The Eternal Way

Yoga Discussion General Yoga
#56

[QUOTE=TeeA;34069]EVERYONE MUST THINK MY SON IS THE BEST MAN IN THE WORLD BEACUSE HE IS WHITE AND AMERICAN. HE IS SO PRIVILIGED TO HAVE EVERYTHING AND EVERYONE SHOULD EMULATE/WORSHIP HIM DUE TO HIS PLACE IN THE WORLD. WITH HIS LARGE SALARY ($2500.00 AMERICAN DOLLARS PER YEAR) HE IS RICHER THAN 95% OF THE WORLD’S POPULATION. HE IS GOD. ALL SHOULD WISH TO BE LIKE HIM.
(nevermind the fact that his mother makes him go to bed at 8:30PM, he must eat his green beans, must take a bath everyday and not jump on my furniture) :slight_smile:

No one is greater than anyone else. If we want a true “Pissing match” here…Brother Neil…My mat is bigger than yours. :slight_smile: :slight_smile: :)[/QUOTE]

This is a strawman. Your son is a child and is dependent on you. He is not an independent adult who made made his own life.

Of course people are greater than others. Buddha was wiser than you, Einstien was smarter than you, Bradd Pitt is probably better looking than you and Arnie is stronger than you.

Only people who are insecure say things like, “No one greater than anyone else” because they can’t accept they are in fact inferior to so many people out there.

The caste system is the most logical system to organize society. You organize society according to the aptitude of the people. If you have not much aptitude
for anything you are assigned as a labourer. If you have good calculating and management skills you are assigned a merchant. If you have great intellectual ability
you are assigned a teacher etc. Although every person has equal functional value because society needs all to function properly, it is clear that the merchant is
higher than the labourer, and the teacher is higher than the merchant.

#57

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34147]This is a strawman. Your a son a child and is dependent on you. He is not an independent adult who made made his own life.

Of course people are greater than others. Buddha was wiser than you, Einsteni was smarter than you, Bradd Pitt is probably better looking than you and Arnie in stronger than you.

Only people who are insecure say things like, “No one greater than anyone else” because they can’t accept they are in fact inferior to so many people out there.[/QUOTE]

Ah yes. But at core. Same essential nature. Same Taste. Same self. Same divinity.

The only difference is Karma and nothing else.

#58

[QUOTE=The Scales;34148]Ah yes. But at core. Same essential nature. Same Taste. Same self. Same divinity.

The only difference is Karma and nothing else.[/QUOTE]

Karma makes all the difference. It decides whether you will have the life of a frog or a prince.

Everybody is potentially divine. However potential is not actual.

#59

Surya Deva,

“If you think you understand quantum mechanics, you don’t understand quantum mechanics.”

You, being the authority on physics, have surely heard this saying among fellow physicists. Unless of course you’re just someone who has read a few physics books and done a little bit of research on the internet.

Also, that “b.s” that Lotusgirl was giving you about “it’s a theory”— She is right. It’s called quantum theory. Acknowledging that these things are theories is most definitely not the same as dismissing them.

May I ask you what your educational background is?

#60

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34144]You are not taking a higher path at all. You are definitely lower on the intellectual level. Else, you not have gone all mardy and thrown the toys out of the pen when I categorically proved your “It’s a theory” cop-out argument wrong.

You have done no such thing! I just know when there is no point. I don’t need to win to know what is correct by ALL scientific standards.

The reason that you people cannot stand the heat in an argument is not because you are morally superior so you want to take the high ground, it is because you are intellectually inferior, incapable of proving your point, so you flee.[/QUOTE]

When you say “you people” it sounds an awful lot like bigotry. Again, there was no need to prove my point. Science has done that. Never said I was morally superior either. I had a choice which path to take in my response. I chose to not respond and be compassionate.

#61

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34149]Karma makes all the difference. It decides whether you will have the life of a frog or a prince.

Everybody is potentially divine. However potential is not actual.[/QUOTE]

Um . . .

There’s no potentially about it…

I’m referring to the same chunk of consciousness that is the essential core of all beings.

You know. THe self. The seer . The purusha. whatever you want to call it.

the thing that gets “namasted” ???

Whether frog or prince . . . same essential core. Come on you know this!

#62

[QUOTE=Vulpes vulpes;34152]Surya Deva,

“If you think you understand quantum mechanics, you don’t understand quantum mechanics.”

You, being the authority on physics, have surely heard this saying among fellow physicists. Unless of course you’re just someone who has read a few physics books and done a little bit of research on the internet.

Also, that “b.s” that Lotusgirl was giving you about “it’s a theory”— She is right. It’s called quantum theory. Acknowledging that these things are theories is most definitely not the same as dismissing them.

May I ask you what your educational background is?[/QUOTE]

I have a first class degree in Philosophy, with a specialization in Philosophy of Science and did my dissertation on Hinduism and Quantum physics and was awarded with distinction. This obviously required me to read a lot of academic literature on quantum physics. I also attended talks by quantum physicists.

I think suffice it to say I know what I am talking about.

I do not claim to understand quantum physics. I do know, however, what quantum physics has proven and that is there is another plane beyond the physical world of space-time known as the quantum. It is equivalent to the akasha in Hinduism, and this has also been pointed out by the famous philosopher of science Erwin Lazslo. This quantum plane, because it has no space-time laws, can be used for instant communication of information. As all objects are fundamentally information all objects can be turned into quantum objects and communicated through the quantum channels.

It has also been proven recently that very large objects can be turned into quantum objects. As I just cited earlier this is exactly how Patanjali explains the yogis are able to teleport. They gain first something called perfect control(samayama) which is basically a state of perfect resonance with the quantum field and then they are able to collapse themselves into a wavefunction and then they gain passage into the quantum channels. We know for a fact through the phenomenon of quantum tunneling that particles do collapse into wavefunctions.

The fact that the exact method is being described by Patanjali(with the exception that this is through the use of mind and not technology) with equivalent terminology proves that the same thing is being described. This must mean that yogis obviously really could teleport. And so can we if we attain perfect control(samayama)

Quantum mechanics basically proves Hinduism is a true religion. That nothing that it says is a matter of faith, but it is scientific fact. This is why I have declared very boldly at the start the new religion of humanity is going to be Hinduism - the eternal way. This is the religion of individuals each on a quest to reach self-realization and actualization of all their potentials. It is the religion of people who have the will to power, high self-esteem, assertiveness and confidence to accomplish whatever they want.

#63

[QUOTE=lotusgirl;34153]When you say “you people” it sounds an awful lot like bigotry. Again, there was no need to prove my point. Science has done that. Never said I was morally superior either. I had a choice which path to take in my response. I chose to not respond and be compassionate.[/QUOTE]

Science has not proven your point. It has proven my point. Read all the links I provided they are all supporting my point.

You did indeed imply you were morally superior by saying this " I will take the higher path and not share them." In this context “higher” is a claim by you to moral superiority. However, I showed it for what it really was, you were losing an argument and you could not accept defeat, so you fled with an excuse that you were being morally superior by not arguing. In that case you would not have entered the argument at any point.

#64

[QUOTE=The Scales;34155]Um . . .

There’s no potentially about it…

I’m referring to the same chunk of consciousness that is the essential core of all beings.

You know. THe self. The seer . The purusha. whatever you want to call it.

the thing that gets “namasted” ???

Whether frog or prince . . . same essential core. Come on you know this![/QUOTE]

This is what Sankara said to one of his arrogant students who started claiming he was god. He said that he was a fool to claim he was god, because he had not actually realised it. First realise it, then claim you are god. I do not claim I am god, but I claim that I have the potential of god. As do you and everybody else.

At this moment in your spiritual evolution you are not god.

#65

I have a first class degree in Philosophy, with a specialization in Philosophy of Science and did my dissertation on Hinduism and Quantum physics and was awarded with distinction. This obviously required me to read a lot of academic literature on quantum physics. I also attended talks by quantum physicists.

I think suffice it to say I know what I am talking about.

I do not claim to understand quantum physics. I do know, however, what quantum physics has proven and that is there is another plane beyond the physical world of space-time known as the quantum. It is equivalent to the akasha in Hinduism, and this has also been pointed out by the famous philosopher of science Erwin Lazslo. This quantum plane, because it has no space-time laws, can be used for instant communication of information. As all objects are fundamentally information all objects can be turned into quantum objects and communicated through the quantum channels.

It has also been proven recently that very large objects can be turned into quantum objects. As I just cited earlier this is exactly how Patanjali explains the yogis are able to teleport. They gain first something called perfect control(samayama) which is basically a state of perfect resonance with the quantum field and then they are able to collapse themselves into a wavefunction and then they gain passage into the quantum channels. We know for a fact through the phenomenon of quantum tunneling that particles do collapse into wavefunctions.

The fact that the exact method is being described by Patanjali(with the exception that this is through the use of mind and not technology) with equivalent terminology proves that the same thing is being described. This must mean that yogis obviously really could teleport. And so can we if we attain perfect control(samayama)

Quantum mechanics basically proves Hinduism is a true religion. That nothing that it says is a matter of faith, but it is scientific fact. This is why I have declared very boldly at the start the new religion of humanity is going to be Hinduism - the eternal way. This is the religion of individuals each on a quest to reach self-realization and actualization of all their potentials. It is the religion of people who have the will to power, high self-esteem, assertiveness and confidence to accomplish whatever they want

Impressive.

How do we attain perfect control?
How has teleportation been achieved solely by using the mind?

#66

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34158]This is what Sankara said to one of his arrogant students who started claiming he was god. He said that he was a fool to claim he was god, because he had not actually realised it. First realise it, then claim you are god. I do not claim I am god, but I claim that I have the potential of god. As do you and everybody else.

At this moment in your spiritual evolution you are not god.[/QUOTE]

Ah so you don’t know this…

I think your confused on the finer points of your religion.

“The reintegrated being, the yogi, having churned the four wisdoms (vedas) and all scriptures, enjoy their cream, their essence. The learned get only the butter milk.” - Jnanasankalini tantra 51

#67

How do we attain perfect control?

It is achieived by following Patanjali’s 8 fold path which I have outlined and described in some detail in others places. I will basically give a very brief overview: You first train your mind using mindfulness, moderation and practicing non-attachment in daily life(yama and niyamas). Then you must train your body using physical exercises in Yoga(asanas) and breathing exercises(pranayama) in order to cultivate your pranic body(quantum body) this will allow for the pranic channels to become clear and they will be able to recieve more pranic energy and your chakras will start to function better. This is a necessary preparation before you begin the second set of steps which is meditation. It will give you greater control over your prana. In the second steps you will consciously withdraw your prana from the external senses into your mind as a result of which your senses will shut off and you will begin to introvert into the mind(pratyahara) At this stage you will be bombarded with lucid visions emanating from your subconscious(memories, fantasies, thought impresisons) after a while these will recede and your mind will become completely empty. At this stage you will start meditation by choosing an object as a focal point. If you are able to maintain concentration on the object without any disturbance of a thought, you will enter into deep meditation(dhyana) and finally samadhi(absolute absorption) whereby you will lose complete awareness of yourself and only have object-awareness. This is when you reach a state of perfect resonance with the object deep at the quantum level.

How has teleportation been achieved solely by using the mind?

When you reach that level of perfect resonance you become aware of the relation between you and the quantum space and your entire body will collapse into its wavefunction and enter into the quantum space. You navigate through the channels in the quantum space to go to any location you want. This is done simply by thinking of the location you want to go to whereby you entangle your body and that location and then can transmit yourself through the pathway created.

#68

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34164]It is achieived by following Patanjali’s 8 fold path which I have outlined and described in some detail in others places. I will basically give a very brief overview: You first train your mind using mindfulness, moderation and practicing non-attachment in daily life(yama and niyamas). Then you must train your body using physical exercises in Yoga(asanas) and breathing exercises(pranayama) in order to cultivate your pranic body(quantum body) this will allow for the pranic channels to become clear and they will be able to recieve more pranic energy and your chakras will start to function better. This is a necessary preparation before you begin the second set of steps which is meditation. It will give you greater control over your prana. In the second steps you will consciously withdraw your prana from the external senses into your mind as a result of which your senses will shut off and you will begin to introvert into the mind(pratyhara) At this stage you will be bombarded with lucid visions emanating from your subconscious(memories, fantasies, thought impresisons) after a while these will recede and your mind will become completely empty. At this stage you will start meditation by choosing an object as a focal point. If you are able to maintain concentration on the object without any disturbance of a thought, you will enter into deep meditation(dhyana) and finally samadhi(absolute absorption) whereby you will lose complete awareness of yourself and only have object-awareness. This is when you reach a state of perfect resonance with the object deep at the quantum level.

When you reach that level of perfect resonance you become aware of the relation between you and the quantum space and your entire body will collapse into its wavefunctuin and enter into the quantum space. You navigate through the channels in the quantum space to go to any location you want. This is done simply by thinking of the location you want to go to whereby you entangle your body and that location and then can transmit yourself through the pathway created.[/QUOTE]

YEP. Pretty much…

#69

Here is a trade secret: The greater your powers of concentration the greater your psychic powers.

This is the ONLY difference between superior beings and inferior beings. The ordinary human being can only concentrate for a few seconds and this is why the human being cannot penetrate deep into reality because he is never focussing long enough. The masters/gods/buddhas call them what you may, however, have a concentration like a laser beam which penetrates deep into the nature of reality(past the quantum, into the mental, the causal and spiritual)

All Yoga is about is training your powers of concentration.

#70

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34166]Here is a trade secret: The greater your powers of concentration the greater your psychic powers.

This is the ONLY difference between superior beings and inferior beings. The ordinary human being can only concentrate for a few seconds and this is why the human being cannot penetrate deep into reality because he is never focussing long enough. The masters/gods/buddhas call them what you may, however, have a concentration like a laser beam which penetrates deep into the nature of reality(past the quantum, into the mental, the causal and spiritual)

All Yoga is about is training your powers of concentration.[/QUOTE]

YEP. Pretty much…

#71

but not totally…

#72

[QUOTE=The Scales;34174]I see you do not get it just yet.[/QUOTE]

I do get it

The reintegrated being, the yogi, having churned the four wisdoms (vedas) and all scriptures, enjoy their cream, their essence

I have emboldened the operative word. You must first reintegrate i.e., go through a process, a churning, a transformation before you can reach self-realization.

Prior to that you cannot claim to be god. If you go around claiming you are god at this point you will be challenged and you will fail. It would be like me going around claiming I am the the strongest man in the world, and then looking like a right tool when I fail to bench press even 100lb :smiley:

#73

Well thats a Rip.

I dont’ want to be the Almighty lord of the Universe I want to be me.

#74

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34121]TeeA, yes it has. I am not talking about String theory here. I am talking about Quantum Mechanics. I have read several books by actual quantum physicists that declare this themselves. It is proven beyond a reason of doubt that world is not made out of matter but information or waves of possiblity. It does not take any physical form until the observer collapses the wavefunction. We now know for a fact that the beyond the physical world exists a whole new dimension where in the universe exists as one entangled quantum system and is interacting with everything at all once. We can now use this new dimension for effects like quantum tunneling, quantum teleportation and quantum levitation. This is all proven stuff we have even been able to experimentally demonstrate it.[/QUOTE]

I would first like to apologize on not including the Uncertainty Priniciple or Quantum Mechanics. I was typing this late last night (after midnight and I work early in the morning) and just summarized. However you misread my statement. I was not implying that you were speaking of string theory, rather that many of therories, including those based on Quantum Mechanics are highly complicated theories. Just that. THEORIES! As for an extra dimension that is not mentioned in Quantum Mechanics and is a bi-product of string theory.
Even if Quantum Mechanics (as you like to describe it rather than Theory) was the end all be all (explaining all of the observable effects)…then explain why are 100% of the world’s theoretical physicist are still trying to reconcile it with Relativity!! :confused:
If what you said is true then would we have a complete working model that predicted everything that would happen. I would then be out of a career.

As for the extra Dimension that has not been proven either. This is again just a theory. It has been for nearly 100 years. However if you want to discuss multiple dimensions as it relates to Quantum Mechanics, it is merely a mathematical fix between Quantum Mechanics and Relativity. Mathematically we can not represent the Quantum world (ground state) AND use Relativity to describe the relationships that occur. So scientist added dimensions until they had a model (actually there are 5 main string theories, multiple Brane theories, 1000’s of mathematical models as well as millions of crackpot ideas) that matched some of the predictions that both Relativity and Quantum Mechanics make. (There is a debate of 5 to 13 dimensions)

As for the waves of probability you describe, you must read Quantum Mechanics by Durac better. It states that you can not know the state of a system (waves, particles or combinations of) before measuring (observing) it. Schr?dinger’s equation just shows us that when we observe a particle or wave, we force it into a particular state based on the wave function . This is the basis of the Uncertanity Principle, that we can not know both the momentum and the position of a particle after we measure it. We can only know one of the results. An example. If I have a box with a live cat in it and connected to that box is hose that connects to another box that contains a radioactive material. There is a probability that the radioactive material will decay which would release radiation and therefore kill the cat. I can not know the state of the cat (whether it is dead or alive) until I open (observe) the box. At that point I force the cat into a particular state (dead or alive). This in no way disproves that the cat does not exist rather that I can not know the state of the cat until it is observed, and only then I can only measure whether it is dead or alive and not both.

Matter is matter. Is was proven by Einstein and others. He in fact won the Nobel in Physics for this (photoelectric effect) and not Relativity. Hence the photon. A discrete amount of energy that has both wave and particle properties.

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34121]I already told you a theory in the scientific world does not mean just a guess or a conjecture, it is an entire model that explains all observable facts in the world and makes predictions of unobservables. It does not claim to have know ultimately what anything is such as “time” or “gravity” but it certainly can explain the observable facts. Based on observable facts we have been able to prove the existence of the quantum world and disproven th old common sensetheory of there being a physical world. Whatever it is, it ain’t physical.[/QUOTE]
Yes we have proven there is a quantum “world” (existing in our own 3-1 universe and not some other dimension) that is made of quarks, photons, electrons, positrons, and other parts of Matter and Anti Matter. This is not another dimension. There is a physical world. The general theory is that our world of 3-1 space-time is carved out by energy and matter (both interchangeable between each other E=mc^2). Since we can not at this time prove (or observe) other dimensions whether infinitely larger or smaller than our own, the other theories have no grounding at this time.
Also just a point. If we knew Quantum Mechanics had an answer for everything you want it too… the entire scientific community would be out of a job.

#75

[QUOTE=Surya Deva;34147]This is a strawman. Your son is a child and is dependent on you. He is not an independent adult who made made his own life.

Of course people are greater than others. Buddha was wiser than you, Einstien was smarter than you, Bradd Pitt is probably better looking than you and Arnie is stronger than you.

Only people who are insecure say things like, “No one greater than anyone else” because they can’t accept they are in fact inferior to so many people out there.

The caste system is the most logical system to organize society. You organize society according to the aptitude of the people. If you have not much aptitude
for anything you are assigned as a labourer. If you have good calculating and management skills you are assigned a merchant. If you have great intellectual ability
you are assigned a teacher etc. Although every person has equal functional value because society needs all to function properly, it is clear that the merchant is
higher than the labourer, and the teacher is higher than the merchant.[/QUOTE]

And you are a child as well. One who totally misses the point due to arrogance. I hope someday when you are much older and wiser you don’t come to regret. Also don’t attempt to pull the toothpick out of my eye when you have a log in yours.
If it is your goal to “convert people to Hinduism” you are going about it the wrong way. Stating how much better you are than everyone else shows that you lack wisdom. In many ways you are as inflaming as those you despise.
As for the merchant, he would not have workers without labourers and the teacher not eat without the merchant to sell.