Dear community need an explanation on here and now concept.
It is just about emotional side: Do not worry about future worries or worries of the past.
Because if I will try to live here and now in this moment i will not be able to plan or think about something my eyes do not see right now or my body, mind need right now. Or maybe this is an idea?
Thanks
Being fully present “here and now” is more experiential than a concept. It is a result of practicing being in the “here and now” - mindfulness during daily activity and on the meditation cushion. It is not meant to be a tool for suppressing anything. If you have worries about the past or the present, be fully present with those worries! Mindfulness practice may eventually lead to a different “quality” of those worries. Slowly, the worries may break down into their thought, emotion and bodily sensation components. Later, one may become aware of their ephemeral nature. A little “distance” appears between “oneself” and these worries so that they may become easier to bear. This is not a concept, but a result of practice.
well sometimes I had planned to do things, and while planning, writing a list of things to do or what not, at times I projected how I would feel about doing those things, think about how much I had to do, start to get overwhelmed, etc… all that while planning the day. So I was worrying about what I would be doing, when at the time I was planning. Worrying about the future is a waste of time in my opinion, does that mean I never do it anymore?
so anyway, say right now you feel hungry, then right now you should figure out what to eat, then right now you will eat, then right now you will clean.
still confused;(
If you are still confused, could you repeat your question? Elaborate? Is this for yourself. Is it for your students? Where did you come across “here and now”? Where are you now? And where would you like to go?
well citymonk, what time is it? and no matter the time, it is now. right? Ok so think about what you are going to do tonight, but that does not mean it is tonight, right?
think about yesterday, but what time is it now? Now, Right? yesterday is gone.
its ok to be confused
brother Neil
I’ve entertained something perhaps like this thought, that if yoga practices induce a thoughtless state then how can one plan for the future given there are no thoughts occurring. But then we are told we are not the doer, and that at that point perhaps the doing, or the illusion of doing begins to happen all by itself as if the universe had it’s own intelligence and designs and we are just witnessing it all going on somehow behind the veil .The more we try to control things the more resistance pops up. Hnce why some folk say just be,recognise your true nature,rest easy in it, and so on.Everything is eithe perfect,does’nt need changing, or it will all work out in the end. It is the attempt to interfer with things, do rather than be in order to get some epxected result that of course often interfers with the result. End-gaining.What do “I” get out of it?Maybe there really is no “I”.A number of folk with cconcur with this.Then what is there.Universal of Cosmic Concsiouness and other descriptions like here & now.
Projecting for the future, thiking of the past are just thought-streams of Consciousness. I think the suggesstion is they are not reality. They are fictions or distortions of the mind.Then how can you plan for the future.Then philosphically you accept you are not the doer, then see if things work out for “you”( that illussion,maya if we w speculate that there maybe is no you) or not.Maybe the truth of that expression “go wih the flow” actually has some eastern non-dual metaphyscical basis.
Who is CityMOnk ? But who is she really? She’s not necessarily just the pretty face but she is here & now, in some reducible philosphical sense…lol
I said to someone who happen to die recently an old friend as it happens- but no big deal.
I said -" i’m confused".
And i did feel that way in an existential sense, something kinda not adding up about life generally etc,almost dissapointing perhaps you might say. A cop-out. Like, is this it?.
He said “confused about what?”
But yes he was right,had a good point and somehow helped me in his answer.Almost even answered it to some extent.Like if you are confused it often implies you are confused about something.The kernel notion within that idea that You cannot just be confused or perhaps you can - on an a deeper emotive level.Well this is the conceptual idea-based conditioning of the thinking mind along with it’s logic and distortions. Some folk choose not to believe in it,the mind as not your true nature, not who you really are, while still playing along with if necessity seems to demand it, like living practically- shopping for food, eating, sleeping etc.
There is no way to understand BEING.
Understanding is with the mind. The nature of the mind is to analyze and compare - in other words, the mind compartmentalizes. It cannot grasp anything absolute and objective - only the relative and subjective.
But the present moment is absolute. It is pure BEING, and the mind is only part of it - a small part.
When you step into the present moment, you literally step OUT OF YOUR MIND.
You can still make plans - but it is more that the plans just get made, they go on getting made without a need for your interference. This is true detachment.
And the eyes go on seeing - but they see, they don’t look. They see everything happening as it happens, and they don’t get caught up in any of it.
When you’re not in the here and now, the eyes look - they judge, and pre-conceive.
It’s a great question CM but unfortunately ‘here and now’ cannot be explained or understood - it has to be experienced.
“Be Here Now” was the title of a popular counterculture book from the late '60’s early '70s era. It was written by a guy named Baba Ram Das, who had been an associate of Timothy Leary and was formerly known as Richard Alpert. “Be Here Now” was something he picked up from his guru whom he met while on a trip to India. I don’t remember the exact circumstances, but it impressed me enough that it stayed with me all these years. There were a lot of interesting stories in that book. It’s well worth the read if you can find it.
My take on it is, in relation to yoga practice, at a certain stage, we restrict certain types of mental activity, in particular, imagination and memory, which leaves us focused on the here and now. Practicing asanas and pranayama is a good way to get there. Also you can look at it from a different angle. By simply focusing awareness on the present, we restrict imagination and memory. This is a significant point about Patanjali’s yoga, compared with other systems which use visualization and certain sequences or rituals. Patanjali’s yoga is about focusing on real objects, gross or subtle.
I should add that being in the “Here and Now” is really about just giving your mind a rest. By that I mean taking a little time off from the troubles and worries of the day and allowing some rejuvenation or healing to happen.
The way you keep yourself from injury and overextension in an asana,
the way you keep from falling asleep in sivasana –
this has application in your daily life off the mat, to learn from the past without being trapped by it; to plan the future without becoming obsessed with it.
At least, that is my current hope.
[QUOTE=core789;30923]I’ve entertained something perhaps like this thought, that if yoga practices induce a thoughtless state then how can one plan for the future given there are no thoughts occurring. [/QUOTE]
Well, but if one stays in the thoughtless state all the time we will not be able to communicate with the world and support the life of our bodies.
[/QUOTE]But then we are told we are not the doer, and that at that point perhaps the doing, or the illusion of doing begins to happen all by itself as if the universe had it’s own intelligence and designs and we are just witnessing it all going on somehow behind the veil .[/QUOTE]
That what confuses me. If I will just witness and not doer, then who will cook the breakfast? who will bring the knowledge for my students, who going to donate money to the Children’s hospital, who will organize action for planting more trees in the city?, etc, etc
[/QUOTE]The more we try to control things the more resistance pops up. [/QUOTE] Thats ok. Yoga practice is not about only get thoughtless and sit in the beautiful garden meditating. Tell me if I’m wrong… [/QUOTE]
[/QUOTE].Everything is eithe perfect,does’nt need changing, or it will all work out in the end.[/QUOTE]
Lets say I will sit in meditation and practicing asanas, conneting with my true self… at the same time someone is dying in Africa because they simply did not had rainfall withing two years and all the water is gone, and there is no way to get a drop of water… lets assune that I have an ability to help…should I help OR SHOULD I JUST wait “until it will work it out”, until people will be dead from thirst? Well to go deeper in philosophy we can tell that death is the natural process and survival on this planet is not easy…ect…
[/QUOTE]Projecting for the future, thiking of the past are just thought-streams of Consciousness. I think the suggesstion is they are not reality. They are fictions or distortions of the mind.Then how can you plan for the future.Then philosphically you accept you are not the doer, then see if things work out for “you”( that illussion,maya if we w speculate that there maybe is no you) or not.Maybe the truth of that expression “go wih the flow” actually has some eastern non-dual metaphyscical basis.[/QUOTE]
I understand this, and agree. But can go with the flow… maybe need to learn…
[/QUOTE] Some folk choose not to believe in it,the mind as not your true nature, not who you really are, while still playing along with if necessity seems to demand it, like living practically- shopping for food, eating, sleeping etc.[/QUOTE]
I think this is different topic, though related to here and now:) Thank you!
[QUOTE=Techne;30973]The way you keep yourself from injury and overextension in an asana,
the way you keep from falling asleep in sivasana –
this has application in your daily life off the mat, to learn from the past without being trapped by it; to plan the future without becoming obsessed with it.
At least, that is my current hope.[/QUOTE]
AWESOME! That is exactly what I want to think about here and now:). And this means do not attach to them emotionally… Just what I did all the life and even did not suspect that everything complicated is very simple at the same time:)
[QUOTE=Asuri;30943] This is a significant point about Patanjali’s yoga, compared with other systems which use visualization and certain sequences or rituals. Patanjali’s yoga is about focusing on real objects, gross or subtle.[/QUOTE]
Very interesting
citymonk, have you ever been to the kundalini center in altamonte? Some of those instructors might be good people to ask about this, a lot of them been doing yoga for many years.
I’ve never been, but friend of mine went there, I will might go next time. For NOW I would like to get some answers HERE:)
There are few competent people on forum who I believe could help
[quote=CityMonk;30979]Well, but if one stays in the thoughtless state all the time we will not be able to communicate with the world and support the life of our bodies.
[/quote]
Or ,We will not be interfering with our natural state, which is best left uninterfered with, unaltered, unmodified.
If I will just witness and not doer, then who will cook the breakfast? who will bring the knowledge for my students, who going to donate money to the Children’s hospital, who will organize action for planting more trees in the city?, etc, etc
Let’s say there’s a divine intelligence in the Universe(some might call it God or Cosmic ordering principle, or whatever, for the sake of discussion) that we can discover through yogic sadhana that does what’s best for us ( “I” & everyone else)and will operate behind the scenes, as it were, if only we let it, by non-interference, and a couple of other dooing things-that we/the “I” does- i.e meditation,pranayam,asana ,yamas & niyamaa and so forth, that nudge us and help us along,move us towards that end.So we’re not taking a back seat and watching folk suffer but we are tackling at it’s root-which is roughly speaking changing the very perspective we have towards that suffering we perceive,are witnessing etc.
Thats ok. Yoga practice is not about only get thoughtless and sit in the beautiful garden meditating. Tell me if I’m wrong…
Yes but it’s a main one.The ceasing of the mind-control modifications, the eddies is a sign,so we are told, of expanded Consciousness.
Thoughts bind us to ignorance of illlusion;these prevent us from seeing our tue nature which manifests and arises, in fact is, pure(bliss) Conscousness uncorrupted by mental constructs-i.e thoughts, so we are told.(Patanjali and others)
So the suggestion is we can still act in the world, but without thinking, or planning. In fact because of t his it our behaviours and actions become morally self-regulated( and regulating).We act because of bigger interestsbecause wwe identify with ourselves less.We are told the “i” though is the biggest illusion of them, the illusion of separation as they say between I/us and everything else…
Lets say I will sit in meditation and practicing asanas, conneting with my true self… at the same time someone is dying in Africa because they simply did not had rainfall withing two years and all the water is gone, and there is no way to get a drop of water… lets assune that I have an ability to help…should I help OR SHOULD I JUST wait “until it will work it out”, until people will be dead from thirst?
Yeah help after you’ve finished meditating.There’s alot of folk that help for chairity but sometimes i wonder if they do that because they are either guilty or trying to make themsleves feel better-i.e their motives for ‘helping’ are not purely authentic or genuine. In my country,uk, you see touts that are quite well paid trying to ask for money for charities but i guess it’s better than nothing.
Well to go deeper in philosophy we can tell that death is the natural process and survival on this planet is not easy…ect…
One of life’s certainties, in some sense of the word.
I understand this, and agree. But can go with the flow… maybe need to learn…
No, i don’t think so.
Although , unlearnnig can be just as useful…if not more.So our vantage pt. is not courrpted by beliefs,language, thought structures etc.
I think the uggesstion is that ther may an intelligence we cannot see operating behind the scenes/material world our eyes can see.By giving ourselves upto that things can take care of themselves.That’s probably why prayer is like a kind of siddhi yoga.We give ourselves up the divine without e=any thought-processes,planning etc to get in the way.What is called the faith of spirituality or even religion could actually be the flow of Consciousness in it’s pur unadulterated state. So we act in the world.We live in the her & now rather than think it.Kashmir shaivists will say that thinking is at the root of human suffering.Try it for one day and you will see how alot of previous baggage that epeople rouitnely carry around all day, the way folk react to others and so on- see how much more stress-free your life is.
What i am saying is that life can take care of itself sometimes if we give up seeking to contorl it or be motivated by what we/ the “I” gets out of it.When you act for the interests of the world in whatever way you find possible then the “i” drops more in to the background.
So you can be saving little black kids from Africa like Madonna but also be actively working to change your perspective on how you view injustice,suffering etc in the world.
I remember a saddhu coming back from the kumbh mela festival in india (pictured on uk tv) say to some itinerant spiritual seeker who was doing a series- (whether he did all eight limbs or not i’m not enitrely sure but he smoked the ganja and did some asana)- he said yoga does not (necessarily) end suffering ( although i think it can do that) but can help us to understand it ( better).
To put it simply.
We are told in jnana yoga that the notion of a separate self,separate from everything else, is an illusion.
If we drop that illusion, then we can live in the here & now. The moment we try to conceptualise the ’ here & now’, then we are back into dualistic thinking which is said,in jnana yoga, the yoga of wisdom( intellectual yoga,self-enquiry and so on and so on, whatever you want to call it)to be at the root of suffering(or confusion), perpetuates it and we/“I”/us will never be free. In fact our yoga path will always be dissapointing because we will always be craving to satisfy the small self, ego, thought streams, mental structures which is not really who we are, who we all are.When we harm another or are envious of another for example we do ourselves harm in the long run and according to the bigger picture, or if we don’t act for bigger interests etc.
Easier said than done though, i am sure you will agree.
[QUOTE=core789;31096]To put it simply.
In fact our yoga path will always be dissapointing because we will always be craving to satisfy the small self, ego, thought streams, mental structures which is not really who we are, who we all are.When we harm another or are envious of another for example we do ourselves harm in the long run and according to the bigger picture, or if we don’t act for bigger interests etc.
Easier said than done though, i am sure you will agree.[/QUOTE]
Absolutely:)) Thank you for the discussion!
here and now, the only thing that cannot be escaped