Christianity And Reincarnation

Spirituality Religion
#61

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;36073]… but recent research has lead me to strongly question Jesus as a master

.[/QUOTE]

Does the “recent research” contain the incorruptible bodies of the Catholic saints ?

http://www.catholicapologetics.info/library/gallery/incorrupt/incorrupt.htm

Their bodies did not decompose for centuries.

Does the “recent research” include the “recent” Catholic saint Padre Pio, who has been acknowledged to have performed many true miracles ?

Probably I can go on and on and on with examples.

#62

There are saints in all traditions. This is because good souls can be born anywhere. This says more for themselves than it does for the religion they are born in.

Edit to add: I just reviewed the article. What a bunch of nonsense. Do you really expect a rational person to believe this?

#63

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;36049]

Yoga is a Sanskrit word. It first appears in the Vedas(Upanishads to be precise) It means union which is the practice of uniting the individual soul with the universal soul to gain liberation from the cycle of birth and death.
[/Quote]
Please prove that the term Yoga is used and also that it is used in this sense in Vedas.

The entire practice is described in detail in the ancient Vedic scriptures.

Bring the quotations, from the Vedas which describe the yoga practice you refer, not the later texts.

#64

[QUOTE=Asuri;35771]John 3.3-6

?Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. Nicodemus said unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter the second time into his mother’s womb, and be born? Jesus answered, verily , verily , I say unto thee except a man be born of water and of the Spirit he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Matthew 9.17
Neither do men put new wine into old wineskins, else the wineskins break, and the wine runs out, and the wineskin perish; but they put new wine into new wineskins, and both are preserved.

I know its not the orthodox interpretation, but I’ve always viewed these verses as being about reincarnation. I get the sense that Jesus is talking about individuals here…[/QUOTE]

This has nothing to do with reincarnation, which Christianity adamantly rejects.

To be “born again” is to be baptized, to be reborn spiritually, to be cleansed of oreginal sin.

Note that a text without a context is a pretext. A few lines taken out of context can be twisted to mean what you want to see.

#65

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;36189]Yeah, I am sorry but a religion that has as its god a poor victim was who beaten up by lowly humans scounderls, then nailed to a cross and spat at, and who cries and whales in the end “Oh god why have you foresaken me” Has childish temper tantrums, such as cursing a fig tree for not giving any figs and killing it, even though it was not the season for figs, and goes around telling people he is the son of god and the only way, doesn’t eactly give me any confidence.

I can see why Nietzche had a problem with Christianity.[/QUOTE]

Once again you misrepresent Christianity.

Christ never had a “temper tantrum,” laid down his own life as a Sacrifice, and was quoting scripture when he died.

And note you leave out his resurrection and ascension. How come? Why wouldn’t that inspire confidence? Why wouldn’t raising people from the dead or healing a blind man inspire confidence?

Of course you don’t have to believe any of this, but why have you chosen to post only what you percieve to be the bad and omit the good?

#66

You need to realise I am not completely ignorant of Christianity.

I agree that your ignorance is not complete.

#67

[QUOTE=thomas;39062]
To be “born again” is to be baptized, to be reborn spiritually, to be cleansed of oreginal sin.[/QUOTE]

I think we all know that this is the orthodox interpretation.

#68

Interesting latest information on the famous Shroud of Turin…at the last Scientific experiments the shroud was dated to around 13th century. Later it was discovered that the carbon dating was wrong because the pieces used in experiments had a 13th century
needlework repair, hidden from sight. very fine work used to repair it after a fire.

[B]All[/B] experiments failed to discover what put the imprint on the cloth. The imprint is definitely not the work of an artist, not due to dust, time, sweat, blood reactions etc etc etc and if a razor blade were used to try to scrape off t he image, it would perhaps be too much taken off before the linen colour underneath, were exposed…So it is a very subtle imprint.
Latest Scientific tests suggest it was radiation, light, of some sort

Tests were done over a ‘dummy’ using a direct laser, (like a pen laser might be) it produced a much greater imprint, this was concluded as not this type.

Then the test was a broader more dispersed light,(like light from a light bulb) but this produced nothing.

Then a test where the light is like that of a photocopier, going across the object
this produced what was necessary for the image to be seen as it appears on the shroud.

A scientist commented that what they may be looking at is possibly, either it was a direct miracle or the debris left behind from the miracle!!! To do with light.radiation of a specific sort as seen by the experiments.

The other point is there is a piece of material that is sewn along the full length of the shroud on one side. A couple of inches wide.

This was sewn on later and believed to be the piece that was tied from the legs to the neck to hold the shroud in place on the body, Imprints on the shroud show this.

When Mary Magdalene enters the tomb, she comes out screaming that someone has stolen the Body…but, when John enters, he comes out saying…he is risen.
The differences suggested that if the shroud had been tossed on the floor say, they would have both thought that maybe he had been stolen …but, John stating he is risen suggests something else… that the ties were still in place around the empty shroud…fascinating stuff I think…

#69

[QUOTE=Asuri;39108]I think we all know that this is the orthodox interpretation.[/QUOTE]

well…people may interpret them in their own ways…since human’s mind is unique. one thing can be interpreted in thousands ways…
but I do believe like Thomas said “To be “born again” is to be baptized, to be reborn spiritually, to be cleansed of oreginal sin.”

Yoga and christianity are two different things. I practice yoga but don’t touch the spiritual part of Yoga.

#70

[QUOTE=Asuri;39108]I think we all know that this is the orthodox interpretation.[/QUOTE]

It is not an orthodox interpretation. All denominations whether Catholic or Prodestant hold this to be THE mainstream interpretation. It is THE fundamental prinicple of Christianity.

#71

So far I like Yoga for it’s ability to help me center. I earnestly hope that those that practice often, don’t get caught up in “fundamental principles” in much the same way “I” have had the unfortunate experience of being subject to, in the Christian Faith.

That would be a shame :frowning:

#72

I guess the point I was trying to make is , that to define baptism as anything different than the interpretation that Thomas gives is not considered by Christian Liberals or Christian Conservatives as valid interpretation. As a member of a left leaning Christian denomination I can personally attest that I have never heard a different interpretation of baptism accepted by any mainstream Christian denomination. (and I have attended quite a few denominations) . To be “Born Again” or “cleansed of our sins” is the meaning of Baptism.

Here is the Google link for the definition provided by Princeton University.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&defl=en&q=define:baptism&sa=X&ei=0nkBTeLFFYTGlQfXo5XtCA&ved=0CBMQkAE

To change the meaning behind baptism would mean changing the entire Christian faith. That is what I meant by it being a fundmental principle of Christianity. It is one of the foundations and a requirement, much like the 8 limbs are foundations of Yoga.

Davekyn I am very sorry that you have experienced inapproprate behavior from those of the Christian faith (I too have been subject to that from those that hold more conservative views…) I just hope you will not judge us all that harsh.

#73

Thank You TeeA,
I know you mean well. Forgive my…mmmm…I guess resentments. I am ashamed to feel such a way as it only holds me back. I strive to be much better than that, however I must admit, that I won’t be turning to Christianity as it stands amounts the masses today. I believe The Christians of Today are far removed from those of yesteryear. No offense intended.

I much prefer the simplicity of living and find that many religions have much to offer each other. Once again…I also apologize and I’ll try not to judge but show more understanding in my responses next time:)

#74

Forgiven friend!! We all have the resentments even me at times.

#75

Thankyou…I was just editing my response…I still hope its all ok…LOL…:wink:

#76

Reincarnation in Christianity? Quoting passages from the Bible and providing far fetched interpretations of them is not going to convince anyone of that. Where in history, besides the “heretical” forms of Christianity, has any veritable Christian expounded on reincarnation within the Bible? Written books/essays/treatise on its nature and expounded it into a legitimate interpretation of Christianity? You silly people would be better off comparing Incan reincarnation beliefs with those of Dharmic religions and philosophies.

#77

Actually, Nietzche it is true that a group of early Christians did believe in Christianity and this doctrine was held by many early Church fathers. It was only later it was declared a heresy because it conflicted with the politics of the state, which found that such beliefs did not produce passive subjects of the state that could be easily ruled and controlled. Anybody who is a believer in reincarnation could turn around and say, “Well, you can rule my body, but you cannot rule my soul” Indeed that is what a famous Indian yogi(Dandimous) said to Alexandra the great.

As for finding proof of reincarnation in the bible. It is there in the Gnostic gospels very clearly, but it is definitely not clear in the bible. The attempts to show reincarnation in the bible are dubious at best. There are certain passages which can be taken to be suggestive of beliefs in reincarnation, such as John the Baptist having the spirit of Elijah, but this is only if you read it in a very particular way. Such interpretations cannot be accepted unless they are backing up elsewhere as well. Nowhere else in the bible is a similar suggestive reference to reincarnation.

#78

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;44760]Actually, Nietzche it is true that a group of early Christians did believe in Christianity and this doctrine was held by many early Church fathers. It was only later it was declared a heresy because it conflicted with the politics of the state, which found that such beliefs did not produce passive subjects of the state that could be easily ruled and controlled. Anybody who is a believer in reincarnation could turn around and say, “Well, you can rule my body, but you cannot rule my soul” Indeed that is what a famous Indian yogi(Dandimous) said to Alexandra the great.

As for finding proof of reincarnation in the bible. It is there in the Gnostic gospels very clearly, but it is definitely not clear in the bible. The attempts to show reincarnation in the bible are dubious at best. There are certain passages which can be taken to be suggestive of beliefs in reincarnation, such as John the Baptist having the spirit of Elijah, but this is only if you read it in a very particular way. Such interpretations cannot be accepted unless they are backing up elsewhere as well. Nowhere else in the bible is a similar suggestive reference to reincarnation.[/QUOTE]

And this is exactly what I meant when I said “heretical” (quote quote) sects of Christianity. xD. And I do agree with you on the way one should treat such unorthodox interpretations like these; they are almost always either some conversion tactic or some attempt to adulterate our teachings…

#79

I got up to the name calling…then it all just feel to bits for me. As to any of the above responses tainted with such antics or atmosphere; it only shows just how much some of you have to learn.

#80

The intentions for showing Reincarnation and Yoga in Christianity or even in Islam can be benevolent or malevolent, but always misguided. They are benevolent when a great Guru like Swami Yogananda paramhansa tries to show the similarities between Yoga and Christianity in order to convert people to Yoga, and malevolent when Christian missionaries try to co-opt our teachings to convince us that Christianity includes our teachings in order to win converts.

Most people are just looking for common ground between religions. Like Lotusgirl, but refuse to look at the differences. The reality is clear there is no other religions on this planet except the dharmic religions that teach Yoga philosophy and practice. It is our distinguishing feature. Now, just because people from other religions have realised that we had it right from the start, they are co-opting our teachings into their religions and desperately trying to find parallels in order to justify their acceptance of Yoga philosophy and practice. Whether they like it or not, they are accepting Hinduism.