Fun article… especialy for the south http://www.cbn.com/health/fitness/bagby_yoga-alternative.aspx
interesting…but the most hindus i know have no idea what yoga is and hoe to do it:))
Hmmm. It is a touchy subject.
A few points here:
- Yoga has originated during the Stone Age Shamanism.
The oldest civilization ever discovered was in South Africa, cca 200,000 years ago.
Cca 75,000 years ago, these people migrated to Midlle East, Europe, India, China, and
even Australia. The scientists even replicated the travel by see, in primitive rafts,
from Asia to Australia.
All what I wrote above is strictly based on scientific evidence, even presented
on TV documentaries. - I really do not get how an Asana can be an offering to a Hindu God. Just think of
same asanas. If I were a Hindu God I will feel rather offended by a devotee showing
his posterior to me. - Yoga is NOT a religion. That has been amply stated by great Indian gurus.
On the other hand, there is a clear attempt to introduce Hinduism through the back
door of yoga. I could see heavy insults adressed to Jesus Christ, even on this forum
(Religion). He was named “a flawed cult leader” Mother Theresa was downright insulted
because she was a Christian. Mother Theresa did a lot of good to India. If you want to see bigotry, go and read the Religion sections. Christians are badly persecuted in India.
There are lots of videos about it.
I am not in a postion to give advice but, in my opinion, it is good to practice yoga but to be alert to Hinduism back door. Eg at my meditation center they invite people to take a trip to India, to attend Kumbha Mela etc. I am Christian, but nobody has ever invited me
to see Israel, the country of Jesus. Why should I visit India, the country of my guru ?
Why travel to India to study ? To deepen your practice that said there many advanced yogis in n.y.c. And the west coast to study with without leaving the country imho
Cheers … Quiet your mind yoga comes in time to those with a daily mindful practice imho
In the us this is how it works when some try to sell stuff.
Dont buy supplement that is not pure they dont test it you can get impure of inferior product be aware of all scammers you cant trust them , then as you read longer down it says, hey you can buy the pure and highest quality here , just click the link. 100% guaranteed.
Christians is persecuted over the whole world where they are in minority.
This would be funny if it weren’t so sad.
If you go to the PraiseMoves site you find that what she is selling is in fact asana.
It’s bad enough that the woman has failed to do any research into what yoga is/is not but she is using it (asana that is) in a re-branded form to peddle to those more credulous and ignorant than herself. Unbelievable.
It is incorrect to base one’s opinions on second-hand information or borrowed opinions. Exceptions are always newsworthy and news in circulation acquires false authenticity. India and Hinduism do have their share of extreme behavior as much as any religion or community has. Dwelling on that to compulsively generalize is idle thinking, if not plain wrong.
Hinduism has such a rich and divergent collage of ideas and approaches that sometimes it looks like an evolving school of thought rather than a ritualistic variation of Shamanism or an institutionalized religion. Among the scholarly disputes, the oldest time ascribed to yoga practice is 10 to 12,000 years in the past. Not just its antiquity, but a closer look at the then philosophy and its ability for verbatim practice today, tells us that yoga is not religion. But, its early endorsement from Hinduism also makes it intertwined with it. Being annoyed by this fact, any efforts to deny or delink this connection shows poor understanding of both yoga and Hinduism. Taking one religion as superior to any other is by itself irrational and any programs based on such proposition will appeal to like-minded minority, but will not make them any wiser.
We are naturally inclined to believe that humanity has been one single phenomenon that evolved uniformly across communities and linearly across millennia in terms of intelligence. Even more silly impression is that the world was always divided as it is today - wealth, smartness and resources in the West and poverty, dull-head and paucity in the East. It appears to be an undisputable fact that people who practiced yoga were lesser human beings because they were ancient and couldn’t and didn’t have the modern accessories of living. We forget that the truth about life as told by the Christ and the Buddha was several centuries back in the history. The one percent of Vedic knowledge that survived the environmental catastrophe several thousands of years, demonstrates phenomenal understanding of the world and unfathomable technical knowledge in the domains of modern day sciences. But in the minds of a few the sheer antiquity dwarfs any alleged greatness.
To ignore to investigate the above and wonder what subtle faculties the then stalwarts possessed and to concern ourselves with the few instances of wrong-doing shows a bad choice. When one insists on wearing dark glasses, a cross looks like ?two logs of wood? or ?millions of gods? looks like an act of an undeveloped mind depending on one?s position.
I am a Hindu by birth in India and growing up there for early 30 years. Some posts (like on this thread) make me sad. But they also provide greater insight into the human psyche. The last 15 years in yoga have taught me how & why there is no reason for me to defend anything. I cannot change the history but learning from it is my privilege and opportunity.
I have a fundamental conviction that the founding principles of all religions are alike, that they are based on peace, truth and co-existence, that one inherits or adapts to a religion and that it need not be by rejecting others; that my religion is my personal choice for governing myself just as laws are needed to govern a nation and finally, all my beliefs-reactions-behavior has to be aligned with a larger interest of the humanity and the Universe. This was not my invention but this has been my cultural milieu imbibed by Hindus, Christians, Muslims and many more that I didn?t ever felt were any different from each other. This has been the mainstream Hinduism. Mother Teressa has been our hero for her miraculous work and we revered the wisdom of Jesus so much that he was among many gods that we worshipped. This is mainstream Hinduism.
The quoted article has such poverty of truth and richness of a personal agenda that it is really funny, provided the reader has a healthy mind. Some posts here and in other threads show otherwise.
Well said Suhas.
Much of the article made me laugh as it was just so absurd. All of it made me sad. Sad enough that I wrote to her asking where she got her information. As expected, I’ve yet to receive a response.
We can’t make people be responsible, but we can hold them responsible.
What do we gain by holding people responsible? Everywhere there are people behaving like this, if we make it our mission to hold them responsible soon these bad energies enters us as well as depleting us. The more we fight it the more we will see it, one is destined to fail.
Ignore them and dont let it affect you, why invite turmoil when we can stay cool.
No energy lost if there is no anger behind it.
Holding them responsible is for me, doing what I did. I wrote to her. Short. Sweet. To the point. Presented facts and asked where she got hers. Hopefully, like minded people have done the same and thus giving her something to consider. Ultimately, how she handles it is up to her. But I did what I felt I needed to do. And now I move on.
Turmoil is on my ignore list anyway! 
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My opinion on this matter has slightly refined, especially as I have now realized something:
1: Yoga is Hindu(no surprises to anybody there)
2: Hinduism is not a religion
(1) It cannot be denied that Yoga is Hindu. Why? Most of the philosophy and practice of Yoga comes from Hinduism. All of the core and classical texts of Yoga which we widely reference today in modern Yoga are Patanjali’s Yoga Sutras and Hatha Yoga Pradapika, the former is the core text of a Hindu school of philosophy and is intimately tied with core Hindu scriptures, the Vedas, and the latter is one of the main texts of Tantra tradition, a major medieval Hindu tradition. It is also true, that many of the asanas are dedicated to Hindu gods/goddesses. The core aim of the the modern form of Yoga Hatha Yoga is based on the Tantra aim of awakening the Kundalini, which is the energy of the goddess.
The founder of the modern Hatha Yoga tradition is Krishnamacharya, a Hindu monk.
Thus Hinduism and Yoga are very much inseparable. Denying their inseparability is dishonesty.
(2) It may surprise people to know that the religion called “Hinduism” did not exist until 200 years ago. This religious category was created by the British. The word “Hindu” which was first used by the Arabic/Persian people did not refer to a religion ever, it referred to the nationality of the people in India and their way of life. The word “Hindu” is the Persian pronunciation of the word “Sindu” which is pronounced “Indus” in Greek, from which we get “Indian” Prior to the British creating this religion called “Hinduism” everybody in the world referred to Indians as “Hindus” In fact, the French still call Indians "Hindus"
Therefore, “Hinduism” is not a religion, but refers to the culture, way of life and philosophies of the Indian people. This way of life, culture and philosophy was shared by the vast majority of Indian people, and by all religions of India: Vaishnavism, Shiavism, Shaktism, Brahmanism.
So my point is, if you are Christian you can also share in or be inspired by Hinduism, which in fact is already being done by Father Thomas Keating. There is no reason to object that Yoga is Hinduism, because “Hinduism” is a culture and philosophy and not a religion. Just as one can remain Christian while following a philosophy of science or a philosophy of Marxism, one can remain Christian and follow a philosophy of Hinduism, Yoga etc.
very well said Suhas…
Reading the article made me sad cause I have never had a yoga teacher who promoted hinduism… at the end of the day, i feel the real meaning of yoga escaped anyone who writes or worries about such issues…
its best to keep calm and do yoga
I have a fundamental conviction that the founding principles of all religions are alike, that they are based on peace, truth and co-existence, that one inherits or adapts to a religion and that it need not be by rejecting others; that my religion is my personal choice for governing myself just as laws are needed to govern a nation and finally, all my beliefs-reactions-behavior has to be aligned with a larger interest of the humanity and the Universe. This was not my invention but this has been my cultural milieu imbibed by Hindus, Christians, Muslims and many more that I didn’t ever felt were any different from each other. This has been the mainstream Hinduism. Mother Teressa has been our hero for her miraculous work and we revered the wisdom of Jesus so much that he was among many gods that we worshipped. This is mainstream Hinduism.
Suhas, with all due respect to you, you are just being political correct here. Leftist liberals will lap it up, but not us center-rightists. All religions do not contain the same truths we must admit this and they are not all based on peace, love and understanding. Is Islam based on peace, love and understanding? One simply has to read the Quran and the Hadiths and look at the history of Islam to see that this is not true. Even look at contemporary Islam in Islamic countries like Afghanistan, Iran and Iraq and one can immediately see Islam is definitely no religion of peace, love and understanding. Why should we be politically correct to appease some moderate Muslims? Similarly, one can also look at the Judo-Christian history and read the bible to see the intolerance and genocide that pervades it. However, fortunately the Christian world today has become more civilized and no longer practices genocide, but it still very much behind the practice of subversion of other cultures through inciting secessionist movements in non-Christian world countries. In India for example, Christian organizations sponsored by Western Christian organizations such as the Churches in America, UK, Italy/Vatican are responsible for forming many separatist movements such as in North Eastern States like Nagaland and Southern states in Tamil Nadu. They spread anti-Hindu rhetoric and incite religious hatred.
The Abrahamic religions must be taken to task for the mayhem they have wrecked in history and even today. It is irresponsible to put them at parity with the genuinely peaceful and spiritual religions like the Dharmic religions, Hinduism, Buddhism and Jainism. Such parity is not earned, but conceded in the interests of political correctness.
Thanks, but respect is due to the fact that I am writing a very personal account of my bringing up and convictions. A forum like this, calls for individual opinions and one should have courage to confront diversity. (didn’t understand the ‘politically correct’ part)
To me, leftist-rightists, liberal-conservative are labels and of no value. I am a yoga practitioner first and last. My experience, understanding about the experience, understanding about understanding itself are my concerns. My views about Hinduism are born from personal experience and they may find an echo in some and not in others, both valid in their own ways.
As a yoga practitioner, I believe we should see more confluence than divergence and that has to be instinctive, not labored. Scholarly pursuits run the risk of divisive thinking without which no perception gets crystalized and no inference is canonized. And it takes one away from “yoking” that is central to yoga.
Second-hand references come loaded with a journalistic bias. And when we subscribe to a school of thought our thinking is fueled by selective perception. I would rather belong to a majority that is deficient in knowledge and indifferent to conditioned information, but quite alive with wisdom and at peace with oneself.
In the given context of this thread, sadness comes not so much from the twisted facts, but from lack of integrity & basic honesty that we owe to ourselves. Again, these are my thoughts to which I guess I am entitled.
I’m staying out of this one. I’m christian and my beliefs are grounded, however I do feel that there is a definite link between Hindu and yoga.
The person interviewed for the article has a very specific background AND is grossly misinformed (or underinformed). As such, the position she’s taken is the only one available to her and it suits the publication that sought out her opinion. And this is fine.
For anyone wanting a truly open discourse on the topic of Yoga and religion …
Here’s a chat between Gary Kraftsow, David Frawley, Stephanie Syman, and Brooke Boon …
A response to this very question by my teacher Aadil Palkhivala …
And an (http://www.yjevents.com/audio/YJGG07-IsYogaReligion.mp3) from the 2007 YJ conference with Rabbi Jeffrey Feinberg, Ali Niederkorn, Gary Kraftsow, and Aadil Palkhivala.
To me, leftist-rightists, liberal-conservative are labels and of no value. I am a yoga practitioner first and last. My experience, understanding about the experience, understanding about understanding itself are my concerns. My views about Hinduism are born from personal experience and they may find an echo in some and not in others, both valid in their own ways.
Well labels are obviously useful, that is why we create them. The political spectrum is useful to tell us where one lies in their political and economic ideas.
As a yoga practitioner, I believe we should see more confluence than divergence and that has to be instinctive, not labored. Scholarly pursuits run the risk of divisive thinking without which no perception gets crystalized and no inference is canonized. And it takes one away from “yoking” that is central to yoga.
Yes, but this confluence should be real and not imagined or just said to make people happy. There is little confluence between the Abrahamic religions and the Dharmic religions for instance, so lets not try to force a confluence between them. For starters Dharmic religions does not carry the blood of hundreds of millions of people on its hands, like the Abrahamic religions do. Dharmic religions do not condemn you to an eternity in hell for being a “non believer” like the Abrahamic religions do. Dharmic religions do not forbid freedom of religion, like the Abrahamic religions do.
Yes, but this confluence should be real and not imagined or just said to make people happy.
Dear Surya Deva, please be so kind to elaborate on the following:
In which category would the expression “Accept all religions are true” (swami vivekandanda) fall for you?
(source: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4Nmvbm4WYM @ 01:07)
- question #1: Was he being politically correct you think?
- question #2: Could you imagine yourself using this expression in certain situations?
(Just curious)
-
Yes, Swami Vivekananda’s speech’s were tailored to his audience. In speeches to his native audiences he was far more critical of Islam and Christianity. If he was as critical to his Western audience, he may not have got the reception and approval he received.
-
Yes, if I am talking to a Christian and Muslim friend about religion, it would be unwise of me to criticize their religion because that would produce conflict and resentment.
Surya Deva,
In your world-view everyone seems to be political and not genuine; crafty and not sincere. Is Ramakrishna Paramahansa (at least) an exception? He said this,
“God can be realized through all paths. All religions are true. The important thing is to reach the roof. You can reach it by stone stairs or by wooden stairs or by bamboo steps or by a rope. You can also climb up by a bamboo pole.”