Is Yoga Hinduism?

Spirituality Religion
#361

[QUOTE=High Wolf;38370]@oak333_ Actually, I suggest that in such thread like this, you should refrain using quotes from people who has nothing to do with spiritual practice. We all are entrapped in a fallacy of language anyway, and all of those people are DEAD. There’s a lot of people out there reading books and says “O that’s my quote of day” and next day crowns another quote from another source. Life passes like that with agreeing upon incomplete understandings. Instead of using quote… You are alive here and now, so don’t “you” have something to say? >.>
[/QUOTE]

“those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it” - George Santayana

History is important and what was said by those “DEAD” peolpe can also be very important and one can learn form them. “DEAD” people like Lao Tsu, Siddhartha Gautama, writings of Hindu, Zen/Chan, teachers, etc.

Beyond that all I have to say is mushin

#362

[QUOTE=Yulaw;38409]“those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it” - George Santayana

History is important and what was said by those “DEAD” peolpe can also be very important and one can learn form them. “DEAD” people like Lao Tsu, Siddhartha Gautama, writings of Hindu, Zen/Chan, teachers, etc.

Beyond that all I have to say is mushin[/QUOTE]

There you go, the fallacy of language once again. It’s very difficult to be understood in this age >.>

Yes, history is important, and I didn’t say otherwise. But you didn’t see what I mean. Human mind works cunningly, hence there is a danger. Let me explain more elaborately: Learning from history and carrying it with you is different, learning from history and digesting it is different. What I mean with the quoting thing is to point out this distinction. Some people really live by quotes and not even learn from them, because they’re addicted to them. They spend all their lives based upon other people’s judgments. Even tho’ it’s a master of Yoga or Zen, the guru is there for you till you reach the beach, where one’s own boat is waiting. One must take the boat and sail to the ocean, and discover their own as they travel.

If one is too attached to another’s discourse, there would be laziness. My approach is to “digest” the past, digest the discourse as you digest a very dense food, and leave it behind, not carry it along >.> Look at those poor academics, they carry libraries in their heads. So burdensome! One must become like a feather ^^

#363

@High Wolf

Who is to say that Yulaw, Oak333 and I will include SD, are not digesting the quotes and living by them?

You also have a quote in your signature by Tolkien. ???

I do like the academics carrying libraries in their heads. One must become like a feather. Nice!

#364

[QUOTE=lotusgirl;38434]@High Wolf

Who is to say that Yulaw, Oak333 and I will include SD, are not digesting the quotes and living by them?

You also have a quote in your signature by Tolkien. ???

I do like the academics carrying libraries in their heads. One must become like a feather. Nice![/QUOTE]

I don’t say otherwise either, but make a distinction, suggestion. I see enough people around me reading newspapers and magazines, and saying I found
"the quote of my life," but it is only temporary on the basis of consumption. No change is really made, nothing is fulfilled and life passes on like that. That’s why quotations can be dangerous for many.

Perhaps everyone here is a very good eater, and I am inclined to the notion that we all are digesting here in this forum :stuck_out_tongue:

Yeah I have that quote, and that’s a very helpful one. Reminds me to work on my prejudging nature. And that’s one that I have digested. It has become one with me, there’s neither Tolkien, nor me in that quote any more. But I simply acknowledge its source by writing it.

I think there should be a “quotation thread” or sth like that for this sort of discussions.

#365

I do think most everyone here on the forums are digesting and good eaters too!

I understand the distinction you are trying to make. Sometimes, we are just not able to articulate a thought or point, so a quote fills the gap. That doesn’t mean the person doesn’t believe and live up to the quote.

#366

[QUOTE=High Wolf;38429]There you go, the fallacy of language once again. It’s very difficult to be understood in this age >.>

Yes, history is important, and I didn’t say otherwise. But you didn’t see what I mean. Human mind works cunningly, hence there is a danger. Let me explain more elaborately: Learning from history and carrying it with you is different, learning from history and digesting it is different. What I mean with the quoting thing is to point out this distinction. Some people really live by quotes and not even learn from them, because they’re addicted to them. They spend all their lives based upon other people’s judgments. Even tho’ it’s a master of Yoga or Zen, the guru is there for you till you reach the beach, where one’s own boat is waiting. One must take the boat and sail to the ocean, and discover their own as they travel.

If one is too attached to another’s discourse, there would be laziness. My approach is to “digest” the past, digest the discourse as you digest a very dense food, and leave it behind, not carry it along >.> Look at those poor academics, they carry libraries in their heads. So burdensome! One must become like a feather ^^[/QUOTE]

I understood what you were saying and what you are saying. I just think you worry about it too much, but then that is likely just me

#367

[QUOTE=High Wolf;38370]@oak333_ Actually, I suggest that in such thread like this, you should refrain using quotes from people who has nothing to do with spiritual practice. We all are entrapped in a fallacy of language anyway, and all of those people are DEAD. There’s a lot of people out there reading books and says “O that’s my quote of day” and next day crowns another quote from another source. Life passes like that with agreeing upon incomplete understandings. Instead of using quote… You are alive here and now, so don’t “you” have something to say? >.>

Back to the issue, hmm, I can see that many of you has made Surya a rival against your egos. I don’t think most of you listen what he says: Yoga is quintessentially a Hindu practice. This is the fact and I suggest you deal with it. But when it comes to your own Yoga practice, you may wish to dress it in any way you feel more comfortable. That will be your unique add to it, and that’s most necessary as well. However, you can at least acknowledge the source of Yoga.[/QUOTE]

Well, quotes, proverbs, adages are CONCENTRATED WISDOM, based on a long
experience. IMHO it is better to collect wisdom than…something else.

What shows if a quote was properly digested ? Its right application at the right time in the right place.

A quote by a great writer (Mark Twain), great philospher (Plato) etc has
everything to do with spiritual practice. They know human nature and in spiritual practice human nature plays an important role.

SD as a rival of our egos. Well, ego is the soul in its wrong identification with the body. SD wants to show that the only religion which is right is Hinduism.
Other religions, like Christianity and Islam, should be abolished, in his opinion.
This grandstanding, based on no credentials, did not affect our bodies and related egos. This grandstanding insulted our souls.

I have many more things to say but this is a yoga forum, where peace and harmony are supposed to exist.

#368

SD as a rival of our egos. Well, ego is the soul in its wrong identification with the body. SD wants to show that the only religion which is right is Hinduism.
Other religions, like Christianity and Islam, should be abolished, in his opinion.

There are good theories and bad theories. The problem is when people want to hold onto bad theories.

#369

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;38462]There are good theories and bad theories. The problem is when people want to hold onto bad theories.[/QUOTE]

I said it before and I’ll say it again…your cup is to full

#370

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;38462]There are good theories and bad theories. The problem is when people want to hold onto bad theories.[/QUOTE]

Precisely vague.

Still, better than to be precisely wrong.

#371

I have found an interesting story about a genuine Westerner seeker. She was in India for many years, looking for a guru.

Well, what she found did not look like genuine gurus. She met many of them.

http://www.lifepositive.com/Mind/personal-growth/personal-growth/guru.asp

It is hard to argue with the facts.

#372

There are genuine gurus and non-genuine gurus. Just as there are genuine and non-genuine humans in all areas of life.

I see religion as nothing more than just a theory. Some religions, like theories are good and some are bad. The Abrahamic religions are bad theories and the dharmic religions are good theories. In those Hinduism is obviously the best of the theories.

Hinduism is basically just pure research. Most of that research has been validated today by science and more is being validated. It is a religion that developed in a scientific civilisation, much like the religion that is developing today in our scientific civilisation. A religion based on actual empirical facts.

Abrahamic religions represent a primitive human culture, early speculations using mythology. They have little value today to be honest. They will definitely be gone by the end of the 21st century.

#373

How many Indians (from India) practise yoga ?

If I remember correctly, there are cca 20 million people practising yoga in America. My figure might be wrong, so please come up with the right figure, if you know it.

#374

Hello can I offer a different approach/solution perhaps to your discussion.

For many years I was a Christian, mother English, father a Sikh from Northern India. I was raised in a very English manner, I voluntarily went to a Christian church, attended all the celebrations etc. I knew nothing of Hinduism, a tiny amount about
Sikhism, nothing about Buddhism…,just Christianity.

When I was about 11, I was present in a conversation between my father and younger brother. My brother had just spent his 1st year at university, studying Theology.
My father asked him what had they covered during this 1st year?..he replied with…“oh all sorts, like did Jesus have a twin, hence the resurrection and some nonsense about the third eye”… My father was quick to reply, no no, the third eye is not nonsense and is mentioned in Hindu and Buddhist text etc…he then briefly explained how you open the third eye…I later thought, crikey, I didn’t know we had a third eye and went to bed to try and open this third eye…after trying a few times, following his simple instructions, I succeeded in opening the third eye and from there, have done many, many times. Phew…sorry its long
My great shock came when I started seeing Hindu/Buddhist sights!, not Christian!
I have pondered over why this was the case?
The conclusion I have come to is that the chakras, yoga and all, belong to the Hindus and Buddhists without any question in my mind.
The third eye practice gives it away. You will not see Christian, Islamic, Catholic or any of the leading religions imagery, therefore it has to belong to the originators…the Hindus. (Buddhism an extension of it)

EG…if you accidentally think of sex or any subtleties around it like flattery, whilst in a meditative third eye state, (I should point out this was before I mastered it properly) you will see the dancing girls mentioned by Master Buddha. the dancing girls on the Hindu temples clearly displayed.

If you find and awaken the inner guru inside you, you will see him in a traditional lotus pose, index finger to thumb, he then levitates into your third eye and sits there watching in the space where the bindi is painted and because you are highly intuitive with the third eye open, you know he is a Buddha, not a saint or Jesus or someone else.

You will notice, (if not now, eventually) I am not an expert in the details of Hinduism and Buddhism, I am a practitioner of the third eye Chakra and now follow my inner Guru and his directions, intuitively.
I would also add that I am practicing on the other chakras as well, especially the Heart Chakra which functions well with the Ajna chakra.

Does this help at all?

I welcome alternative opinions about this

Kind Regards Kareng

#375

I can offer an alternative. I would suggest that there never been any logical reason to even consider that Chakras are even a valid concept. I get so much joy, and happiness from putting my time and efforts into things I can be certain are actually real. Religion and spirituality do not fall into this category for me. I often see people in robes or a priest with their collar who dedicate their life to religion, and I wonder if they have ever taken the time to even truly and honestly question what it is they believe.

#376

[QUOTE=YogiAdam;38602]I can offer an alternative. I would suggest that there never been any logical reason to even consider that Chakras are even a valid concept. .[/QUOTE]

Chakras exist, but in the astral plane. As you probably know, there are:
the physical, astral, and spiritual planes (body, mind, spirit)

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8101989694941061600#

If you mean physical evidence, you have it too. A Russian scientist, Kirlian,
photographed the nadis (channels through which prana or vital force flows)
in high frequency electromagnetic fields. Since Kirlian, there were many other
confirmations.

These nadis actually closely correspond to the acupuncture channels. Ask
any practitioner of TCM (Traditional Chinese Medicine) and he will be able to confirm it with details.

#377

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;38537]There are genuine gurus and non-genuine gurus. Just as there are genuine and non-genuine humans in all areas of life.

[/QUOTE]

Basically this is right, in principle. There are genuine gurus and non-genuine gurus. The problem is in the detail: if the lady in her twenty years of seeking for a genuine guru in India

http://www.lifepositive.com/Mind/personal-growth/personal-growth/guru.asp

could not find one, just one genuine guru, how many “gurus” do we have to believe ? IMHO we have to be utterly prudent in believing such people.

Leaving the convoluted theories aside, I have a simple question: who are the real gurus in India today?

In another post of mine, I asked a simple question: how many Indians (from India) are yoga practioneers ? Just a number, not convoluted sterile answers.
I still have to find the answer to this question.

#378

I dont rely on an external Guru why do this when you have an inner one?

Kind Regards Kareng

#379

[QUOTE=kareng;38596]My great shock came when I started seeing Hindu/Buddhist sights!, not Christian!
I have pondered over why this was the case?
The conclusion I have come to is that the chakras, yoga and all, belong to the Hindus and Buddhists without any question in my mind.
The third eye practice gives it away. You will not see Christian, Islamic, Catholic or any of the leading religions imagery, therefore it has to belong to the originators…the Hindus. (Buddhism an extension of it)

EG…if you accidentally think of sex or any subtleties around it like flattery, whilst in a meditative third eye state, (I should point out this was before I mastered it properly) you will see the dancing girls mentioned by Master Buddha. the dancing girls on the Hindu temples clearly displayed.

If you find and awaken the inner guru inside you, you will see him in a traditional lotus pose, index finger to thumb, he then levitates into your third eye and sits there watching in the space where the bindi is painted and because you are highly intuitive with the third eye open, you know he is a Buddha, not a saint or Jesus or someone else.
[/QUOTE]

Hi Kareng,
Thanks for post. I like your direct descriptions. Since you are during your practice you experience so many images, I thought I will use the opportunity to ask you about one thing. Since I read about near death experiences and dependency of imagery on personal background (e.g. person with Jewish background experiencing judgement day) , I started to think how can we distinguish between the content of our imagination and “structures” existing independently. At the moment I have theory that we experience sort of archetypes which take form according to our background/imagination capabilities. So my question is: do you have criteria to separate creations of your imagination from more objective features of your visions? When you wrote about buddha in third eye, do you mean literally that there is such a structure or that there is something that we most likely would perceive as little buddha?

#380

[QUOTE=YogiAdam;38602]I can offer an alternative. I would suggest that there never been any logical reason to even consider that Chakras are even a valid concept. I get so much joy, and happiness from putting my time and efforts into things I can be certain are actually real. Religion and spirituality do not fall into this category for me. I often see people in robes or a priest with their collar who dedicate their life to religion, and I wonder if they have ever taken the time to even truly and honestly question what it is they believe.[/QUOTE]

How can you comment because you haven’t gone down this path have you? You are focusing on logic as an argument with someone who has practiced with the Chakras for 40 years, and whilst practicing, I have had and still have joy and happiness, productively participating in society.
I can party hard, (less now…got a bit too old) I am a mother, a wife, an advisor to troubled individuals, a teacher, and an entertainer. I also experience what is not seen by say yourself, the hidden dimensions of the universe accessible ONLY via the ajna chakra, I can hear conversations in real time without being present, I can warn of pending problems to friends and family, before they happen…and eventually I expect to hone in to see all my previous lives. I can see and visit many things using the ajna chakra…as a Buddhist, I restrain myself from playing around with the ajna chakra but it is tempting to do more with it however, this will not lead to enlightenment if I do. Progress using the ajna chakra is made by looking past what you see, what you see are markers as to your progress, looking past each one takes you closer to enlightenment. But when you develop this practice you develop powerful intuition, visual and audible, automatically, it is unavoidable. When you see Buddhists, sat for hours in meditation, what do you think they are experiencing? Do you think nothing is happening and they are just sat there, with nothing happening? No, they are highly active in the ajna chakra. Some have honed their abilities more than others, it varies. Some know whether you are telling the truth by simply reading your mind, so liars and charlatans cannot hang out with trained Buddhists.

Kind Regards Yogiadam