[QUOTE=Nietzsche;48005]Alright then. Deny one of the hallmarks of Chinese culture…its ethnocentrism. Believe what you will.[/QUOTE]
So, Chinese are guilty of Sinocentrism? Are you dense? EVERYONE tends towards ethnocentrism, it’s the human condition. Of all members here, you and SD are the most overtly guilty of it, what with your plotting for Hindutva global domination… :rolleyes:
Nietzsche,
I am really impressed with your knowledge on Chinese history. I have not read much of Chinese history myself, although I am sure it is very fascinating. China has also had a great civilisation. I am somewhat familiar with Chinese philosophy because I had to read on it for my global philosophy module, and it is interesting to note that a majority of Chinese philosophy is political philosophy and geared towards social homogenity where the citizen and the state are intertwined. Hence the Chinese attitude of the citizen being “China” This contributes to the great unity, patriotism and cohesion we see in Chinese society, but also contributes to the great intolerance of individual thought and expression. My professor confirmed how hard it was to mark the essays of Chinese students(from mainland China) because their cultural upbringing had not taught them how to think critically, especially when it came to political matters. However, this has partially to do with fear. As Chinese students in Western countries are monitored by the government on what they say and do - I was shocked when I heard this, but I do not doubt it because it was confirmed by my professor.
The older philosophy of China was Taoism which has many affinities with Yoga and there is no doubt that Yoga influenced Taoism and this would be hardly surprising as India and China are geographical neighbours. The extent of influence of India on China is obviously massive, otherwise China would not have become Buddhist. It was confirmed by a Chinese official that China had a massive cultural debt to India. The words he used himself were “India dominated China without sending a single troop” In any case Taoism was ultimately overruled by the emergence of Confucianism and Mohism, which wanted to do away with the mysticism and supernatural parts of Taoism(gods, astrology, rituals), to replace it with a rational and practical religion for China which is based on cultivating virtuous and good people. The lively philosophical debate that ensued was whether human nature was intrinsically good or bad. The consesus reached was that human nature is intrinsically bad, but it had to be made good through discipline. This discipline had to be imposed on the human by the state to make sure they behave morally. In the service of that ideal a belief in divinity is OK, so as long as it makes people behave morally.
The Mohists believed that everybody should equally love one another, against the relationalism of Confuscius who believed that love was relative and prescribed by the social relationships. For example a mother would love her son more than she loves the son of a monther. The clear problem here is how can you love a stranger equally as you love your own family. The Mohist solution was to do away with notion of individual families and to consider the entire society as your family - in other words expanding your sense of self to include all of China. Everybody is China. In order to instrument this an overrarching authority is required to impose this ideal on others and make them conform to it.
It is not surprising, therefore, why China adopted communism so easily. It was an easy fit into Chinese culture and thought. Nor is it surprising how incidents like Tianman square happened, and Chinese people barely batted an eye lid against it. From the Chinese perspective, the students protesting were against China, because they were asserting their individuality. There is no such thing as individuality in Chinese culture. If you are born in China you are China.
[QUOTE=Surya Deva;48016]Nietzsche,
I am really impressed with your knowledge on Chinese history. I have not read much of Chinese history myself, although I am sure it is very fascinating. China has also had a great civilisation. I am somewhat familiar with Chinese philosophy because I had to read on it for my global philosophy module, and it is interesting to note that a majority of Chinese philosophy is political philosophy and geared towards social homogenity where the citizen and the state are intertwined. Hence the Chinese attitude of the citizen being “China” This contributes to the great unity, patriotism and cohesion we see in Chinese society, but also contributes to the great intolerance of individual thought and expression. My professor confirmed how hard it was to mark the essays of Chinese students(from mainland China) because their cultural upbringing had not taught them how to think critically, especially when it came to political matters. However, this has partially to do with fear. As Chinese students in Western countries are monitored by the government on what they say and do - I was shocked when I heard this, but I do not doubt it because it was confirmed by my professor.[/QUOTE]
Most of what I have learned of Chinese history comes from me taking Advanced Placement World History. The main focuses of the course were the Chinese, Roman, and European civilizations (no surprise).
Yes, it is indeed the case. In fact, in the course, we were handed several primary documents of Confucian parables and writings to read. Confucian teaching affirms that it is in the individual from which the building blocks of the state emerges. In fact, Sun Yat Sen was totally correct when he said that China had long had democratic principles from which the society ran by. But for some reason, our history teacher, normally very critical of the West and its Eurocentrism, mocked that statement in his speech (which was handed to us for our reading), causing the whole class to laugh. I was the only one not laughing and was actually angered at yet another example of Westerners denying the rich heritage of one of the greatest civilizations to ever exist.
I particularly like the Confucian philosophy on the family and the ruler. Confucian philosophy says the the functions of the state are mirrored in the family (with the father being the head of the family, and etc). The ruler should be a “gentlemen,” a person from which the people he rules can gain inspiration from. The ruler should spend part of his time in introspection, in order to ameliorate himself so he can rule better. Once this basic structure breaks down however, society will inevitably collapse.
However, there are two main flaws in Confucian philosophy. It expounds the subservient state of women in Chinese society. I even read this excerpt from a primary document written by a female Confucian philosopher, in which she laid down guidelines for her brethren. They were indeed very strict and by modern Western standards, insulting. Then again, we must not forget that we cannot look at everything through Western secular lenses. Such doctrines worked in that particular society with little problems. The majority of women in Chinese society, took pride in their “li,” their function in society, just as most women in Islam take pride in wearing a burqa. The other, and most fatal flaw, is that Confucian philosophy is highly idealistic. It theoretically should work but in practice, it hardly happened.
As you can see, the Confucian philosophy, the philosophy that was used by the ruling “class” to rule following the Zhou Dynasty (with the exception of the Qin Dynasty, since Shi Huangdi suppressed most philosophies he felt were subversive to the function of the state) created an even more cohesive and unified society, at least in terms of a national identity. This facet of Chinese society was already established beginning from the Shang Dynasty, which was created around 2000 B.C.E. The greatest achievement of the Shang Dynasty in my opinion was the creation of the Mandate of the Heaven. It stated that a leader must rule wisely and justly and provide for his people. If he violates this rule from Heaven, then society collapses (meaning the people have a right to rebel against him, like in Lockian philosophy), and so begins the Dynastic cycle of harmony (a great leader) eventually emerging from chaos (bad leaders and societal disorder). From then on, the Chinese Dynasties ruled by this basic principle in mind, which, among other things, aided in the acculturation of the various peoples living in the area we know as China.
However, all this is, regretfully, highly idealistic. When it comes down to the nuts and bolts, the poor remained poor, the literate remained literate, and the rich, remained so. It was just one of those instances where theoretically, things were allowed but in practice, largely unable to be attained in a majority of cases. Even the Chinese Civil Service exam, which was created by the Han Dynasty as a method of selecting bureaucrats to run the state, was such that it allowed anyone to take it. However, it was the wealthy that could afford to prepare for it and succeed in the end.
As you said SD, this unified identity has its drawbacks. When combined with China’s long history of isolation, it can create a dangerous sense of superiority over all other peoples and arrogance. I remember this beautiful Chinese painting in our history book in which it shows a man on horseback, arriving in China bearing Sanskrit texts. But after a while, they even began to scorn India, which gave them the philosophy and practices which dominated their society for millennia. They also scorned the Japanese, the Koreans, the Europeans, and so forth. They called the Japanese simpletons who burrowed from their culture (their writing for example) and ate with their hands. Same story with the Koreans. They restricted the Portuguese and later Europeans to trading in Canton. Most of the time, the European nations would buy Chinese products in mass amounts, like porcelain, tea, and silk, and the Chinese would refuse to accept any of the barbarian’s goods, with the exception of silver. It is no surprise that the British, after a good century or two of increasing trade deficit, became fed up and started growing opium…= Opium Wars.
Nevertheless, China has a rich history and heritage. In certain cases, I wish that India would have developed along the same lines as China, especially in terms of its unity and political ideology. Our diversity, which Indians foolishly take pride in, is literally killing us.
And you said you didn’t know much about Chinese history and culture. See what you can accomplish by just a 5 minute Internet search? You can even convince yourself that you actually know what the fuck you’re on about.
by. But for some reason, our history teacher, normally very critical of the West and its Eurocentrism, mocked that statement in his speech (which was handed to us for our reading), causing the whole class to laugh. I was the only one angered at yet another example of Westerners denying the rich heritage of one of the greatest civilizations to ever exist.
I faced exactly the same prejudice. You and are very alike and seem to have reacted the same. I was both famous and infamous amongst my fellow students for challenging my eurocentric professor, who would always teach that only the Greeks did philosophy and every other philosophical tradition is not really philosophy, but religion or mysticism(a PC way of saying they are nonsense) He thought I was very Greek because I was a critical thinker. I reacted with similar anger against these false statements, often educating him and the class about Indian philosophy. I too was appalled at the neglect of Indian philosophy, culture and history. I think it is the project for the current generations of Indians to correct this.
Hindus need to rise again and make sure the the world feels their presence. We were at one stage the teachers for humanity and we should take that position again. Not out of any sense of retribution or misplaced feelings of racial superiority. There is no such thing as race, were all the same humanity. The reason we should be the teachers is because we are the most enlightened civilisation on this planet. The contributions we have made in science, technology, philosophy and religion are staggering. Even today we are coming back to the top in the knowledge area. However, unfortunately, we are doing it on Western terms and not Indian terms. Eventually, Indians will need to start to Indianizing the world. The West has had its day and even people in the West think it is time we have a change. It was the opinion of great Western intellectuals like Will Durant last century which had a Western beginning, will have to have an Indian ending if there is any hope for the betterment of humanity. Schopenhauer opined similarly.
Well, before we can do it on Indian terms, we will have do it on Chinese terms. 
On the Chinese, I forgot to add something.
Most of the peoples and nations they have scorned ended up conquering them.
Japanese - Conquering of large portions of Eastern China and the Rape of Nanjing
Europeans - Do I really need to mention this?
Mongols/nomadic tribes north of China which were pushed back for centuries - Yeah…Not only did they conquer all of China, but almost all of Asia and the Eastern portions of Europe.
Manchus - They conquered China and created the last dynasty of China, the Qing Dynasty, before Sun Yat Sen overthrew them in 1914.
[QUOTE=Nietzsche;48005]You aren’t a Taoist? Oh. And actually, I was sincere. I have already stated multiple times I respect all other faiths with the exception of Christianity and Islam. I don’t see how you could translate my hatred for Christianity and Islam into a hatred for all other religions and cultures with the exception of my own. Threads on those other religions are not even prevalent in this section. And in the threads that are about other religions/beliefs, I always either compliment the religion/belief or do not post in it. Believe what you will though.
Alright then. Deny one of the hallmarks of Chinese culture…its ethnocentrism. Believe what you will.[/QUOTE]
Oh I don’t know…could be the racist comments you made about the Chinese 
And nope, I am not a Taoist… would you like me to tell you that a 3rd time
I never denied (Chinese ethnocentrism) any such thing… nice try at getting out of your original wrong statement though since it does show you have no clue about Chinese history… I said your historical view of the Shang Dynasty was wrong and even gave you examples of where the issue you are talking about comes from
So… you’re wrong again, but this time you were hoping I would not notice
And assuming you are not SD, don’t look to him for help on Chinese history, he knows nothing about it as well
So now how about answering my question… So Mr. Chinese Historian…how good is you Mandarin?
[QUOTE=Yulaw;48117]Oh I don’t know…could be the racist comments you made about the Chinese
And nope, I am not a Taoist… would you like me to tell you that a 3rd time
I never denied (Chinese ethnocentrism) any such thing… nice try at getting out of your original wrong statement though since it does show you have no clue about Chinese history… I said your historical view of the Shang Dynasty was wrong and even gave you examples of where the issue you are talking about comes from
So… you’re wrong again, but this time you were hoping I would not notice
So now how about answering my question… So Mr. Chinese Historian…how good is you Mandarin?[/QUOTE]
More like the truth on what most Chinese, who don’t live in the Western world, believe. It is quite similar to the way many Christians, deep down, scorn other religions, peoples, and cultures.
No thanks. Then what are you?
Uhm…ok? I really don’t see what you’re talking about. It is a historical fact that Chinese ethnocentrism began from the Shang Dynasty. Where were these examples you gave? I didn’t see them anywhere.
I have no idea what you are saying. It is a historical fact and I wasn’t trying to cover anything up.
I do not speak Mandarin. But if speaking the main language of the country whose history you wish to discuss is a requirement, I would encourage you to not cite articles containing anti-Hindu propaganda until you have learned Hindi or Sanskrit and studied Indian history from an Indian viewpoint. Same goes for any of the other people on the forum who do the same thing.
EDIT: I thought about why you were talking about the Han Dynasty and now I understand. It seems there was a miscommunication between the terms “Chinese” and “Han Chinese.” I forgot the Chinese had a different view on what they call themselves. Nevertheless, I was referring to the tendency of the Shang Dynasty, the first one in China (unless if you count the Xia) to call those people not of their civilization “barbarians.” They called themselves “civilized” and their referred to their region as “civilized” and any outside of their culture and region were considered “uncivilized.” It is a historical fact that they considered themselves and their culture superior to those around them. = Ethnocentrism.
Besides, you should know that although most Chinese identify themselves as Han Chinese, it is not out of a genetic or linguistic relation but out of pride for the achievements and strength of the Han Dynasty, as I said before. And since there was a strong and unified national identity by then, there was no problem in adopting the name (which if I remember correctly from my history course, bore resemblance to what the Chinese called themselves prior to this). It is kind of like the case with word “American.” Anyway, I will understand if you dispute this since its a matter of cultural context.
[QUOTE=Nietzsche;48118]More like the truth on what most Chinese, who don’t live in the Western world, believe. It is quite similar to Christians who, deep down, scorn other religions, peoples, and cultures.
No thanks. Then what are you?
Uhm…ok? I really don’t see what you’re talking about. It is a historical fact that Chinese ethnocentrism began from the Shang Dynasty. Where were these examples you gave? I didn’t see them anywhere.
I have no idea what you are saying. It is a historical fact and I wasn’t trying to cover anything up.
I do not speak Mandarin. But if speaking the main language of the country whose history you wish to speak of is a requirement, I would encourage you to not cite articles containing anti-Hindu propaganda until you have learned Hindi or Sanskrit and studied Indian history from an Indian viewpoint. Same goes for any of the other people on the forum who do much the same thing.[/QUOTE]
What am I?
Human
My intention was not, as previously stated when you last accused me of this, to spread Hindu propaganda (I can tell you this a third time too if you like ), the link I posted, was one of many that was in reference to witch burning in multiple cultures, t was not directed at Hinduism. You just chose to use it as such and ignored all other links I posted and if you had not ignored them you would have seen that… but then you would have no ammo for your baseless accusations then would you. I can only take that as you could not defend your position unless you made me look like a racist, that or you simply do not understand what I posted. Either way, you failed again… you need to face facts here and stop using groundless accusations in order to make you case by attempting to make others look bad.
Do you know Hindi and Sanskrit? Are you fluent?
Also I am not claiming any in depth knowledge of Indian (not Hindu) history like you are by referencing the Shang Dynasty. Do you even know when the Shang Dynasty was in existence? Do you know without a web search or looking it up where it falls in the long line of Chinese dynasties? Do you have any idea what the traditional belief is about dynasties and how it effects China today, without looking it up?
As for Chinese history if you do not speak mandarin and do not read it, you don’t really know it much of it is not translated into simplified Chinese little alone English. You can get a pretty good view of it if you study it in college but then again they are also going to teach you mandarin and how to read it. Your example of Shang is wrong that is all, I gave you the points to look at but you are so stuck in your path you cannot admit you are wrong and look to the proper examples that I provided… quite sad actually.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAA :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
EDIT: I thought about why you were talking about the Han Dynasty and now I understand. It seems there was a miscommunication between the terms “Chinese” and “Han Chinese.” I forgot the Chinese had a different view on what they call themselves. Nevertheless, I was referring to the tendency of the Shang Dynasty, the first one in China (unless if you count the Xia) to call those people not of their civilization “barbarians.” They called themselves “civilized” and their referred to their region as “civilized” and any outside of their culture and region were considered “uncivilized.” It is a historical fact that they considered themselves and their culture superior to those around them. = Ethnocentrism…
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA part II
you & your little friends are such stinking hypocrites it’s not even funny anymore.
[QUOTE=Nietzsche;48118]More like the truth on what most Chinese, who don’t live in the Western world, believe. It is quite similar to the way many Christians, deep down, scorn other religions, peoples, and cultures.
No thanks. Then what are you?
Uhm…ok? I really don’t see what you’re talking about. It is a historical fact that Chinese ethnocentrism began from the Shang Dynasty. Where were these examples you gave? I didn’t see them anywhere.
I have no idea what you are saying. It is a historical fact and I wasn’t trying to cover anything up.
I do not speak Mandarin. But if speaking the main language of the country whose history you wish to discuss is a requirement, I would encourage you to not cite articles containing anti-Hindu propaganda until you have learned Hindi or Sanskrit and studied Indian history from an Indian viewpoint. Same goes for any of the other people on the forum who do the same thing.
EDIT: I thought about why you were talking about the Han Dynasty and now I understand. It seems there was a miscommunication between the terms “Chinese” and “Han Chinese.” I forgot the Chinese had a different view on what they call themselves. Nevertheless, I was referring to the tendency of the Shang Dynasty, the first one in China (unless if you count the Xia) to call those people not of their civilization “barbarians.” They called themselves “civilized” and their referred to their region as “civilized” and any outside of their culture and region were considered “uncivilized.” It is a historical fact that they considered themselves and their culture superior to those around them. = Ethnocentrism.
Besides, you should know that although most Chinese identify themselves as Han Chinese, it is not out of a genetic or linguistic relation but out of pride for the achievements and strength of the Han Dynasty, as I said before. And since there was a strong and unified national identity by then, there was no problem in adopting the name (which if I remember correctly from my history course, bore resemblance to what the Chinese called themselves prior to this). It is kind of like the case with word “American.” Anyway, I will understand if you dispute this since its a matter of cultural context.[/QUOTE]
What am I?
Human
My intention was not, as previously stated when you last accused me of this, to spread Hindu propaganda (I can tell you this a third time too if you like ), the link I posted, was one of many that was in reference to witch burning in multiple cultures, t was not directed at Hinduism. You just chose to use it as such and ignored all other links I posted and if you had not ignored them you would have seen that… but then you would have no ammo for your baseless accusations then would you. I can only take that as you could not defend your position unless you made me look like a racist, that or you simply do not understand what I posted. Either way, you failed again… you need to face facts here and stop using groundless accusations in order to make you case by attempting to make others look bad.
Do you know Hindi and Sanskrit? Are you fluent?
Also I am not claiming any in depth knowledge of Indian (not Hindu) history like you are by referencing the Shang Dynasty. Do you even know when the Shang Dynasty was in existence? Do you know without a web search or looking it up where it falls in the long line of Chinese dynasties? Do you have any idea what the traditional belief is about dynasties and how it effects China today, without looking it up?
As for Chinese history if you do not speak mandarin and do not read it, you don’t really know it much of it is not translated into simplified Chinese little alone English. You can get a pretty good view of it if you study it in college but then again they are also going to teach you mandarin and how to read it. Your example of Shang is wrong that is all, I gave you the points to look at but you are so stuck in your path you cannot admit you are wrong and look to the proper examples that I provided… quite sad actually.
[QUOTE=Yulaw;48121]What am I?
Human
My intention was not, as previously stated when you last accused me of this, to spread Hindu propaganda (I can tell you this a third time too if you like ), the link I posted, was one of many that was in reference to witch burning in multiple cultures, t was not directed at Hinduism. You just chose to use it as such and ignored all other links I posted and if you had not ignored them you would have seen that… but then you would have no ammo for your baseless accusations then would you. I can only take that as you could not defend your position unless you made me look like a racist, that or you simply do not understand what I posted. Either way, you failed again… you need to face facts here and stop using groundless accusations in order to make you case by attempting to make others look bad.
Do you know Hindi and Sanskrit? Are you fluent?
Also I am not claiming any in depth knowledge of Indian (not Hindu) history like you are by referencing the Shang Dynasty. Do you even know when the Shang Dynasty was in existence? Do you know without a web search or looking it up where it falls in the long line of Chinese dynasties? Do you have any idea what the traditional belief is about dynasties and how it effects China today, without looking it up?
As for Chinese history if you do not speak mandarin and do not read it, you don’t really know it much of it is not translated into simplified Chinese little alone English. You can get a pretty good view of it if you study it in college but then again they are also going to teach you mandarin and how to read it. Your example of Shang is wrong that is all, I gave you the points to look at but you are so stuck in your path you cannot admit you are wrong and look to the proper examples that I provided… quite sad actually.[/QUOTE]
Ok, then why was the named hyperlink entitled something like “200 witches burned in [B]India[/B]?” Fine, the link itself may have contained something else, but after seeing the kind of links other members have posted, why would I have believed this was different? Why did you choose to name it that way if it was talking about “witch” burning in various cultures? Heat of the moment? Too bad, that isn’t an excuse for coming of as biased against Hindus/Hinduism.
I speak Hindi, which is partially derived from Sanskrit but has many words from Arabic and Persian. I am not fluent in it, but I can speak it well enough that I can understand idioms and cultural contexts. I cannot read or write it anymore. My parents fault you see.
As I said before, I took a college level World history course last year. AP World History, if you will. And if you except me to remember any specific dates after going through that torturous exam and after I threw away my 3" history binder in mock celebration of the end of the course…but to answer your question, on the top of my head, I remember it being somewhere around the first half of the 2nd millennium B.C.E. And from what I learned, the Shang Dynasty was the first dynasty, but the Chin Dynasty was the first imperial one. And since I love Ancient history, I actually did do research back at that time (meaning when I was in the course) and I saw mention of a dynasty called the Xia which apparently predated the Shang, according to Chinese myths.
Following the Shang was the Zhou. Warring states period after that…and honestly, the next thing I remember is the Chin dynasty. Correct me if I am wrong. The next major dynasty that we were taught about was the Han (which I remember was from around 3rd century B.C.E to the 3rd century C.E). Then followed some key dynasty I do not remember the name of (some 2 or three letter word), but it was fairly important in doing something to unify the people. Then I remember the Tang and the Song, in that order. Then the Yuan (Mongol). Then the Ming. Then the Qing.
I edited my previous post on the matter regarding the Shang Dynasty.
By the way, you double posted. :o
Regarding the Mandarin and Chinese history issue…one of my best friends is Chinese. We would also get into groups together in order to complete our notes for the class faster. He confirmed everything that we learned in our class as historically accurate with respect to Chinese cultural contexts. He is fluent in Mandarin. His mother taught Mandarin in another high school within the district.
However, he was also prideful of Chinese history. I remember him laughing at the lack of content on Indian history one time. “There is nothing on Indian history. Look at the Indus Valley Civilization! What the hell happened there? And look at the Shang Dynasty! Far superior!” Then I gave him a good piece of my mind and taught him about Eurocentrism, AIT, and so forth. Fortunately, he learned.
Sorry about the double link, I had a system problem
Now the links were
200 ‘witches’ killed in India each year – report
I did not say 200 witches burned by Hindus now did I… or could it be that I am wrong in thinking that100% of the people in India are not Hindu. And after re-reading the article you are calling anit-hindu propaganda I am hard pressed to find a single word “Hindu” in it other than the source which is “The Hindu" which I understand is
The Hindu is an Indian English-language daily newspaper published since 1878. With a circulation of 1.46 million, The Hindu is the second-largest circulated daily English newspaper in India after Times of India, and slightly ahead of The Economic Times. According to the Indian Readership Survey (IRS) 2010 The Hindu is the third most-widely read English newspaper in India (after Times of India and Hindustan Times) with a readership of 21.59 lakhs. It has its largest base of circulation in South India, especially Tamil Nadu. Headquartered at Chennai (formerly called Madras), The Hindu was published weekly when it was launched in 1878, and started publishing daily in 1889.
I was not aware it was sprading… as you called it
articles containing anti-Hindu propaganda
The next link
A Brief History of Witchcraft Persecutions before Salem
Which is decidedly not Hindu
Witch-hunt (not just for Christians anymore)
Which covers several cultures
A Chinese friend… okie dokie
I have friends too, lots of them from China and Taiwan, two of them are Chinese historians from China.
And I studied Chinese history as well
3 Sovereigns and 5 Emperors
Xia Dynasty 2100–1600 BC
Shang Dynasty 1600–1046 BC
Zhou Dynasty 1045–256 BC
Qin Dynasty 221 BC–206 B
And the only people calling Xia mythical are outside of China. In China they are fairly certain it was real
[QUOTE=Yulaw;48129]Sorry about the double link, I had a system problem
Now the links were
I did not say 200 witches burned by Hindus now did I… or could it be that I am wrong in thinking that100% of the people in India are not Hindu. And after re-reading the article you are calling anit-hindu propaganda I am hard pressed to find a single word “Hindu” in it other than the source which is “The Hindu" which I understand is
I was not aware it was sprading… as you called it
The next link
Which is decidedly not Hindu
Which covers several cultures
A Chinese friend… okie dokie
I have friends too, lots of them from China and Taiwan, two of them are Chinese historians from China.
And I studied Chinese history as well
3 Sovereigns and 5 Emperors
Xia Dynasty 2100–1600 BC
Shang Dynasty 1600–1046 BC
Zhou Dynasty 1045–256 BC
Qin Dynasty 221 BC–206 B
And the only people calling Xia mythical are outside of China. In China they are fairly certain it was real[/QUOTE]
Yes, but when you post such a named hyperlink directly in response to SD’s post on something about Hinduism/Abrahamic religions, what do you expect me to believe, especially when others have posted similar things in response to SD’s posts?
Thanks for the info on the newspaper. Now let me tell you something about such Indian newspapers, since you haven’t lived in India. They are run by biased secularists who denounce Hinduism left and right. And I saw how the description says its largest circulation is in Tamil Nadu. You see, that state is run by anti-Hindu ex-untouchables and Tamil nationalists who believe in the discredited AIT (and think that North Indians have long oppressed their peoples). Many there have sentiments against Hindus and Hinduism. That is not to say that the majority of people there aren’t Hindus. It is just that many Hindus there have convoluted and biased views on Hinduism. In fact, many of my Tamil friends here are Brahmans who escaped persecution there.
And you see, there was once this India newspaper (a very popular and highly circulated one like the one you quoted from) which stated something like “half of India lives on less than a few cents.” Of course, sensible people like me did not believe such drivel. Those secular idiots must have taken an SRS of some nearby slums and calculated the sample mean and used that as an estimate of the population mean. And I think it was later found out that the newspaper had incorrect data.
Alright then.
Same here Yulaw. The one I mentioned however, is one of my closest friends.
I see. What do the Chinese records say about the Xia? Their culture, practices, and etc? I do not always like how Westerners discredit legends and myths like that. They have to have some factual basis you know. Besides, ancient legends and myths are far too fascinating.
And I once heard a few of my Chinese friends talking about the 5 Emperors and 3 Sovereigns before. What are they about? I never saw it in the textbooks we used (no surprise) and I would rather learn from you than from Wikipedia.
[QUOTE=Nietzsche;48130]Yes, but when you post such a named hyperlink directly in response to SD’s post on something about Hinduism and Abrahamic religions, what do you expect me to believe, especially when others have posted similar things in response to SD’s posts?
Thanks for the info on the newspaper. Now let me tell you something about such Indian newspapers, since you haven’t lived in India. They are run by biased secularists who denounce Hinduism left and right. And I saw how the description says its largest circulation is in Tamil Nadu. You see, that state is run by anti-Hindu ex-untouchables and Tamil nationalists who believe in the discredited AIT (and think that North Indians have long oppressed their peoples). Many there have sentiments against Hindus and Hinduism. That is not to say that the majority of people there aren’t Hindus. It is just that many Hindus there have convoluted and biased views on Hinduism. In fact, many of my Tamil friends are Brahmans who escaped persecution there.
Alright then.
Same here Yulaw. The one I mentioned however, is one of my closest friends.
I see. What do the Chinese records say about the Xia? Their culture, practices, and etc?[/QUOTE]
Actually only expect someone to click on the link and read it and not give a knee jerk reaction to it before spouting accusations and label others before they actually read it. And if after reading it explain why they feel the source is not a good one before said accusations and labeling begins
I did not know that about that paper, thanks for the info.
As for the rest I do not believe they really know a whole lot, it is mostly based on archeological findings. And for the record, go back 20 years and western historians were calling Shang mythical as well while Chinese historians were not.
I’ve wasted enough time here today… bye
[QUOTE=Yulaw;48132]Actually only expect someone to click on the link and read it and not give a knee jerk reaction to it before spouting accusations and label others before they actually read it. And if after reading it explain why they feel the source is not a good one before said accusations and labeling begins
I did not know that about that paper, thanks for the info.
As for the rest I do not believe they really know a whole lot, it is mostly based on archeological findings. And for the record, go back 20 years and western historians were calling Shang mythical as well while Chinese historians were not.
I’ve wasted enough time here today… bye[/QUOTE]
As for the link issue, you do have a point. It was wrong of me to judge. Then again, it is always good to be cautious, especially when many of the people on this forum have the biases SD and I have shown them to have.
Sigh*. Such is the benefit of having developed a written system long before anyone else. The Chinese can be confident about their history.
Unfortunately for us Indians, the upper castes prevented the introduction of writing for quiet a while, fearing the corruption of orally handed down traditions. More harm than good has come from that. We had Westerners write our histories for us to the point where no Indian knows what to believe anymore. We too have legends and myths regarding ancient kingdoms and events, as you know. Unfortunately for us, the climate of India ensures that much archeological evidence doesn’t remain around for too long.
Goodbye. Be safe. I will call MS helpdesk when I have a problem with my computer.
Edit: Wait, I was looking into the archaeological history of the Shang Dynasty. They actually knew it was real since the early 20th century.
[QUOTE=Nietzsche;48134]As for the link issue, you do have a point. It was wrong of me to judge. Then again, it is always good to be cautious, especially when many of the people on this forum have the biases SD and I have shown them to have.
Sigh*. Such is the benefit of having developed a written system long before anyone else. The Chinese can be confident about their history. [/quote]
Yeah, those Chinese sure have been smart for quite some time huh?
Unfortunately for us Indians, the upper castes prevented the introduction of writing for quiet a while, fearing the corruption of orally handed down traditions. More harm than good has come from that.
Oh, what equality India has enjoyed for thousands of years, so much so that practically no one could read, the workers were kept in illiterate ignorance by your elitist ancestors for so long… how else would a truly enlightened culture conduct itself? :lol::lol::lol:
We had Westerners write our histories for us to the point where no Indian knows what to believe anymore. We too have legends and myths regarding ancient kingdoms and events, as you know. Unfortunately for us, the climate of India ensures that much archeological evidence doesn’t remain around for too long…
How much better for you brown supremacists, now you can make things up as you go along & practice all the revisionist history you like. Oh wait, you already do that. All the time.