Kundalini and the Breathless State

Continue to be consumed? Why must you continually consume your life force Suhas Tambe?
kundalini is simply the reversal of the creative energy within the human being.

Worry about getting it to reverse in the first place! and more importantly increasing the strength of that reversal! for if you can accomplish that. you will be dragged into the silence.

The most dangerous part of kundalini. Is having a shadow. mentally and/or emotionally.
If you have not brought yourself to truth. if you have skeletons in your closet. secrets. etc. All the darkness. everything you shove deep down. will be brought up.
beyond this danger. ignorance. Mistaking one thing for another. is extremely dangerous.
for instance. mantak chias microcosmic orbit does not do anything natural. and if successfully practiced. you will burn yourself with an internal fire. this is nothing miraculous and is not kundalini. Many practices do not aim to reverse the creative energy. Now days we simply say every practice aids in reversing the creative energy.
But i have yet to meet one successful practitioner !!!
That is outside of an aghori who practices mantras. Yet i can not vouch for her testimony. Which leads me back to my previous statement.

Reverse the river.
I have quit smoking tobacco.
this will allow me to test a theory.
That concerns both the breathless state and the river.

How extra-ordinary (one in million can) or how naive. Some of the description that follows shows a phenomenal advance on the spiritual path and yet, one reads a score-card full of gross-level achievements the lure of which is generally left behind by such an advanced soul. A lot is useful information but difficult to separate it from the mundane.

Do you make it a habit of complementing and insulting people in the same sentence? Although my ego would like to buy into your one in a million figure, I doubt you’ve sampled millions of people and therefore are qualified to make that statement. And you don’t have to read my posts if you find them mundane.

It may help if the posters come up with their idea and experience of what is kundalini. To me it is a vital force that remains dormant and coiled up at the base of the spine. In this state it is static and stationary energy. Its awakening occurs when prana vayu is purified enough to kindle the force through a literal fusion of negative and positive charges. Once kindled, kundalini becomes a huge force of kinetic energy that rises up. That?s where the second challenge comes, for this rising super energy one needs the subtle nadis (channels) to be unclogged and ready to carry. The third challenge is an efficient use of this energy such that it will continue to be consumed.

Why would that help? I’ve read several books in the last few months and can come up with the same mundane explanation that you just gave. I never claimed that anything rose in me. Something turned on and I went breathless. The first week I could easily go breathless with pretty much any pranayama exercise. The second week after my experience I started noticing that I was going breathless just sitting in front of the computer reading. At first this only happened when I was in sitting in kechari, then I noticed it started happening all the time for example when I was walking around the city in kechari. As soon as I started walking up a hill (higher oxygen demand), my breath cycle (diaphragm) kicked in. By the third week, I noticed that I am breathless most of the day even when I am not practicing kechari. In the books that I’ve read (The free ones put out by Ennio Nemis, Motoyama theories of the chakras, and Satyananda kundalini tantra) they all say awaken the kundalini, then clear the nadis, sushumna, and chakras, then raise the kundalini)

Therefore, kindling of kundalini is advised only when the states of Samadhi and Sanyama have been mastered and are to be reached for a prolonged period. This will require sustenance without any external dependence and rising kundalini will ensure adequate deployment of the life-force to the vital organs.

The books that I have read advise differently, state samadhi comes after the awakening, and I highly respect the authors. Besides, here is where I’m at.

Descriptions like this some times appear as vanilla as brushing the teeth.

I have no idea what this sentence means.

But, each one of the pre-requisites of kundalini awakening is a result of several years of patient efforts. In the spiritual context, kundalini awakening as a skill independent of any purpose doesn?t make sense and is more likely make the process dangerous. A balanced narrative on these lines will help many seekers more than putting all the information in their laps and presenting wrong paths to follow.

I thought the purpose of this forum was to share knowledge and experiences. The first thing I would ask anyone if I read about this as opposed to experiencing it is what were you doing before you went breathless? At this point it is difficult for me to put any weight in your dangerous warning as you’ve already shown a penchant for hyperbole. And who are you to proclaim that the path I’m on is wrong? The God that I believe in wouldn’t hurt me for seeking him, has guided me with experiences to where I am, and I believe spiritually blesses me when I try to help other people. FWIW, you don’t come across as an advanced soul either. You come across as a guy that is trying to portray himself as an expert so he can peddle a book. I have no ulterior motive.

I have never felt so much bliss in my life and have no regrets. I walk around a busy street now and see god in everyone. It is a strange but very blissful feeling. While looking into the bright eyes of people that walk by, I feel as if everyone is ignorant and doesn’t understand that they are a rainbow beam of light stretching from their sahasrara to their muladhara wrapped in a body of maya. I don’t like the secretive nonsense that is going on in regards to this science. I should have learned about this over 20 years ago when I was in my early teens.

I now realize that my life hasn’t changed that much but my thought patterns have. My thoughts are no longer filled with my ego created life situation that needs a past and future to exist. My thoughts are coming in at a much slower rate and are mainly composed of sensory perception. This gives me the space and time to embrace, dance and play with the thoughts I find enjoyable which are composed of what is happening. I quickly drop anything that brings me discord. The reason for my bliss is I am spending far less time in my mind based reality and far more time embracing and enjoying what is.

To the person who sent me a private message requesting the technique I use to go breathless I’ve pretty much laid all my cards on the table. Prior to doing 3 rounds of exhales into Nas, Udd, Moo and the inhales into Sham, Kech, Moo; I did 120 talabyas, 5 rounds of anoloma velomas, a round of 100 breath of fire and maybe 5 ? 10 basic kriyas. I like using Norm Paulsen’s technique of imagining the chakras as colors (red, orange, yellow, green, blue and finally purple in ajna) as you inhale and exhale the breath up and down the spine. I tried Lahiri’s mantra Om namo bhagavate vasudevaya and I like using colors more.

I believe Kechari is the key to everything. As far as achieving kechari quicker, I cut my tongue with a razor on a daily basis until I see a small amount of blood. This feels like you cut yourself shaving and so the pain is already over before you even feel it. I am not squeamish about this because I believe this small piece of skin is preventing me from a greater understanding of what I am. I am restraining myself from what I really want to do which is cut through the whole thing. I feel I am practicing caution and will do this slowly over the next few months. I hold the first part of Talabya while in front of the mirror which easily shows you where to cut for the maximum benefit. The area is white and calloused from the hundreds of Talabya I do on a daily basis. If you are still unclear after this explanation, do a search for Ennio Nemis and you will find his kriya yoga info site that will allow you to download his free books. He has a great diagram of Talabya on page 82 of his second free kriya book.

The peculoar thing is we are not so different after all.

If you would get enlightened in 1 day it is because your past karmas its not like a lottery where some is lucky. Some people however do bad things and dont see the connection when bad hits them so they go on making bad things. Most of the people that are spiritual came to a point where they did not enjoy wordly things and they wanted to change maybe after suffering we are all walking the same path. Buddha was said to have had eons of lives before he got enlightened.

Thing is anyone have the chance to become enlightned but for this to happen some steps needs to be taken and by doing good deeds.

What you did in previos incarnation you reap in this lifetime. So its not like anyone become enligthened by chance in 1 day. Even of we were bad this we can change completely by doing good deeds anyone can change their life to the better even if they dont believe it at the moment, some grade of awareness and signs will be there. Actually we all should strive for doing good things as this is only what makes longlasting happiness.

[QUOTE=Xtensity;78451]Well who really knows.

The only thing I know for sure is that anything is possible in Yoga/Spiritual Practice.

Someone could become enlightened in a day, a week, or it may take them multiple life times. Everyone is different. Anything is possible.[/QUOTE]

Umunhum,

On the forum, words is all that speak, personalities are mostly hidden behind the annonymity of assumed names. The poster writes because he/she wants to communicate to someone from whom a response is intended, even eagerly awaited.

My words are obviously my opinion, and I said so. I don’t sit in judgement nor even intend to insult anyone. You would know this from my posts if you were here long enough.

Each one of us respond on the strength of the respective spiritual experience and abhyasa, and ironically the same is its limitation. I have immensely benefitted from this forum from very insightful posts, but even more from the posts conflicting with “truth” that I hold. So, I am genuinely impressed by some parts of your inaugural post; but equally surprised by some other parts that were not congruent therewith. I stated this conflict. If that is not completely true, along with my limitation in understanding there is something amiss in the narrative as well. Though there are many paths to spiritual goals, the milestones and the signposts are common. And that was the context of my post.

Insult is your perception. Thanks.

xtensity i am agree with your thinking that kundalini can be managed without samadhi.

even i believe and i practice and even i had given many lessons to deciples for the same as kundalini will lead to samadhi. by the force of kundalini one can attain samadhi but if the samadhi is fir st step and then kundalini can awakened then what is the use of samadhi

ex. elevator is used to reach to top of the building then only elevator is important but if you reach to top of the building and then elevator is of no use except coming down.
kundalini is the force that works as a elevator and leads a jiva to the shiva to attain samadhi

but the most important thing is that you must control or you must have some one who can control kundalini if it arise very speedly, or uncontrolled manner.

[QUOTE=Xtensity;78479]fakeyogis,

Are you speaking out of faith in a memorized Dogma or out of your own attained Enlightenment?[/QUOTE]

Im speaking out of some experience yes but no im not enlightened to answer your question.

[QUOTE=Suhas Tambe;78489]Umunhum,

On the forum, words is all that speak, personalities are mostly hidden behind the annonymity of assumed names. The poster writes because he/she wants to communicate to someone from whom a response is intended, even eagerly awaited.

My words are obviously my opinion, and I said so. I don’t sit in judgement nor even intend to insult anyone. You would know this from my posts if you were here long enough.

Each one of us respond on the strength of the respective spiritual experience and abhyasa, and ironically the same is its limitation. I have immensely benefitted from this forum from very insightful posts, but even more from the posts conflicting with “truth” that I hold. So, I am genuinely impressed by some parts of your inaugural post; but equally surprised by some other parts that were not congruent therewith. I stated this conflict. If that is not completely true, along with my limitation in understanding there is something amiss in the narrative as well. Though there are many paths to spiritual goals, the milestones and the signposts are common. And that was the context of my post.

Insult is your perception. Thanks.[/QUOTE]

Give me a break! When you wrote that I’m one in a million or naive, what you are really saying is that I’m a miracle or I don’t know what I’m talking about. And since miracles are extremely rare, it is far more probable that I am a fool. Yet some of my explanations imply truth, experience and knowledge and so I truly am a conundrum. Well I don’t believe that there is anything spiritually unique about me at all and I certainly know what I experienced, so there must be another possibility.

What I had was a physiological experience. I found a key that was left behind by Satyananda, put the key in the engine, and turned it. And lo and behold, something turned on. The religious component of this equation happened when I was created and in some respects, how I was guided. The truths I hold definitely conflict with the truths you hold. The truths that I hold come from direct experience and not ?book knowledge.? And apparently, I don’t fit into your cookie cutter world.

Haven’t you found in your life that the simplest explanation, the most logical explanation is usually the right one? Have you ever considered that you might not be the expert that you think you are? That there are many ways to turn on your kundalini and reach the breathless state and you have no knowledge of them? And just because you have no knowledge of something, doesn’t mean it is the wrong path? Of course accepting the above would be quite a blow to the ego wouldn’t it? Especially for someone with so much knowledge about yoga that they wrote a book about it.

I have pretty good reading comprehension skills and completely disagree with you about the context of your post. I didn’t get a ?there are many paths? type of vibe from you. I got a you don’t make sense, your dangerous, and your presenting the wrong path type of vibe from you. So now not only do I think you are incompetent, you are disingenuous as well. And I’ve only been around long enough to read two of your posts. Believe me when I say that I’m not eagerly awaiting your next post. I’ve found that I no longer have any tolerance for incompetence. Whenever somebody is lying to me or talking nonsense, I immediately call them on it. You can reread my second post for an example of this.

Now I’ve read all about that what one finds intolerable in others is a reflection of those qualities in themselves. You strike me as a know it all pompous ass. And so according to this theory, that means I am one too. But believe me when I say I approach yoga with a ?I know nothing except what I have experienced? attitude. That the knowledge I have can fill a thimble and the knowledge I don’t know could fill the ocean. That said I have a thirst for the truth and spend my free time practicing and reading everything that I can get my hands on. And I try to limit my reading material to people that I think are spiritual masters.

You don’t have that approach and in my opinion, you would do well to try to achieve it! I think that you are intelligent enough to know that everything I just wrote is true. My purpose on this board is to try to get a better understanding of what I’m experiencing and what I need to do to reach my spiritual goals. I didn’t come here to make fantastical claims and then provide little or no useful information to the reader which seems to be the modus operandi of some posters. And so of course I’m going to post my methodology in the hope that other people can benefit from my experience.

If you want to continue to converse with me, your going to have to be more forthright. This subject matter is far too important to involve our egos. Good luck on your path. I truly wish you health, happiness, success, and most importantly God Consciousness!

@Umunhum It is okay, really it is.

I appreciate your sharing a very deep and personal experience and so do allot of others who will never comment, it’s ok let people say what they will it does not make it true or valid no matter how they cloak their sneering words.

@Suhas Tambe I would advise you practice nicer conversation skills unless hurting your book sales is your goal.

I have yet to practise khechari.

I must ask. During your pranayama. Does your body experiance a sensation like that of tingling on the skin?

Why don’t you practice kechari? As I’ve stated before, I believe that kechari is the key to everything. When your kechari stage one has progressed enough that you can seal off the back of your throat, you can go breathless and shut off the mind. I have written extensively on how I achieved this. At this stage of progress, meditation then becomes much easier and deeper but the senses will still disturb you.

I have read and heard that when you get to stage 2, you shut off the senses and go into your spine. Your meditations will then go to a much deeper level. Seeker has provided some testimonial evidence of this. Another aspect of this is the mound of nerves at the top of your nasal septum is similar to that of a clitoris. I have read that these nerves become progressively more sensitive with time. When your tongue reaches these nerves, you feel an electrical sensation that gives the yogi a state of bliss. I have been blessed with many intimate experiences with the split tailed variety of our species. And they all received a great deal of pleasure when I stimulated their nerve endings with my tongue.

Upon reaching stage 3 of kechari, you will then be able to internally practice nadi shodhana with the tip of your tongue all day long. Instead of externally using your fingers which makes the practice more cumbersome. This will do the remaining work of cleaning out your nadis, sushumna, and chakras. At the same time, I imagine that you will be experiencing a great deal of bliss. This is what Satyananda had to say about Nadi Shodhana:

Nadi shodhana pranayama is a concentration of ions, or pranic energy, occurs around ida and pingala nadis, increasing in intensity according to the number of rounds practised. In normal breathing this does not happen. With continued practice of alternate nostril breathing, over a long period of time, this concentration is harmonised and sushumna awakens.

Stage 4 of kechari allows the tongue to stimulate both the pituitary and pineal gland and the result is the secretion of amrit, ambrosia, DMT, natural ayahuasca, or whatever else you want to call it. I have read this sends the yogi into a state of ecstasy.

Now again, I have only direct knowledge of sealing the back of the throat, shutting off the mind and meditating in the breathless state. I have read that there is no need for faith or belief in anything. That all you have to do is do your practice and all is coming. That said, most of what I just wrote is not truth to me but beliefs. Do you now have a better understanding of why I believe kechari is the key to everything? That said, who cares what I think, believe or experience? It will only become truth to you when you experiences it.

As far as tingling of the skin, I really haven’t paid that much attention. When I do pranayama, I am focused on my diaphragm, the various mudras or bandhas that I am performing, taking the breath up and down my sushumna or the various chakras that I’m focusing on. When I meditate, my senses come alive and that is why I know that they are the impediment after you quiet the mind. Keep in mind that I always practice on my balcony which overlooks the ocean and so I get a lot of positive sensory pleasure. This includes a nice ocean breeze some of the time but I don’t think that is what your question is referring to when you ask about tingling.

[QUOTE=Xtensity;78496]You’re speaking out of experience on what it takes to become enlightened yet you are not enlightened?

Did you read those ideas out of a book? Was it the same book that wrongly said you had to awaken your Kundalini to reach Samadhi? I don’t mean to insult you but I would be careful about throwing facts around that you’ve read in Yoga books that were written by potentially unaccredited people who could possible be doing so just for the money.

I have read many books on Yoga and Meditation that where filled with utter BS that completely came into conflict with my personal experiences and lead me to believe that the writer did not have as much experience as they say they do.[/QUOTE]

I dont know what book you read but the old scriptures have some profound teachings.

Before you slander people are you actually reading or is your ego making a judging and then you slander? Did i not say i read about kundalini and samadhi and did i not say then they must have lied? So i was open to that it could be a lie.

It is quite easy though to figure out what is needed for enlightenment yoga and buddhism is talking about this and it is described , maybe you missed it, what yoga and buddhism is about?

But to achieve this is harder to manage.

Almost every saint have said that we should help others and so on. Jesus buddha etc. You should read the old books instead of the new beloning to those fake you must have came across according to your post. But reading them will not make you enlightened but practice what it says will take you closer. IT is all written if you have eyes to see.

If you would have come to a point where you understand all your actions will return to you, you would also come to this conclusion. This is some experience. If you experience some of what is written in the old scriptures ,then you can pretty much assume that much of the other thing is true as well with some discernment. But if you never experienced it of course how can you believe.

But this slandering actually shows more about who you are than about me. And im not going slander you back as i would be the same then.

Think of what you got out of slandering me, if you feel content? If you do it is your ego that feels superior that it won the battle and then you know what to work on. The ego is one of the obstacles in spiritual progress. This i have read only for your information. your most welcome to continue your slandering if you want to , but if i do not accept it, it means it stays with you.
In either way i wish you the best.

I have not removed the web under the tongue. I cannot do stage two. I can only place it on the soft palate. " which i normally do".

I will work towards removing it quickly. I am extremely curious what kechari and my pranayama will result in. My pranayama leads to breathlessness due to de-carbonation of the blood.
That is why i asked you about tingling. when you sneeze, the “chill” people feel, the sensation on the skin, that is the tingling i refer do. that “chill” is actually De-carbonation happening in a split second. De-carbonation done purposefully results in the whole body having this feeling. If continued long enough, the sensation starts to subside and is replaced by a sensation of magnetism.

Bliss. is magnificent. And is a variation of this same feeling. at least the electrical/tingling bliss that rushes through like waves.

It sounds like Kechari is a key.
But dont take the human body as a simple door.
For some doors have one lock and thus one key.
An important door has many locks and thus many keys.
Or find yourself a master key :stuck_out_tongue: :slight_smile:

In my limited view, our further conversation is unnecessary. Its your thread and your right to like or not like a post. Our conversation is adding no value to anybody and is a complete diversion.

You have made a lot of assumptions about who I am and my incompetence etc. Fair enough. This is a forum.

I tried to re-read my post several times after your reaction. I still believe my remarks were about the narrative and not the person or the experience. That’s why I ended with a need for a “balanced narrative”. Likewise, it was unfortunate to split the “vanilla” statement from the next sentence where I mentioned the rigors. The two belong together to convey that what appears simple from the narrative is actually very advanced. Hence, my last concern that the apparent simplicity may “present” wrong paths.

I also looked up the word “naive” in the dictionary. Here are 2 of 5 quotes: “having or showing an excessively simple and trusting view of the world and human nature, often as a result of youth and inexperience” and
"admirably straightforward and uncomplicated or refreshingly innocent and unaffected". Does it sound insulting?

You may re-read it, or find no need for it. Please tell me if you see any thing differently. If not, your take on this is already known.

PS: Seeking, thanks for the advice. Never knew the two things connect.

[QUOTE=Avatar186;78521]I have not removed the web under the tongue. I cannot do stage two. I can only place it on the soft palate. " which i normally do".

I will work towards removing it quickly. I am extremely curious what kechari and my pranayama will result in. My pranayama leads to breathlessness due to de-carbonation of the blood.
That is why i asked you about tingling. when you sneeze, the “chill” people feel, the sensation on the skin, that is the tingling I refer do. that “chill” is actually De-carbonation happening in a split second. De-carbonation done purposefully results in the whole body having this feeling. If continued long enough, the sensation starts to subside and is replaced by a sensation of magnetism.

Bliss. is magnificent. And is a variation of this same feeling. at least the electrical/tingling bliss that rushes through like waves.

It sounds like Kechari is a key.
But dont take the human body as a simple door.
For some doors have one lock and thus one key.
An important door has many locks and thus many keys.
Or find yourself a master key :stuck_out_tongue: :)[/QUOTE]

When you say you intend to remove it immediatly and you have no idea what may follow?

As someone who has achieved kechari I can say it was doable without cutting, Imhunum here had a medical condition of being tongue tied, as such he may never have achieved kechari and deemed it valuable enough to make the cuts a little at a time.

Might I suggest just practicing Talabia as Ennio describes it in his book? it does work and if you are unhappy with it you can always cut later.

Kechari might also be very different for you as well, I am just now getting used to it for me it has involved allot of changes. Some of which had very unpleasant side effects.

By the way those feelings you describe can become magnified quit a bit they can also turn into extreme heat and make you feel like you have a sun burn on the inside.

Just be careful it’s your life of course but that does not need said it sounds like you are doing good why rush?

Ah. I am cautious when practicing. I realize some practices can have adverse effects.
Both microcosmic orbit and spinal breathing i will not practice. Personal preference.
De-carbonizing the blood has its own qualities one must deal with.

The tingly feeling i describe has two sides. As the sun so the moon.
The moon cools the body. The tingling is not one of sensitivity but one of numbness.
This is De-carbonation.

Carbonation. The increase causes the body to heat up. The skin to flush red. The tingling is more sensitive. Like that felt while you leg is asleep “pins and needles”

Of corse i heed your warning. I am a firm believer that one extreme can lead to its opposite. So cold that its hot. So hot that its cool. Balance is tricky.
Dangerous.

I rush because my path is not a path. Their is a goal. The path begins when the conditions to walk it have been met. =]

The reply is appreciated greatly ! I look forward to more :slight_smile:

OH! Apologies i forgot a question.

I intend to remove it quickly as i can within my means.
I have no idea what will follow.
As the Particular Pranayama i do is powerful. Kechari sounds to be very powerful as well. SO! How one will effect the other i am Curious.

Ps. I have tried to discuss my particular pranayama practice on here before hand.
It dosnt seems to rouse much discussion. As well i have posted a separate thread in motive to rouse discussion.

[QUOTE=Avatar186;78527]OH! Apologies i forgot a question.

I intend to remove it quickly as i can within my means.
I have no idea what will follow.
As the Particular Pranayama i do is powerful. Kechari sounds to be very powerful as well. SO! How one will effect the other i am Curious.

Ps. I have tried to discuss my particular pranayama practice on here before hand.
It dosnt seems to rouse much discussion. As well i have posted a separate thread in motive to rouse discussion.[/QUOTE]

What is for you. One final word though in my thread on kechari a person did post they had there’s removed by a Doctor and still could not achieve Kechari you might want to look at that post and contact that person for more information before going ahead with a permenant alteration.

I do not know one way or the other if you might loose some nerves needed for really effective Kechari but I am way too cautious to take that chance of course I did not have to just my good fortune I guess.

Okay through being a know it all, just be careful. I really hope it works out well for you.

Please do describe your pranayama I would like to read of it here please.

I will most likley snip the tendon slowishly.
As well.
Pranayama~Hyperventilation~Decarbonation
That is the title for the thread. It is under the spirit path section of this forum. I just started it. I only put a general amount of information. Am waiting for the ball to start rollin.
:slight_smile:

[QUOTE=Suhas Tambe;78522]
You have made a lot of assumptions about who I am [/QUOTE]

View things from my perspective for a minute. I have only read 4 books on yoga. I have read several more books on the asanas that said they were about yoga but weren’t. The 4 books I read were Ennio’s free book 1 and 2, Motoyama’s Theories of the Chakras, Norman Paulsen’s Sacred Science and Satyananda’s Kundalini Tantra. Ennio and Paulson are both followers of Yogananda, Paulsen being a direct disciple.

Both Motoyama and Satyananda were disciples of Sivananda and have a lot of commonality in their teachings. They both say first turn on your kundalini (which resides in the muladhara chakra). This sends more prana up the spine which then allows you to efficiently clear your nadis, sushumna, and chakras. Then raise your kundalini. Motoyama says turning on your kundalini takes about a year. So I start practicing various breathing techniques found in all these books and turn my kundalini on and describe how I did it on this site. In Ennio’s and Satyananda’s books they both say mixing the apana with prana by the practice of Uddiyana awakens the kundalini. Motoyama gives the mudras, bandhas, and some pranayama techniques but says you should go to the school in India for the more advanced breathing techniques.

You have a message that shows up every time you post that says you are the author of making of a yoga master. So I think that you should have a good understanding of the various techniques that I practiced and their effects on the body. And so it should come as no surprise to you that I turned my kundalini on. Instead you start challenging my credibility and things that I’ve experienced. Then you make statements that challenge the teachings of the masters that I have studied.

How would you react if you were me?

And this is not a reflection of you, but this is not the first resource I turned to when I started seeking advice. I talked to a yoga instructor that teaches other yoga instructors at a retreat center. The Bio states that she didn’t know what yoga was until she met her Guru. Her linage came from Sivananda. Yoga to me means union. The union of the soul with God Consciousness. Anahata to Sahasrara. Physically it means opening up some blockage so the electricity can flow. To make a long story short, I asked her how far advanced was her kechari. She said that she wasn’t ready to practice kechari. I then asked her how could she go breathless then. She said huh? That’s dangerous what you do. You could get brain damage.

Then I dropped by Yogananda’s SRF in Los Gatos California and spoke to the nicest guy you could ever meet. He was a director and had been there 13 years. When I asked him about the breathless state he started talking about his experience of breathlessness when sense went in. And I said that I haven’t reached kechari stage 2 yet. He looked at me puzzled and said he doesn’t practice kechari. And with my experience with my yoga instructor in mind, I said to him “then you can’t go breathless anytime you want.” No, he said, he has to have a really good meditation that happened only a few times. Why don’t you practice kechari and you can do it all the time? And he said that he has his Guru and that is all he needs. I still have pain in my stomach when I reflect about him. Here was the nicest guy in the world that wouldn’t do something so easy that would magnify his practice’s effectiveness, bliss, and ease multiple times.

The breathless state shuts off your mind so you can meditate effortlessly! Why fight your mind?

It’s great to have Bhakti but you have to approach your body like an engineer. The reason we breathe is because the outgoing breath stimulates the nerves on the roof of our mouth. Sealing off the back of the throat with your tongue is far easier than slowing down the breath by not moving and trying to still the mind. Then we have to contend with what feels like cilia type tissue that moves back and forth like falling dominoes in our diaphragm stimulating us to breathe. The stronger the muscle of the diaphragm, or the better in shape it is, the quicker the cilia tissue will stop vibrating when you stretch it back and forth from Uddiyana Bandha to an upright pose. I believe Breath of Fire and Maha Mudra are really important to strengthen and tone the diaphragm. And definitely pay attention to the time on your Kumbhakas (pauses between the breath). Satyananda’s kriyas take your mind off the breath by having you do cycles of concentration on different chakras. Paulsen has you do 3 moos (mula bandha) between the pauses of both inhales and exhales. Sometimes I do 5 / 10 (before inhale / before exhale), sometimes I do 10 / 20, sometimes I do none.

Discussion of ideas is greater than discussion of persons.

Discuss things impersonally. Discuss the personal in an impersonal manner.

Even the bhakti is scientific minded :wink: and the best scientists have great passion. But to be absorbed into one or the other wholly leaves you either wild with no head or as a dead tree void of spirit.
but that is just my personal opinion and my way of addressing a situation impersonally. =]