There’s a first…100…lol:D
Looks like i was mistaken …i just noticed the christianity thread. And i seem to recall the marjuana & yoga thread had a lot of reads on it too.Zzzzzzzzzzzz
[SIZE=2]Very interesting.
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Surya Deva,
You’re definitely a jnana yogi to fear.Very powerful,yes.
The problem starts with the natural human tendency for secetarianism where they want to believe either one of them is more right than the other and their path is more right than the other. As is the case with so many misguided Christians who think Jesus is the only way and simply accepting him as their lord and saviour is enough for salvation. When humans begin to care more about the author than the actual message that is when they go astray.
This seems to be the major problem with religion.You seemed to cover some of the main points beautifullly & logically…lol. Intoleraance to other’s viewpoints,dogma and so on.
[QUOTE=core789;33204]Surya Deva,
You’re definitely a jnana yogi to fear.Very powerful,yes.[/QUOTE]
lol Classic!
Lol…:roll: :roll:
Good to battle it out with the best of them…
Thanks core789
I am ready to leave jnana yoga now. I have become sick of reading books and intellectualizing now. I have been doing for that 10 years. Do you think Jnana yoga can lead to enlightenment or only just show the way to Yoga? I am finding that it has only shown me the way to Yoga. I understand the theory right from the atom to Brahman. But now I want actual direct experience.
Sounds like yogic spiritual science is indeed is the perfect antidote to the overly rational thinking mind. Particularly if you are or have been an academic, and especially western philosophy and it’s quagmire.
You sound right on track.
Yes i think jnana yoga could but highly unlikely for most people especially a westerner . I think your trainings in jnana have served you really wel to look further.
I f you stayed at my house for 3 months it’s possible i might be able to teach you alot.
You are lookiing right at tne end of upir nose, right just where you should be. Alot of folk live in their mind, to their own detriment or limitation. The do no realise their full potentiality and possibility because the thinking mind is always evaluating and wants to play along with those games. As you know this gets in the way of pure consciousness and a relaxed state which is like the bed for transfromations in yoga.There is also a lotf conditioning that stops folk from praciticcing yoga & returning to our natural state.Our brains and our consciousness could be expanding faster thn they are but for some reason a whole host of things gets in the way and we allow that to happen on a daily basis.Like you say it is tapping into a faster rate of evolution that can be done on a daily basis systematically using every available means and gradually. It is very exciting.
It is not even that difificult once you know how. Once you’re armed with the requisite knowledge and some experience. Some dediciation and setting up new habits are followed.
You’ve found the ‘get out clause’.This gets us out of the treadmill which is normal consciousness bound to limitation and conditioning and provides us with a vehicle which carries us to freedon and ultimately another land.
Indeed it sounds like your jnana yoga trainings may well have been enough to pull the veil away from the eyes.You are making excellent progress. You’re looking for more. Yes there is so much more than just this. Don’t settle for medicrity. You are a King. And you are free to do whatever you want so you can evolve mindfully and harmoniously with that of the cosmos.
There is obviouslly more than just what we just see with our eyes.The journey is and should be be just as enjoyable as the reaching of our destination.
The whole of yogic science is like one giant interesting buffet. How we arrive at discovering our true nature can take a number of paths but the pricniples are the same.And there are common methods.Praciting a little each day is all that’s enough to ove forward. It is all valuable experience and knowledge that is gained .
I have met a number of academics mainly & philosophy lecturers and tutors who would benefit if they studied some yoga & meditation. I’m not saying this is you, as i think you have demonstarrted athat you seem to have a clear understanding of the illusions and traps of western thinking & philosphy.Folk that live too much in their head could benenfit from meditation and other yogic practices.i.e overly intellectual types that refuse to think outside the box, are too rational. Are permanently confused because they are lost in the circuitious trappings of the thinking mind etc. I’m not saying this is you but alot of academia. That is why they say often great discoveries are made outside of ivory towers because they are not affected by tradition and peer research, influence & pressures. They are free to think outisde the box. Many geniuses were independents and did not have to unlearn whatever preconceptions others held.So when folk come up with new ideas or ways of looking at stuff it often involves debunking at least a great deal of what has been said by others.Or looking at things afresh and new, without the shades.
[QUOTE=Surya Deva;33234]Thanks core789
I am ready to leave jnana yoga now. I have become sick of reading books and intellectualizing now. I have been doing for that 10 years. Do you think Jnana yoga can lead to enlightenment or only just show the way to Yoga? I am finding that it has only shown me the way to Yoga. I understand the theory right from the atom to Brahman. But now I want actual direct experience.[/QUOTE]
I’m just typical intolerant, irrational and dogmatic catholic, but I had few thoughts and decided to share anyway.
I think you are experiencing a sort of enlightenment on mental level. And you have a lot of direct experience – of intellectual/mental constructs. Stating for example that you understand theory right from atom to Brahman - this is a sort of enlightenment, on mental/intellectual level. I think there are several types of enlightenment –at each different level of existence. Higher the level the greater and deeper sense of “light” (of everything that enlightenment represents).
I don’t think any type of enlightenment results in TOTAL knowledge of the universe. E.g. how from many molecules this table you are using is composed of. Or does it? I’m searching for highly enlightened people to check that. Anyone here had such experience of total knowledge?
Core789, yes I must admit living too much in your head is a huge trap. It is even worse than materialism and hedonism. I am starting to come out of this academic trap now. I realise philosophy is not for its own sake, but it is rather a map. Besides who needs anymore maps after reading Samkhya. Samkhya easily is the greatest philosophy ever produced. However Samkhya is just pure inference. It is Yoga where one can directly experience all the realities Samkhya enumerates. I must say I have not been completely bereft of experience. I had quite a few supersensible experiences, but they have been spontaneous and short lived. I am now ready to commit myself to Yoga and not read another book! I have about 100 books in my library and read so many books as part of my academic training. This is why I am ready to renounce all of this and surrender to a living master and his instructions.
[QUOTE=Pawel;33240]I’m just typical intolerant, irrational and dogmatic catholic, but I had few thoughts and decided to share anyway.
I think you are experiencing a sort of enlightenment on mental level. And you have a lot of direct experience – of intellectual/mental constructs. Stating for example that you understand theory right from atom to Brahman - this is a sort of enlightenment, on mental/intellectual level. I think there are several types of enlightenment –at each different level of existence. Higher the level the greater and deeper sense of “light” (of everything that enlightenment represents).
I don’t think any type of enlightenment results in TOTAL knowledge of the universe. E.g. how from many molecules this table you are using is composed of. Or does it? I’m searching for highly enlightened people to check that. Anyone here had such experience of total knowledge?[/QUOTE]
True enlightenment would lead to absolute knowledge. There is nothing that one would not know. I was watching a discourse by Paramhansa Nityananda(yes the one who had a scandal recently) and he mentioned how he could see all the sun, stars, planets and galaxies when his guru showed him a technique(samyama on a nadi) by simply pressing on the nadi when he looked up at the sky he could see this all. He explained the reason this was possible was because he had completely arrested the movement of his eyes(through the nadi) and as a result the eyes could see through the illusory blue layer of the sky into space.
I have no reason to doubt his experience. I have had experiences where I have seen atoms(so has the physicist and philosopher of science Fritjof capra)
I guess I agree intellectual knowledge is a kind of enlightenment. It is a shallow enlightenment though because theory is always only 1% and 99% is practice.
Suryadeva, you know a whole world is waiting for you ,for everyone, right just around the corner. Perhaps You have experienced like a jnana yoga awakening of sorts ,to some dgree, which i would have thought unusual.But your own background & training might have led there.You may well be at an auspicious point in your life. It is the realisation that there is more to it, to an “ordinary” life & perspective as we know it.There are parts that are just waiting to be discovered.
I’ve actually got Muz Murrays copy of ‘Meeting the master’ next to my computer here. You thought of any sites,ashrams or places in India to stay? I have a sadhana that i’m happy with and can take me all the way.All i feel i need to do is surrender period.
Going to India at some point is on the list.An ashram might kiind of speed things up a bit plus India I love.
I agree with you. I think yoga is a serious spiritual path,the deeper you dig and experience it, it’s eseence and depth, and not necessarily for the faint-hearted,sheepish people or those lacking in aspiration. You really can have the whole world and more.Not to make it sound elitist but half-measures can deliver half-results. The main obstacle i feel is finding a sadhana that is working for you. Ideailsm is good to have as you make your way…
Core789,
I have looked into various Ashrams in India I want to join. I want a proper 1-2 year intensive stay in an Ashram(or more if required) The most important thing is I require a living master. I will accept any path if there is a living master and obey it to the tee.
Of the ashrams I have considered so far is the Sivananda Ashram(Riskhikesh, because I love Rishikesh) Bihar School of Yoga, Swami Chinmayananda Vedanta course(3 year resedential) and Yogiraj Siddnath in Pune. Also considered Jaggu vasudev Sadhguru(Isha yoga) but he seems to be expensive(lol) I am open to suggestions. If you know of any living masters, please tell me. My life is sorted as I soon as I find one.
- You’ve found a sadhana
- You’ve experienced inner guru
3)You are in India and found nice ashram
4)There happens to be a great living master resident in the ashram
3)&4) are probably not necesseary or essential but put you in yoga heaven and progress is more likely to be more fast track.
Rishikesh looks like a good place to start.
1)You have a sadhana
2)You have experienced inner guru
3)You are in India and found a nice ashram.
4) There happens to be a living Master resident in the ashram that is available
- & 4) are probably not necessary or essential but all together would put you in yoga heaven, and progress would likely be faster track.
Rishikesh would be a good place to start .I would aim to find a place a could focus on sadhana pretty quickly and settle down with.Like you say if you can stay for up to two years for the longer haul.And also absorb from other teachers & yogis there too.
That isha yoga dude is a fortune.I think some gurus don’t charge anything.
I think some paths may well have their weaknesses in some areas, atleast for some people that is.That is why finding a path that is working for you is a main consideration. Because you could submit yourself to a master and he might not give you all the keys you need. I think masters should know which keys you need. That is what disintiguishes themBut even complete yoga paths, some are better than others .Simply quicker and more effective.Tantra yoga and kundalini kirya and mantra yoga(when combined) are good yogas.
[B]Pawel[/B]
I don’t think any type of enlightenment results in TOTAL knowledge of the universe. E.g. how from many molecules this table you are using is composed of. Or does it? I’m searching for highly enlightened people to check that. Anyone here had such experience of total knowledge?
[B]I believe that Surya Deva is correct here in his response. No The Scales is not omniscient… lol can’t help you there. [/B]
For me, along with my little bundle of Karma, it was study that was my catalyst towards the spiritual life. I’d listen to the AC Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada audio book recording of the Bhagavad Gita on my ipod incessantly. Over and over and over and over.
Maybe not total renunciation of all books? Hmmmm.
If I was stranded on an Island and could have only one book it would be the mahabarata. If I could only have one piece of the mahabarata I would take the Gita. I love the Gita. It is to me complete in everyway.
Study supports Sadahana. At least for me. I had no guru that I could see with my eyes. As things went I would try to find answers to what was happening through the scriptures. I wouldn’t sometimes find the right answer until much later and not always in scripture. But always at the right time. 
Surya Deva I think it would be beneficial if you could give us updates on your progress and insights when you get where your going. If possible. Like an ongoing diary of sorts? That would be cool. I’d like to read it.
Have you tried asking the BIG GUY for help with your guru? or just some guidance in general? He does know best. It will show up if your serious you know… maybe not how you expect it but it will show up. If your serious… So be one the lookout!!!
[QUOTE=The Scales;33250][B]Pawel[/B]
I don’t think any type of enlightenment results in TOTAL knowledge of the universe. E.g. how from many molecules this table you are using is composed of. Or does it? I’m searching for highly enlightened people to check that. Anyone here had such experience of total knowledge?
[B]I believe that Surya Deva is correct here in his response. No The Scales is not omniscient… lol.[/B]
[/QUOTE]
Its one of the concepts I’m trying to understand. Is “omniscience” to be understood in terms of knowledge - as an ability to construct mental structures corresponding with all universe? Which would include knowledge of number of atoms of the all tables everywhere, knowledge of the relationship between frequency content of sun light and a number of the germs in the lake, knowledge of all bank passwords etc.?
I think there is also another meaning - as a state of awareness of the connection of given level of existence with all reality (e.g. as in case of mental enlightenment when we feel we understand everything). So it wouldn’t mean that I have the access to and ability to generate all possible knowledge that can be constructed, but rather awareness of the correspondence between given level and universe (e.g. sensation that I understand everything in universe, that everything can be explained). Similarly with emotional enlightenment when we feel that "its all about ‘love’ ".
Also, the ability to perceive things is not yet enlightenment. A guy with a telescope can see other stars but it doesn’t make him any more enlightened than a guy without telescope.
I would like to talk with someone with this experience of omniscience. What it exactly means…