Media, Political Correctness and Religious Debate

Spirituality Religion
#63

[QUOTE=thomas;46651]“scholars” HA HA

What does “up to” 100,000 mean, btw? 10 or 1 would qualify, wouldn’t it? I have “up to” a million dollars in my wallet right now, don’t I?

But this “witch hunting” had nothing to do with the Catholic Church.

75,000 women vs 6 million. That’s only an exaggeration of EIGHTY TIMES, but who cares when you’re bashing the evil Christians?

But what about those “up to” 75,000. How do we know this happened and how do we know this too has not been “exaggerated” (LIED ABOUT)?[/QUOTE]

& you notice how he goes to this website:
http://www.summerlands.com/

The Summerlands is a Celtic Pagan Community dedicated to rediscovering, preserving, disseminating, and when necessary, recreating that which was lost to us … the magick, history, customs, and religions of our ancestors. We are about worshipping and celebrating the old Gods and Goddesses in Ways both ancient and new … in walking the path that Spirit leads us upon … in rediscovering our connection with the Spirit of Our People…

for reliable and unbiased data? :rolleyes:

#64

[QUOTE=Nietzsche;46824]“200 ‘witches’ killed in India each year.” Why would I bother reading such drivel? You think crap like this, crap that appeals to a anti-Hindu/Indian no less, deserves my time? It is obvious you are trying to debase Hinduism by posting links to propaganda sites whenever SD attempts to glorify it. You are no better than the next anti-Hindu/Indian, white supremacist I stumble across daily.

Yeah, I was raised in India for several years. I have family living all over India. I visit India occasionally, sometimes for vacation purposes and sometimes to accompany my father on several business trips. I have seen all sides of India. Need I mention my family is one of the richest in Hyderabad (one of the major Indian cities) and owns large tracts of land in rural areas (which the precious Western media depicts as the site of much ignorance and backwards notions)? I have that side of India as well (farm, poor areas). Any Indian knows India more than you propaganda disseminating prevaricates. So keep your lies about India to yourself, will you? Post something [B]intelligent[/B] and [B]factual[/B] for once. Never educate us about the conditions in countries we have actually [B]LIVED[/B] in.[/QUOTE]

No one believes a word you say, man. “Need I mention…?” :lol::lol::lol:

Now you’re claiming to be a “rich Indian but you know the suffering of the little poor people”??? LOL
& who’s prevaricating???

#65

“This message is hidden because Indra Deva is on your ignore list.” Always a pleasure to see that anti-Hindu/Indian trolling, even if I can’t see his posts.

#66

[QUOTE=Nietzsche;46837]“This message is hidden because Indra Deva is on your ignore list.” Always a pleasure to see that anti-Hindu/Indian trolling, even if I can’t see his posts.[/QUOTE]

Always a pleasure to see you posting about me being on ignore
(& thus displaying you’re not even good at that)
because you can’t handle getting owned so bad :smiley:

#67

Once again the Flaw appears to me to be placing so much weight on a literal interpretation of religious scripture.

Secondly the Inquisiton and Witch Trials only show that “humans can be dumb”. Especally if they are acting out of ignorance. From a faulty perspective. This acting out from a faulty perspective still occurs today no matter what religion you follow.

Thirdly.
I look at it like this. Broadly. and in detail.
First Half - THe Old Testament. Before Jesus - Not so great!!!
Second Half - The New Testament - Getting Better!!!

#68

How else are we suppose to interpret historical descriptions of genocides in the OT? The rape of 32,000 young girls, the slaughter of 32,000 litltle children and their mothers. What wisdom are we to glean from this?

Secondly the Inquisiton and Witch Trials only show that “humans can be dumb”. Especally if they are acting out of ignorance. From a faulty perspective. This acting out from a faulty perspective still occurs today no matter what religion you follow.

It shows humans can be dumb, but more so it shows that the religion of Christianity is dumb. I prefer to use a more formal term: it shows the religion of Christianity is falsified.

Again, we Hindus never had genocides, witch trials, inquisitiins, crusades and slavery. In our religion such things are considered demonic(asura culture) There is something obviously right about our religion.

#69

I see very strong evidence of there existing in ancient times two very distinct dominant cultures on this planet: the Abrahamic world and Dharamic world. The centre of the Abrahamic world is Sumeria and the centre of the Dharmic world is the Indus valley. The religion that formed in the Abrahamic world was the Judo-Christian religion, and the religion of the Dharmic world was the dharmic religion.

I can also say quite confidently that out of these two cultures it is highly evident that the dharmic world was noble and enlightened, and the Abrahamic world was barbaric and savage.

As humanity we need to look past the cultures we are born in and support that culture which is most humane. The global world today demands a more humane, enlighened and noble culture and the dharmic religion fits the bill. It is high time that we get rid of the Abrahamic world, and discard it as an unfortunate aspect of primitive human history.

#70

It is also interesting to note that the Caucasian race was originally part of the Dharmic world, not the Abrahamic world. Let us not forget how the Abrahamic world was imposed on Europe. How Greek and Celtic culture was replaced by the dark clouds of the Abrahamic world. Originally, these cultures had the same noble and enlightened culture of the dharmic world, but to a lesser extent, due to their distance from the motherland of India.

#71

I do not deny the contribution of Dharmic religions in flourishing humanity for the good, but the concept you repeatedly call Abrahamic is a bit dubious. I recall from one of your previous posts that you referred christianity as a religion of charity and love. Moreover I recall one of those debates where it was mentioned that Christianity was considered to be influenced by Dharmic religion, but fell under the influence of Judaism.

In my opinion, Islam is the successor of Judaism, In fact, it is so successful that now it is the most fast developing religion. It has an anticipated effect on weak minds, especially on women, considering the recent news about conversion rates in UK. The jewish god ‘elohim’ and islamic god ‘allah’ are the same deities taking different names. Yet it appears like Christianity is different. The teachings of alleged Jesus of Nazareth and his followers strongly overlap with some sort of Taoistic or perhaps a Vedic teaching. So perhaps, it is not really appropriate to put Christiandom under Abrahamic category.

Nonetheless, I agree with the near-historical evidence that the last two millenia have been vile and barbaric with a lot of people being butchered due to unintellectual crusades.

#72

The organized religion of Christianity is indeed Abrahamic. Jesus and his teachings was originally a small, but influencial sect(there was also Mithra sects) The early Christians were a syncreticism of abrahamic and dharmic thought. Initially, the original Christians were much more dharmic. They practiced meditation, accepted the doctrines of karma and reincarnation and gnosis(yoga) but later this started to change and the abrahamic quotient became more predominant, and then it became almost exclusively abrahamic when the Council of Nicea canonized the Christian scriptures to form the bible. They selected only Christian scriptures that were the closest to Abrahamic thought, in addition to the Jewish bible. This is when the organized religion of Christianity formed.

If the cult of Jesus had been left alone it would never have become Christianity. It is almost impossible to support any act of violence against another with reference to the gospels. Hence why all acts of violence that we have seen in Christianity have been done with the sanction of the OT.

#73

Yet Christiandom was reformed many times. Lutherans, Calvinists, Anglican Church, Presbiteryans and so on. It has been a progressive line of belief system which also flourished art and music at sublime forms. In that way, yes, it is in alignment with Dharmic line of belief systems.

Only in dark ages, Christiandom was oppressive, and also gave sovereigns the justification to execute and torture suspects with morals. But to consider it in the line of judaism and islam is not really appropriate, due to the fact that religion is born out of culture. And christianity represents European culture, its art, beauty and music. In that way, it is humanistic.

Perhaps the term Abrahamic might be too much of an umbrella concept, which I don’t really favour. Yet, you still have a point Surya, that Christianity has the taint of the other dominant two religions.

#74

It depends on what you mean by reform. Most dominant sects of Christianity are just as oppressive, exclusivist as the original Roman catholic Christianity. Now bear in in mind that the Protestants, which was a rival sect of Christianity to Catholicism, was even more oppressive than Catholicism and actually executed more witches. It is from the Protestant work ethic, Weber argues, that capitalism was born. So even capitalism is just an extension of the Christian religion.

I thus think the term “Abrahamic world” is very apt to describe the situation of the world as it directly based on Abrahamic ideology. It does not represent the original culture of Europe, which was Indo-European/Aryan and was wiped out largely. It represents the Abrahamic world.

In fact, ironically Judaism has very little influence in this world today and it is not an evangalizing religion like Christianity is.

It is not reform that is needed, but rejection. We need to reject the religion of Christianity and the religion of Islam, and stop trying to apologise for them. These religions stand falsified. In science if a theory is falsified, you discard it, you do not hold onto it and try to reform it. We have a great replacement for the primitive Abrahamic religions already in existence: the dharmic religion. The whole world should adopt the dharmic religion for the prosperity of humanity.

In fact it is going to happen whether we adopt it or not, because science is heading that way. This religion will either be rediscovered by modern science or we will wake up and realise it already exists and adopt it.

#75

[QUOTE=Nietzsche;46824]“200 ?witches? killed in India each year.” Why would I bother reading such drivel? You think crap like this, crap that appeals to a anti-Hindu/Indian no less, deserves my time? It is obvious you are trying to debase Hinduism by posting links to propaganda sites whenever SD attempts to glorify it. You are no better than the next anti-Hindu/Indian, white supremacist I stumble across daily.

Yeah, I was raised in India for several years. I have family living all over India. I visit India occasionally, sometimes for vacation purposes and sometimes to accompany my father on several business trips. I have seen all sides of India. Need I mention my family is one of the richest in Hyderabad (one of the major Indian cities) and owns large tracts of land in rural areas (which the precious Western media depicts as the site of much ignorance and backwards notions)? I have that side of India as well (farm, poor areas). Any Indian knows India more than you propaganda disseminating prevaricates. So keep your lies about India to yourself, will you? Post something [B]intelligent[/B] and [B]factual[/B] for once. Never educate us about the conditions in countries we have actually [B]LIVED[/B] in.[/QUOTE]

It is obvious you did not read all the links I posted?. You are quick to judge quick to anger I see and really fond of labels?.. I will always cherish the initial misconceptions I had about you

#76

[QUOTE=Indra Deva;46838]Always a pleasure to see you posting about me being on ignore
(& thus displaying you’re not even good at that)
because you can’t handle getting owned so bad :D[/QUOTE]

Ahhh but SD can see it and I am wondering if the two are not one

#77

Yep Yulaw, I am everyone that supports Hinduism. After all it is unthinkable is it not that anybody else could support Hinduism other than me :wink:

#78

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;46859]How else are we suppose to interpret historical descriptions of genocides in the OT? The rape of 32,000 young girls, the slaughter of 32,000 litltle children and their mothers. What wisdom are we to glean from this?[/QUOTE]

You think it’s true that the Jews would say “We took & raped exactly 32,000 young girls, and we killed exactly 32,000 mothers & children”???
You don’t know or understand Desert religions, believing in gods of war & what you might think they demand of you.
The miracle of the Old Testament is that Christianity came out of it (however it came out of it, I’m making no religious claims at all) and that there are people that look past the horrible or violent aspects of the scriptures and find a pure and good message out of it all and try to live that for the good of themselves and their communities.
For of the horrible things that have been done in the name of religion, they’ve always been done by men. Great good can & has been done in the name of gods just as great evil has been done in the name of gods. Condemning people for the histories of their religions, things that according to scripture happened thousands of year ago and are most often not historically supported or verifiable, is pretty ridiculous.
As a human being in the 21st century, I’m much more interested in what people do TODAY in the name of their gods, not what was done centuries or millennia ago.

#79

That is an immensely sophomoric view of things (& a great example of the dualism that dominates your consciousness)

I can also say quite confidently that out of these two cultures it is highly evident that the dharmic world was noble and enlightened, and the Abrahamic world was barbaric and savage.

Maybe you should study the history of war in India before you start making such claims of “nobility”

As humanity we need to look past the cultures we are born in and support that culture which is most humane. The global world today demands a more humane, enlighened and noble culture and the dharmic religion fits the bill. It is high time that we get rid of the Abrahamic world, and discard it as an unfortunate aspect of primitive human history.

You’re still at war, in your heart and mind. I pray for someone to remove these obstacles…

#80

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;46866]The organized religion of Christianity is indeed Abrahamic. Jesus and his teachings was originally a small, but influencial sect(there was also Mithra sects) The early Christians were a syncreticism of abrahamic and dharmic thought. Initially, the original Christians were much more dharmic. They practiced meditation, accepted the doctrines of karma and reincarnation and gnosis(yoga) but later this started to change and the abrahamic quotient became more predominant, and then it became almost exclusively abrahamic when the Council of Nicea canonized the Christian scriptures to form the bible. They selected only Christian scriptures that were the closest to Abrahamic thought, in addition to the Jewish bible. This is when the organized religion of Christianity formed.

If the cult of Jesus had been left alone it would never have become Christianity. It is almost impossible to support any act of violence against another with reference to the gospels. Hence why all acts of violence that we have seen in Christianity have been done with the sanction of the OT.[/QUOTE]

What are your sources for this? Not some other crappy website I hope :rolleyes:

#81

[QUOTE=Yulaw;46901]It is obvious you did not read all the links I posted…. You are quick to judge quick to anger I see and really fond of labels…… I will always cherish the initial misconceptions I had about you[/QUOTE]

Well then, since you claim there is something of worth in the links you posted, I will read them when I have the time. But if I find any misinformation, misconceptions, bias, and so forth, I will simply skip the article in question and move on to the next.

Quick to anger? Perhaps, but not without reason. I get suspicious and critical of anyone whenever they post links to obvious anti-Hindu/Indian propaganda. And considering the fact that you love to frolic with your anti-Hindu/Indian friends who have Christianized biases and PC…Let’s just say my misgivings are always confirmed in this kind of situation.

#82

[QUOTE=Yulaw;46902]Ahhh but SD can see it and I am wondering if the two are not one[/QUOTE]

& even if they aren’t the same person, neither of them understands what was going on with Moabites, Midianites, Hivites, Israelites, Canaanites, Amorites, Hittites, Perizzites, and Jebusites at the time. It’s really not so different than the warring kingdoms in India so long ago. Considering how they feel about other religions’ missionaries and proselytizing, I’m sure they’d be for something similar to Old Testament Justice & they could pretend that some blue guy gave them permission…