up as the arbiter of what is or is not “quackery”. If they attempt to do so, they become a would-be yoga dictator, which itself is a form of “quackery”.
I suspect that this campaign against commercialization in yoga is really a veiled attempt by hindus to “take back” yoga. Personally, I think its a good thing that yoga has escaped hinduism.[/QUOTE]
Personal attacks are not valid contributions to any discussion. They are also against the terms of use of this forum. You have already been banned for 3 months for making personal attacks. Obviously David does not want personal attacks on his forum, and has already requested you several times to stop it. Continue to not heed his rules, and you will probably face permanent banning. I am going to report each and everyone of your personal attacks against me from now on.
It is possible to self-regulate against pseudoscience and unethical consumer practice . The scientific community do a good job of it, as do many ethical consumer groups like anti-vivisection etc . There should be a similar groups set up to regulate Yoga.
The issue of commercialization of Yoga is a common issue in the Yoga community and thus something needs to be done about it. This issue is raised by not just by Hindus, but by many serious and sincere practitioners of Yoga. The issue has nothing to do with religion, it has to do with ethical consumer practices. It is not an ethical consumer practice for example to misuse quantum physics to sell products like Secret, Law of attraction etc This is unethical because it spreads misinformation about quantum physics. It sells false beliefs and promises.
Regarding Yoga escaping Hinduism? This is wishful thinking Christian. Yoga is still very much rooted in the Hindu tradition. Modern Yoga is founded by Krishmacharya, who is the architect of the Vinyasaya flow-sequence which is the core of modern Yoga. Krishnamacharya was a Hindu scholar, Ayurvedic Physician and had learned Yoga from a traditional Hindu guru. He developed the modern practice of Yoga based on the classical Hindu texts with the core philosophy that the asanas and pranayamas were only tools to the final goal of Yoga, enlightenment and liberation. None of his students B.K.S Iyengar, Indra Devi, Pattaboi Jois abandoned this core aim of Yoga. While Krishnamacharya et al did put a lot of emphasis on asanas in their practice, they never lost sight of the final goal of Yoga which is the aim of Hindu philosophy: Moksha.
Yoga has certainly not escaped Hinduism. It is only people who are ignorant of its philosophy and history and treat it as nothing more than an exercise program who have this misconception.
You guys have changed the definition of Quantum physics to: the science of things so small that the quantum nature of reality has NO effect
Do you hear that? [I]Something needs to be done about it.[/I] Your friendly neighborhood yoga regulator will be coming to a yoga studio near you. But wait a minute, first we need a constitutional congress, and a constitution, and a legislature, and some laws, and of course the all important yoga police. What a bunch of silliness.
No quantum yoga, no reiki, nothing that’s not…what?..[I].hinduism[/I].
Free at last, free at last. Thank god almighty, I’m free at last!
Do you hear that? Something needs to be done about it. Your friendly neighborhood yoga regulator will be coming to a yoga studio near you. But wait a minute, first we need a constitutional congress, and a constitution, and a legislature, and some laws, and of course the all important yoga police. What a bunch of silliness.
I think what is silly is your interpretation that setting up a self-regulating body means a dictatorship. Self-regulating bodies are set up for many fields and organizations, for example in cinema the the initial system of censorship that was practiced was based on self-regulating, before the current standard rating system was institutionalzied.
Having standardized codes of practice and ethics is a common feature of any healthy system.
It is much better having self-regulation than government regulation. The Yoga alliance is one attempt at developing a non government Yoga regulating body to ensure certain standards are met. It is a step in the right direction, but in its current form it is inadequate. I am proposing setting up a more rigorous regulating body which institutes not just codes of practice, but also ethical codes that prevent commercialization and quackery in Yoga. Such an organization would be secular, not based on any religion, but only on professional scientific research. I propose that this body not only be limited to Yoga, but the entire spiritual field.
This would prevent brands like quantum Yoga, Secret, Law of attraction from proliferating. It would also represent in the spiritual field a rational and professional voice and an accurate, factual representation of Yoga and spirituality, to the extent that the study of Yoga would become a legitimate and accepted discipline in the academic community and encouraged within education at all levels.
Before you take the splinter out of your brother’s eye, you first need to remove the log that is in your own eye.