The Eternal Way

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#81

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34175]I do get it

I have emboldened the operative word. You must first reintegrate i.e., go through a process, a churning, a transformation before you can reach self-realization.

Prior to that you cannot claim to be god. If you go around claiming you are god at this point you will be challenged and you will fail. It would be like me going around claiming I am the the strongest man in the world, and then looking like a right tool when I fail to bench press even 100lb :D[/QUOTE]

nope. You still don’t get it, and it’s like the core of your religion - which I know so well.

Self Realization and God Realization are distinct but closely related.

Goodness Gracious will the whoopings ever cease? I routinely whoop you up and down this forum seventy ways to sunday.

Now you just ignore my Gnosis . . . Sad this makes me…

#82

Self-realization is God realization

Atman = Brahman

:smiley:

#83

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34434]Self-realization is God realization

Atman = Brahman

:D[/QUOTE]

Wrong again.

I can see how this notion could be misconstrued by the learned.

Hence all your babel about “I am God.” “Can’t wait till I’m God.” “It will be really sweet once I’m God.”

and so on…

#84

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34434]Self-realization is God realization

Atman = Brahman

:D[/QUOTE]
and if you know this then why are you planning on going to learn from a master?

#85

Not wrong.

This is the most well established doctrine of Hinduism: Atman = Brahman: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ok8qO9-uws

#86

[QUOTE=Brother Neil;34436]and if you know this then why are you planning on going to learn from a master?[/QUOTE]

There is no way to self-realization without the grace of the Guru.

#87

little jiva = atman

If you are using the term Brahman to denote the Almighty Awesome, this little jiva (me) is not Brahman.

Your confused.

Self Realization is not God Realization. Once can Realize God and not realize thier self (seer, purusha, jivatman). Or conversely they can Realize thier self, see thier true face as it is said and not Realize the Almighty.

I will say this . . . like attracts like.

Please check with me before posting anymore of your innane blithering…

Oh how do I whoop thee? Let me count the ways…

Also Guru can take many forms. Guru can be a principle of the almighty awesome. Guru can be the Teachings. Guru can be an embodied being. Guru can be hangin out in a subtle realm and contact you through signs in the prakriti and so on, or telepathically.

#88

No you nitwit :smiley:

The Jiva is not the Atman. The Jiva is the living spark.

The Atman is the Self and it is identical with the cosmos, Brahman.

There is no god separate from the Self in Hinduism. This is a very well established doctrine of Hinduism.

Are you Hindu by the way?

#89

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34438]There is no way to self-realization without the grace of the Guru.[/QUOTE]
to know this you must be self realized, yes?

#90

Nope, this is a well established tenet of Hinduism.

You will get nowhere without a guru.

The guru shows us the way.

#91

so then you are not realized?

#92

did the first self realized person have a guru?

#93

a yogi without a guru? Maharishi?

"At age 16, he heard somebody mention “Arunachala.” Although he didn’t know what the word meant (it’s the name of a holy hill associated with the god Shiva) he became greatly excited. At about the same time he came across a copy of Sekkilar’s Periyapuranam, a book that describes the lives of Shaivite saints, and became fascinated by it. In the middle of 1896, at age 16, he was suddenly overcome by the feeling that he was about to die. He lay down on the floor, made his body stiff, and held his breath. “My body is dead now,” he said to himself, “but I am still alive.” In a flood of spiritual awareness he realized he was spirit, not his body.
His Guru

Ramana Maharshi didn’t have a human guru (other than himself). He often said that his guru was Arunachala, a holy mountain in South India."
from http://www.realization.org/page/topics/ramana.htm

#94

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34447]No you nitwit :smiley:

The Jiva is not the Atman. The Jiva is the living spark.

The Atman is the Self and it is identical with the cosmos, Brahman.

There is no god separate from the Self in Hinduism. This is a very well established doctrine of Hinduism.

Are you Hindu by the way?[/QUOTE]

The self I’m referrring to is that which is me. Residing in my body, in my heart. Pure consciousness would be somewhat adequate in words. So really, when you get on down to it. I’m in my heart.

When I speak of self realization. This is what you realize. You see your real self. This is selfrealization. My true nature is like light. As is yours, as is every other self encased in a mayic body.

God Realization isn’t the same thing. Sorry. This little tiny spark of light that is me isn’t the totatlity, nor the creator, or destroyer or sustainer of this universe. I didn’t dream up the first human bodies, or the animals, or insects, or the sun, or the moon, and so on. I don’t spew forth prana.

I didn’t create this whole remarkable thing. Nor did you. Creation is the business of God. I’m just a player.

Like I said; I could see how one could come to this erroneous conclusion. As you have . . . with all your “I am God.” and all this… and by looking at the hindu scriptures. All of which are not totally perfect. and especially when translated.

The Lord is distinct. Thats not to say that one can’t be in yoga with him, for they can. Obviously…

I guess you could have considered me a hindu about 130 years ago.

I’m not big on labels though.

I will be going off to do the yoga for a while. You should do the same.

#95

That is because he had a guru in his past lives. He himself believed he did:

Sri Ramana never talked about his previous lives, although he did concede once that he must have had a Guru in some other life. I personally feel that he completed all his spiritual work in some other body and arrived in his final birth in a state of such utter purity and readiness that enlightenment came to him virtually unasked while he was still in his teens.

Everybody needs a guru to reach enlightenment.

#96

Ah, so you have chosen to hold onto this god belief :smiley: Fair enough, you will grow out of it eventually.

There is no proof for god outside of humans remember that. As for the universe we don’t need a god to explain it can all be explained by nature.

In Hinduism there is no god. There is only Self.

#97

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34460]Ah, so you have chosen to hold onto this god belief :smiley: Fair enough, you will grow out of it eventually.

There is no proof for god outside of humans remember that. As for the universe we don’t need a god to explain it can all be explained by nature.

In Hinduism there is no god. There is only Self.[/QUOTE]

It’s not a belief. I’ve seen aspects of it. I’ve been swimming around in it. I’ve been in union with it. Face to Face. so to speak… and it wasn’t little ol me.

Distinct.

Thats how I know your wrong and You don’t understand your religion.

#98

You haven’t. You’ve had some experiences in meditation, which you have wanted to call god.

#99

ehhhhhhh

#100

Hmmmm